View Poll Results: When somebody posts and often asked question about lenses/cameras what would you do?

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  • Don't bother with the thread. I've seen enough and said enough.

    33 24.26%
  • Help him along. He's probably new or just wants fresh opinions.

    62 45.59%
  • Screw the bugger! He should read up more before asking questions or at least ask in an old thread!

    11 8.09%
  • Screw the fella in Option 3 that screwed the bugger! This is a forum to help right?

    39 28.68%
  • I don't have so much time to do stupid polls like this. (How ironic then! Haha! )

    15 11.03%
  • Others.

    14 10.29%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

  1. #121

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    A fool for me is a person who just brings up questions without thinking, without considering what was already said and written.
    Sounds like every 5 years old kid I know!

  2. #122

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by thengz View Post
    Sounds like every 5 years old kid I know!
    haha, you noe alot of 5yr olds? u kindergarden teacher?

  3. #123

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by adamadam View Post
    Sit back and watch them get told off by Calebk hohoho


    well if itś something they can find on the internet, just heck care them

    if not, then i think itś fair enough to answer

  4. #124

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    To a father you find Q ask by you kids (5 years old and below) can be really funny (or stupid) but you will never scold them for sure because you know they are learning. You try means to answer them even to google on the website. If you start scolding them you shut them out from you and that is what may happen to the newbies here.

    As you kids get older (18 yrs old) you will start ignore or lecture them for asking stupid Q or repeating the same mistakes but at the end of the day you will still go back to them and have a nice talk with them.

    My point is...newbies are like kids to the thing they are learning (maybe ppl think they are stupid because of their age~20+). Need to give them some room and time to learn. It could be the first few Qs they are asking here and you screw them it may scare them off.

    Try to think when you start into photography...do you start asking stupid Q (when 5years down the road, you think that are really stupid of you to ask that) or you really read up and never ask at all. Some ppl dun have a good command of english (like me) so that might not be able to understand what you think is simple.

    Do you ever felt why he have to said that when i am new. The point is 'DUN DO WHAT YOU DUN LIKE OTHERS TO DO TO YOU'!!!

    Of course now we have internet and that makes learning faster and simple compare to years ago and that could be one of the reason we think you should have check it out yourself.

    It is a case to case... where some of ask really asking for it...repeating the same Qs in a row. HAHAHA

    We have to decide if we want to ask that Q or ans that Q. That is not right or wrong but a matter or courtesy and consideration for each others.

    At the end of the day we may regret replying that way when we get to make friend with that person at a photoshot. The 'stupid Q' person may take it to heart (maybe not) but he or she will still remember.

    Just my thought...stupid right!

    Screw me if you want.

  5. #125

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by paesyl View Post
    Screw me if you want.
    No thanks
    It is the camera, not the photographer.
    my flickr - adamloh.com

  6. #126

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Option 4. Some smartas* think they can learn EVERYTHING on the net. Why do we need schools and teachers then? They make the effort and time posting stupid sacarstic picture to mock at the newbie instead of answering their questions.

  7. #127

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    That's where we need to change the whole mindset about education. Education isn't about teaching facts and figures, education is about teaching a kid how to learn. After that the kid goes on in life and applies what he's learnt in school to continue growing his knowledge and skillset.

    Teachers are there to share their experience and to guide us in the right direction. We don't need teachers to give us what we can already find in textbooks or on the internet these days. A teacher who fails to inspire or motivate in my opinion is a failed teacher.

    Do you want to be a teacher or a textbook?
    Which one does the newbie need?
    Canon EOS 66 | Kit Lens | Leung Sheung Wing Chun Singapore

  8. #128

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    i advocate the famous saying:

    give a man fish, he lives for 5 days. teach a man how to fish, and he will live for a lifetime. well, until he overfishes and there are no more fish.

    i think perhaps this is a sore point in singapore - after all our education system attempts to hand out information on a silver platter, and teachers seem to be expected nowadays to literally use a golden spoon to shove the food into the studentś mouth, and make sure that nothing trickles out when they drool.

    but is this really the way we want to go? in todayś context, the internet is literally a wealth of information. i can find literally anything on any subject given the right search parameters, nowadays i do not even need to go to google.com, just the google toolbar, and voila, everything is laid out there.

    like i have said above - if the newbie is given the impression that he will be spoonfed, then you develop a breed of people asking every single question under the sun, from how to turn on their camera to how to switch lens to how to turn it off. compare that to a society where people can find the information themselves with a snap of the finger. which is a preferable scenario? which person is likely to develop a greater passion for whatever they seek to learn about? which person is more independent? i think the answer is very, very clear.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    The issue is never about whether certain questions, no matter how stupid they seem, should be asked or not. It is also not about whether such stupid questions should deserve an answer. To me, it is about the way we response, if we decide to.

