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Thread: Different modes and EV Comp

  1. #1

    Question Different modes and EV Comp

    i was wondering wat's the usual doing of you guys. for instance, u're in A-mode. u've set the aperture you wan with ISO400. shutter speed is automatically selected for you. after the shutter button is fired, the shot came out to be underexposed.

    so in this case, (1/8s, F6.3 @ 50mm ISO400, Matrix metering)

    1. do you guys open up the aperture to allow more light in to the sensor? (leaving the ISO n EV)
    2. increase the ISO? (leaving the aperture n EV)
    3. play with EV comp? (leaving the ISO n aperture)
    4. a combination of all?

    how often do you guys change the ISO? assuming the ambient lighting you're shooting at is constant. wat i did during an event last week, i used ISO200 outdoor under the hot sun. den when i shifted into indoors, i increase it to ISO400 n even up to ISO800. for that day i was using a max aperture of F3.5 lens.

    i'm new to this so i was shooting in P-mode with a SB-600. all i did during that day was to play with the EV Comp only. (some shots came out shitty though)

    if you guys were to use P-mode, wat are the usual stuff you guys play with? ISO? EV?
    last but not least, is there any guide to how much to adjust for flash comp? how do i know how much to + or - from the flash output?

    feel free to comment on anything.. ur help will be greatly appreciated!
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

  2. #2

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    3 is the answer.

    As for mastering exposure, it comes with further reading and learning how to 'read' the scene and make adjustments. Auto, P. Matrix all that can only do so much. If you really, really want to learn about light, keep your camera away for a while and borrow a few good books from the library, then start practising in Manual mode only.
    Last edited by Dream Merchant; 4th May 2008 at 05:12 PM.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    3 is the answer.

    Exposure compensation is your friend and your lifesaver. Learn to use it well and it will save you when things become dicey...

    Btw, I never shoot in auto mode. I'm mostly a Av guy but Program should suit you well. Program mode is really Auto mode with more space for manual control. You do not get control of shutter speed and aperture, but you get Program shift so you can change different set of shutter speed and aperture combination. For example, your camera gives you a reading of 1/500 f/16. You can switch that to 1/1000 f/11 or 1/250 f/22 when you want speed (1/1000 f/11) or when you want a wider aperture (1/250 f/22). Exposure compensation is above and beyond this as with Av, Tv or P mode, you are following the meter and just playing with the shutter speed and aperture controls while exposure comp disobeys what the meter thinks it to be.

    Hope it helps.

    Samuel
    f/8 and be there.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    3 is the answer.

    Exposure compensation is your friend and your lifesaver. Learn to use it well and it will save you when things become dicey...

    Btw, I never shoot in auto mode. I'm mostly a Av guy but Program should suit you well. Program mode is really Auto mode with more space for manual control. You do not get control of shutter speed and aperture, but you get Program shift so you can change different set of shutter speed and aperture combination. For example, your camera gives you a reading of 1/500 f/16. You can switch that to 1/1000 f/11 or 1/250 f/22 when you want speed (1/1000 f/11) or when you want a wider aperture (1/250 f/22). Exposure compensation is above and beyond this as with Av, Tv or P mode, you are following the meter and just playing with the shutter speed and aperture controls while exposure comp disobeys what the meter thinks it to be.

    Hope it helps.

    Samuel
    f/8 and be there.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by alternatve View Post
    3 is the answer.

    Exposure compensation is your friend and your lifesaver. Learn to use it well and it will save you when things become dicey...

    Btw, I never shoot in auto mode. I'm mostly a Av guy but Program should suit you well. Program mode is really Auto mode with more space for manual control. You do not get control of shutter speed and aperture, but you get Program shift so you can change different set of shutter speed and aperture combination. For example, your camera gives you a reading of 1/500 f/16. You can switch that to 1/1000 f/11 or 1/250 f/22 when you want speed (1/1000 f/11) or when you want a wider aperture (1/250 f/22). Exposure compensation is above and beyond this as with Av, Tv or P mode, you are following the meter and just playing with the shutter speed and aperture controls while exposure comp disobeys what the meter thinks it to be.

    Hope it helps.

    Samuel
    thanks guys.. finally someone to clear my doubt for me! hahah... i always wanted to use M mode but the prob here for me is that i dun know wat settings to start off with for different ambient conditions. for instance (M mode), if i were to metering out of a window on a sunny afternoon with flash on, i'll get a nice balance of the indoor and outdoor exposure. my settings were (18mm @ 1/30, f/8 ISO 200). the result turned out not bad.

    on the other hand i know if i were to go out to the open with that same setting, the result will be horrible (complete washout)!!! if i wan to use f/8 outdoor under a sunny day, as a guide wat shutter speed should i use? assuming ISO200 & EV 0 is used.
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by fergo View Post
    i was wondering wat's the usual doing of you guys. for instance, u're in A-mode. u've set the aperture you wan with ISO400. shutter speed is automatically selected for you. after the shutter button is fired, the shot came out to be underexposed.

