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Thread: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

  1. #21

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by vonlichenstein View Post
    i think its something where you tell the audience the message you want, the *&%) with whether they react favourably or not. as long as your work isn't offensive, why not? you're not creating something just so the audience likes it, you're creating it to express yourself/transmit a message.

    IMHO, and this maybe a sweeping statement, if you're creating it just to have the audience respond favourably and not to tell them something, then don't call it art.
    Von, that's kinda like a 'WOAH!' statement.

    We can't please everyone all the time, and no matter what we do in life, someone, somewhere will always find reason to take offense simply because there are different cultures, paradigms and well, all sorts of people.

    CHEERS!

  2. #22

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Dream Merchant View Post
    Von, that's kinda like a 'WOAH!' statement.

    We can't please everyone all the time, and no matter what we do in life, someone, somewhere will always find reason to take offense simply because there are different cultures, paradigms and well, all sorts of people.

    CHEERS!
    good woah or bad woah? haha i understand that SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE is bound to take offense, no matter what the subject matter. i was kind of refering to stuff like pornography, paedophilia, racist images, cruelty to animals etc. hoho if you try to please everyone then we may as well not display our pictures, cause someone is bound to take offense.

    (eh you use so proper english, make me feel a bit chapalang leh, so early in the morning lepak a bit la...)

  3. #23

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by vonlichenstein View Post
    i think its something where you tell the audience the message you want, the *&%) with whether they react favourably or not. as long as your work isn't offensive, why not? you're not creating something just so the audience likes it, you're creating it to express yourself/transmit a message.

    IMHO, and this maybe a sweeping statement, if you're creating it just to have the audience respond favourably and not to tell them something, then don't call it art.
    it depends a lot on the artist well-being, as well as the current social and economic situation.

    during and after the world wars, there are many talented artists who refused to cater to the massses, and most of them die poor. Those who realised that they have to survive, they turned to other form of "commercial arts" ... like painting posters, signboards, etc In the end, they survived but end up probably very bitter and regretful.

    However a few did struggle through, doing arts only that they like, but they must have gone through a lot of financial hardships and sacrifices. One such person is Mr Wu GuanZhong .... who has a unique way of painting, which was not so popular in the past but now his paintings are mostly in the 6, 7 digit category.

    There is no right or wrong about both views ... just don't be too forceful on others.
    always the Light, .... always.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by vonlichenstein View Post
    good woah or bad woah? haha i understand that SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE is bound to take offense, no matter what the subject matter. i was kind of refering to stuff like pornography, paedophilia, racist images, cruelty to animals etc. hoho if you try to please everyone then we may as well not display our pictures, cause someone is bound to take offense.

    (eh you use so proper english, make me feel a bit chapalang leh, so early in the morning lepak a bit la...)
    Neither really, but more of just a 'hold on to your horses' kinda woah.

    I doubt if pornography, pedophilia and beastility would be considered 'art' in mainstream circles. As for racism, politics and religion ... as part of life, they do occur in art. Whether one likes that art or not is a different matter.

    But hor, like a wise man said, I am not an artist nor a culture vulture, so I won't really know about these things.

    You should be speaking with folks who have actually studied the various areas of the arts. PM me if you really want to contact them.
    Last edited by Dream Merchant; 7th August 2008 at 11:54 AM.

  5. #25

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    it depends a lot on the artist well-being, as well as the current social and economic situation.

    during and after the world wars, there are many talented artists who refused to cater to the massses, and most of them die poor. Those who realised that they have to survive, they turned to other form of "commercial arts" ... like painting posters, signboards, etc In the end, they survived but end up probably very bitter and regretful.

    However a few did struggle through, doing arts only that they like, but they must have gone through a lot of financial hardships and sacrifices. One such person is Mr Wu GuanZhong .... who has a unique way of painting, which was not so popular in the past but now his paintings are mostly in the 6, 7 digit category.

    There is no right or wrong about both views ... just don't be too forceful on others.
    haha well i did mention its my own opinion, so i won't force any views on others. i'm too lazy to try to force my view anyway. hmmm thats different, posters, signboards etc are commercial work, here though (i'm refering to what the TS was refering to) i think we're talking about shooting for personal appreciation/enjoyment and to learn.

    BUT, you do make a valid point. It'd take much more than a post in a forum to explore this issue fully, and i'm too lethargic to go any further

  6. #26

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Dream Merchant View Post
    Neither really, but more of just a 'hold on to your horses' kinda woah.