    I could never understand how anyone could justify his caustic remarks by reasoning that the questions were stupid in the first place.

  10. #130

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Btw things or answers that you can found on the net doesn't prove that its the truth or the right way. Like I say, why bother to have teachers or school when one thinks he/she can learn everything on net? Might as well give a laptop to every student and tell them to search for any of their doubts/questions thru google.

  11. #131
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    ...i think perhaps this is a sore point in singapore - after all our education system attempts to hand out information on a silver platter, and teachers seem to be expected nowadays to literally use a golden spoon to shove the food into the studentś mouth, and make sure that nothing trickles out when they drool.

    but is this really the way we want to go?....
    What makes you think that isn't the go "we", as a society, want to go? Why do you think the system appears to "work" in such a manner? Is it because the teachers/ministry want it to, or is it because as the "other stakeholder" (damn, I hated it the day they made the public/voters a stakeholder) insists on it?

    The horror is that the students (or a large part of them, at least) think that they are smarter than the system, and therefore should be excluded from its workings. And that "other stakeholder" believes it so too. (Too much erosion of our oriental values?)


    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    ... in todayś context, the internet is literally a wealth of information. i can find literally anything on any subject given the right search parameters, nowadays i do not even need to go to google.com, just the google toolbar, and voila, everything is laid out there.
    ....
    Fine, you can do it, and I'm sure everyone else can, too. But the issue is not whether one can or not, but whether he/she/it has the will to. Put in very impolitic terms - too darn bloody LAZY!

    That is in turn followed by the previous point - too darn yayapapaya (for our non-Singlish CSers : it means head stuck in the clouds)


    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    ... if the newbie is given the impression that he will be spoonfed, then you develop a breed of people asking every single question under the sun, from how to turn on their camera to how to switch lens to how to turn it off. compare that to a society where people can find the information themselves with a snap of the finger. which is a preferable scenario? which person is likely to develop a greater passion for whatever they seek to learn about? which person is more independent? i think the answer is very, very clear....
    On the contrary, the answer most wont even care about.

    "You want to give me or not? Don't want to, fine! Someone else will." This is the attitude prevalent.

    Who cares about passion, gimme the mollah! Screw the passionate idiots!
    (Care to consider how painfully real this is?)

    Let me point toward the CS Galleries as an offshoot illustration. How much more nonsensical images do you see nowadays (read as the last 3 months) versus the same period 1 year, 3 years and 5 years ago? Consider the changed attitudes toward receiving and giving REAL/honest critique as well.

    Personally, I see more groupies giving the good ole for crap snaps and off WB and tilted horizons. Even an outright blown pic is given a plus point. So, to the last para, do you think they care? Nah, I doubt it.

    On a rather amusing note - it has become the case where even erroneous "knowledge" is happily passed around.... it'd be interesting to see the kind of nonsense that may develop from those.

    Meanwhile, I'll just stick to giving my attention to those who show that they deserve it.

  12. #132
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by wakaowalao View Post
    Btw things or answers that you can found on the net doesn't prove that its the truth or the right way.
    If that's the case, then how can anyone be sure that answers or information given on the forums are any better? Its also on the net isn't it?

    Its not about getting the right answers the first time everytime. The process of researching is just as important, if not more important. We are so obsessed with instant gratification, we forget the process of making things happen. Missing out on cultivating an essential skill, the capability to analyse. Though some may say we analyse to death.

  13. #133

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by wakaowalao View Post
    Btw things or answers that you can found on the net doesn't prove that its the truth or the right way. Like I say, why bother to have teachers or school when one thinks he/she can learn everything on net? Might as well give a laptop to every student and tell them to search for any of their doubts/questions thru google.
    thatś like saying that if i tell you that the internet is also a great place to look at good photographs..

    then you will tell me that we don need cameras to take pictures, just use a laptop can already.

    this is utter hogwash and taking my point too literally. i would have different expectations of a 7 year old, i would have different expectations of a 16 year old, and i would have different expectations of a 30 year old.

    frankly, to be honest, if one works hard enough as well, one could probably finish up to a level syllabus, maybe beyond. the current university education i am going through, it involves a lot of self-reading-up and learning. very different from what i have experienced in singapore. i used to be bitter about it, but after a while you realise that you are benefitting from it.
    Last edited by night86mare; 4th June 2008 at 12:18 PM.