    I doubt if pornography, pedophilia and beastility would be considered 'art' in mainstream circles. As for racism, politics and religion ... as part of life, they do occur in art. Whether one likes that art or not is a different matter.

    But hor, like a wise man said, I am not an artist nor a culture vulture, so I won't really know about these things.

    You should be speaking with folks who have actually studied the various areas of the arts. PM me if you really want to contact them.
    hmmm well neither am i, so i'll shut up now haha kaypoh mode off

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by ortega View Post
    sad to say hor, i don't think i am in a position to say what is art

    but hor, i think that your art, is your expression
    but hor, if you want to be able to sell your art
    some people must learn to like it enough to part with their money

    and if you are not interested to sell it
    then hor, only your opinion matters

    and everyone else can just *&^$#$^*

    hahaha couldn't agree more, if you take the image for others in which they parted their good money for you better learn how to "give and improve" on what others wanted and listen to them.
    If it is for your own hobby and satisfaction than you can be the Gold 95 and hear only the good thing, all other opinion can just $%&*(@.

  8. #28

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis View Post
    hahaha couldn't agree more, if you take the image for others in which they parted their good money for you better learn how to "give and improve" on what others wanted and listen to them.
    If it is for your own hobby and satisfaction than you can be the Gold 95 and hear only the good thing, all other opinion can just $%&*(@.
    lol @ Gold 95

  9. #29

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    so are we talking about general cases or this particular case? you cannot just change the topic as and when suits you, if we are to have a less than frivolous discussion. you are displaying a lack of conviction as to what point you are trying to make. if you have seized on this particular topic to make a point about restraint when it comes to commenting, then it is probably a poor example to drum on. otherwise, maybe you could stop hinting and state out your points clearly instead of grabbing onto random examples.. your points here do not seem to match what is displayed in the particular thread quoted.

    for this particular case - i don't think that there is any lack of restraint shown in the thread, if there is, maybe you can elaborate without pointing fingers. the replies there have been cordial, polite and not too harsh.. literally no room for misunderstanding in fact! i think the comments made there are with good intentions, and frankly, there are some good points mentioned that can help the threadstarter. or are you going to just tar everything over with a broad brush and say that they are absolutely useless comments? i think that is disrespectful of you, to all the people who have commented.. since you feel that their opinion counts for naught.

    for general cases.. then i think my point stands, and there is no need to point to this particular thread you have raised the issue on.. because of the previous paragraph.

    in any case, eq usually goes out of the window when it comes to the internet. just think about it, if this was work-related, and your boss has the habit of commenting on work that is well done according to you, and adds on all sorts of comments as to how it can be better done.. would you send an email to your entire company discussing it?

    "when you look into the abyss, remember that the abyss looks into you."
    I wasnt changing topic, if u actually understand what I asked right from the start. I asked about viewers' opinion about whether we should be giving such detailed comments or suggestions when the thread starter mentioned "sharing".. I hope u are not trying to be defensive here, cos I think your comments were more like asking questions about what circumstances the mentioned TS was in during the shoot, which is a good way to know how the TS derived the results. However, some comments by others were mentioned in a way that, the TS is actually doing a bad job, that one should follow the commenters' way of shooting, and after criticising that much, then say TS's work is marvellous.. U think this way of giving critique is sincere? Give me a break..

    What u mentioned about workplace comments by bosses, I think its different as u need the pay, so might as well take what your bosses say, but here? Who the hell are these people to comment like they are the best? I believe u can say in what way is the picture good or bad, cos you dun even need to be a photographer to know what appeals or not, but to direct the TS how to take the picture, well u better be someone..

    Well i do hope what we behave in the web does not translate into real life, cos that will be really sad, from what i have seen, even in this forum. There should be no excuses about how one behave anywhere.

  10. #30

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Macho-san View Post
    I wasnt changing topic, if u actually understand what I asked right from the start. I asked about viewers' opinion about whether we should be giving such detailed comments or suggestions when the thread starter mentioned "sharing".. I hope u are not trying to be defensive here, cos I think your comments were more like asking questions about what circumstances the mentioned TS was in during the shoot, which is a good way to know how the TS derived the results. However, some comments by others were mentioned in a way that, the TS is actually doing a bad job, that one should follow the commenters' way of shooting, and after criticising that much, then say TS's work is marvellous.. U think this way of giving critique is sincere? Give me a break..

    What u mentioned about workplace comments by bosses, I think its different as u need the pay, so might as well take what your bosses say, but here? Who the hell are these people to comment like they are the best? I believe u can say in what way is the picture good or bad, cos you dun even need to be a photographer to know what appeals or not, but to direct the TS how to take the picture, well u better be someone..

    Well i do hope what we behave in the web does not translate into real life, cos that will be really sad, from what i have seen, even in this forum. There should be no excuses about how one behave anywhere.
    actually i think how we behave in real life is the sad part, but everyone has grown so used to nambypambying and having indirectness, this is where the expectation translates to online. i would rather have a superior tell me what to do, rather than walking me one big round to arrive at his point of view. blunt, sharp, short, that should be the way things work in the name of efficiency. when one learns to disconnect comments on his work from personal feelings, then it will be a better world with less hypocriscy and skullduggery.

    for that particular thread, i tend to limit my comments because i have no idea about the location, the limitations, etc. it is one thing to know the place, have the model and equipment in front of you, and another thing to just postulate. same for landscapes, a subject i am more comfortable with.

    i don't know about others' sincerity, but i think from my own point of view, whether it is x or y or z commenting on my own thread, i usually give them the benefit of the doubt unless there is past history of malice.. or obvious trolling.

    well, it works two ways. you say that these people not your boss, who cares what they think? then in a similar breath they are going to tell you that you are also not their boss, who cares what you think of them? hope you see what i mean.

    in short, comments will be there, this is what clubsnap is for; and as long as some good comes out of it and the bad is filtered out easily.. then i think the practice should be left in.

    why care if you do not care for one's opinion? even if you do not care, i think if they have taken the time to go into detail.. be it nitpicking, be it seemingly pompous behaviour.. i think there is definitely something to brought away from every negative comment. rather than positive. can you tell me what benefit praise brings to a person's work? none. if it is good, it will not be made better by praise. if it is bad, it will not be made worse or better by praise. from a pragmatic point of view, i stand to gain zilch from praise. whereas at least for negative comments there is some new perspective revealed.
    Last edited by night86mare; 7th August 2008 at 05:19 PM.

  11. #31

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Unless TS state "No C&C required" or "I only want to hear praise", we can all comment on the price.

    Not too long ago, there is even an issue that we should not comment on the subject (model).

    If TS want to share but don't want any comments. Post then "lock" the thread.

    As an artist, when I show something, I want to hear what people think of it. I could also be showing my works to display how I percieve an object i.e. showing others how I look at stuff.

  12. #32
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by TheQuestion View Post
    eh i thought u said you leaving kt behind forever?
    what is the purpose of your reply?

  13. #33
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by TheQuestion View Post
    eh i thought u said you leaving kt behind forever?
    He is now speaking with the authority and confidence of a prize winner.

    Kopitiam needs such a voice.

  14. #34
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by TheQuestion View Post
    not telling him to keep his thoughts to himself la. he want to talk he can go ahead. just wondering why he's ranting again when he said he dun wanna post here again.
    strange, u new member and know so much... wats your other nick?
    Logging Off. "You have 2,631 messages stored, of a total 400 allowed." don't PM me.

  15. #35

    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post


    that's true, that's true.. or maybe i could go around pming people and asking them to see my pictures..
    there are people who do that?!?!?!

  16. #36
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by TheQuestion View Post
    just asking him about why he's back posting here since he made such a big deal about leaving kt last time with his own thread. no harm for me to ask right?
    unless you have malicious intent to flame bait him into answering you and start another flame war.

    like now

    i would advise both of you to stop and add each other to your ignore list if you can't get along

  17. #37
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by TheQuestion View Post
    he "quit" when i joined mah. besides new cannot follow happening here meh? even funnier is that you are all answering for him when i asked him a harmless question, let him answer la. not like anyone's on trial here.
    Normally new ones are not allowed to ask questions.

    They only buy Kopi for the old birds here and waving fans for them.

  18. #38
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    Normally new ones are not allowed to ask questions.

    They only buy Kopi for the old birds here and waving fans for them.
    come come i buy u milo bing you bring afghan girl to the meeting
    Opinions are like A-holes. Everyone's got one.

  19. #39
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sharing of picture in Clubsnap

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    Normally new ones are not allowed to ask questions.

    They only buy Kopi for the old birds here and waving fans for them.
    where is my kopi??

    Shoot to Live, Live to Shoot
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