  14. #134
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    If that's the case, then how can anyone be sure that answers or information given on the forums are any better? Its also on the net isn't it?
    Precisely the case when you have the wrong "knowledge" being bandied out.

    And the greater the reason for the real learner to think first. But many don't bother. For every starfish you throw back into the ocean, 4/5 of them will probably wash back up the beach to dry and die. However, that one that you make a difference to, that's enough for me.

    So move on, seniors, to your next starfish.

  15. #135

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Azure View Post
    What makes you think that isn't the go "we", as a society, want to go? Why do you think the system appears to "work" in such a manner? Is it because the teachers/ministry want it to, or is it because as the "other stakeholder" (damn, I hated it the day they made the public/voters a stakeholder) insists on it?

    "You want to give me or not? Don't want to, fine! Someone else will." This is the attitude prevalent.

    Meanwhile, I'll just stick to giving my attention to those who show that they deserve it.
    i am not really sure about this, but i think as with any situation it probably takes two hands to clap. that said, i have seen many examples where the described situation in my previous post does get broken.. to be fair. these are rare though.

    i think perhaps it is not just a problem with singapore per se, the owner of the youth hostel i stayed in krakow was talking to me and a friend over breakfast.. she had been organising a programme for some polish kids (sec 1/2 equivalent) and was expressing her exasperation.. about how any suggestion she put up, be it auschiwtz to zakopan (beautiful mountain views) was met with general apathy. i think even having a negative view would perhaps been preferable to her.

    that last line is probably a good policy to take anyways..

  16. #136

    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    If that's the case, then how can anyone be sure that answers or information given on the forums are any better? Its also on the net isn't it?

    Its not about getting the right answers the first time everytime. The process of researching is just as important, if not more important. We are so obsessed with instant gratification, we forget the process of making things happen. Missing out on cultivating an essential skill, the capability to analyse. Though some may say we analyse to death.
    yes, this is a very perceptive statement.

    i have seen many threads where even non-subjective queries are met with erroneous answers. and the best part is, these go uncorrected and the guy who gets the wrong concepts goes on to pass them on.. quoting the previous thread when challenged.

  17. #137
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Azure View Post
    Personally, I see more groupies giving the good ole for crap snaps and off WB and tilted horizons. Even an outright blown pic is given a plus point. So, to the last para, do you think they care? Nah, I doubt it.

    On a rather amusing note - it has become the case where even erroneous "knowledge" is happily passed around.... it'd be interesting to see the kind of nonsense that may develop from those.

    Meanwhile, I'll just stick to giving my attention to those who show that they deserve it.
    Talk about these, think i see more and more macro images in CS, don't undersatnd why should those people buy macro lens when they happily cropping their images?????

    I too started to give up to those newbie or those "think they are pro" newbie a pass. Only comments to those that i felt that they deserve.

  18. #138
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Leong23 View Post
    Talk about these, think i see more and more macro images in CS, don't undersatnd why should those people buy macro lens when they happily cropping their images?????

    I too started to give up to those newbie or those "think they are pro" newbie a pass. Only comments to those that i felt that they deserve.
    I also feel the same way .... sometimes wonder if messy pics is all there in is in some of their minds....

  19. #139
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Leong23 View Post
    don't undersatnd why should those people buy macro lens when they happily cropping their images?????

    I too started to give up to those newbie or those "think they are pro" newbie a pass. Only comments to those that i felt that they deserve.
    Actually, I see nothing wrong with them cropping their images, especially some of the real newbies who do not own a dedicated macro lens. Crop a bit to get a closer view, fine. But it is horrible to see some spout the idea that rubbishy backgrounds are great.

    Then again, it is hard to tell who are the deserving ones. So I'd test water on newcomers, see how they respond. Sometimes, they really come back with better stuff, you know that they've learnt. Then that one is your "starfish".

    Same with my PAs and mentees..... but that'll be ranting.

  20. #140
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: Screw the Newbie/Pointless-Question-Asker

    Quote Originally Posted by Azure View Post
    Actually, I see nothing wrong with them cropping their images, especially some of the real newbies who do not own a dedicated macro lens. Crop a bit to get a closer view, fine. But it is horrible to see some spout the idea that rubbishy backgrounds are great.
    I do cropped some of my images too, limited to <10%, rare record of species can sometime up to 30%.

    What i meant is the concept of heavily cropped, messy background and harsh lighting is now accepted as a pro images. What so difficult just to move in a few inches closer and tilt 1-2 degree to get it parrallel to plane.

    Back to the topic, people just take snap shots, still can teach, people who ask pointless question without thinking and waiting to be spoon-feed, i just pass.

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