    so in this case, (1/8s, F6.3 @ 50mm ISO400, Matrix metering)

    1. do you guys open up the aperture to allow more light in to the sensor? (leaving the ISO n EV)
    2. increase the ISO? (leaving the aperture n EV)
    3. play with EV comp? (leaving the ISO n aperture)
    4. a combination of all?
    perhaps some have replied too quickly.

    i'd say, it DEPENDS.

    what sort of conditions? what are you shooting?

    if you leave the iso and aperture when shooting sports and extend your shutter speed at 1/8 seconds, and worse still, handhold it, then gone case already.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by fergo View Post
    on the other hand i know if i were to go out to the open with that same setting, the result will be horrible (complete washout)!!! if i wan to use f/8 outdoor under a sunny day, as a guide wat shutter speed should i use? assuming ISO200 & EV 0 is used.
    no magic settings or guides - although i suspect some here would push the sunny 16 rule. as to what it is, you can go google, i think it should not be used at all - better to understand how your camera meters and how the metering works, and how you can employ your camera to get the shots you want.

    you are right, indoor shot less light, so go outdoor, use exact same setting sure overexpose.

    but first - why use f/8?

    second - sunny is relative. some people need a blazing hot sun. some people just need sun, as is common in the uk - sunny here is just "wa, the sky is not all grey today".

    third - it also depends on what kind of scene, and what type of shot. more elaboration, please.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    f8 is just an example for that particular scenerio. i would say i shoot landscape, still life and sometimes events (indoor/outdoor) and also candid shots. wat i understand is that for events and candid, we dun have much time to slowly adjust the settings to get it right as that "moment" will not wait. also for group photos too. cant possibly ask the group to pose n smile while i slowly get the settings right right?

    i'm very lost.. pls help. any good website to recommend so i can go read up more?

    when i go out for shoot (sentosa etc) i'll try to use M mode. but for events, i use P mode and play with the ISO and EV comp as i did last week for some VIP visit.

    wat abt flash comp? i seriously have no idea when to + when to -. i just anyhow hamtum one..
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

  9. #9

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    read my detailed explanation on exposure, iso and aperture here

    link

    alternatively, sulhan's photographic notes in the newbies article and guides section is useful.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    to add on to the link, which will only help you with exposure,

    i) iso is linked to noise. the higher the iso, the more noise you will get.

    ii) aperture setting is linked to depth of field. the larger the f-stop number, the smaller the aperture size, and the more depth of field you will get. shallow depth of field is useful for stuff like portraits, most landscapes dictate a need for large depth of field (hence large f-stop number and small aperture size, from f/8 to f/11). sometimes you will need extreme depth of field, especially with ultra wide angle photographs - this will introduce a loss of image quality (in the region of f/16 to f/22) due to a physics occurence called diffraction. you just need to know that it will happen - as for understanding it, you are a photographer, not a physicist, optional.

    iii) shutter speed is linked to motion. varying this will also dictate what you want to capture. you could capture the same scene with say, iso 100, f/8 and 1/200 seconds, as compared to iso 400, f/1.4, 1/4000 second. what is the difference? the amount of motion in the picture, along with the other effects that the different iso and aperture settings used will bring. sports requires fast shutter speed if you want to freeze motion, droplets of water falling need relatively fast shutter speeds, if you want to blur out water you will need extended shutter speed.

    remembering vaguely what changes each setting brings in relation to the results of your picture, along with what it does to exposure when you adjust it - and achieving a combination of exposure, composition and vision is how you get the photographs you want.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    to add on to the link, which will only help you with exposure,

    i) iso is linked to noise. the higher the iso, the more noise you will get.

    ii) aperture setting is linked to depth of field. the larger the f-stop number, the smaller the aperture size, and the more depth of field you will get. shallow depth of field is useful for stuff like portraits, most landscapes dictate a need for large depth of field (hence large f-stop number and small aperture size, from f/8 to f/11). sometimes you will need extreme depth of field, especially with ultra wide angle photographs - this will introduce a loss of image quality (in the region of f/16 to f/22) due to a physics occurence called diffraction. you just need to know that it will happen - as for understanding it, you are a photographer, not a physicist, optional.

    iii) shutter speed is linked to motion. varying this will also dictate what you want to capture. you could capture the same scene with say, iso 100, f/8 and 1/200 seconds, as compared to iso 400, f/1.4, 1/4000 second. what is the difference? the amount of motion in the picture, along with the other effects that the different iso and aperture settings used will bring. sports requires fast shutter speed if you want to freeze motion, droplets of water falling need relatively fast shutter speeds, if you want to blur out water you will need extended shutter speed.

    remembering vaguely what changes each setting brings in relation to the results of your picture, along with what it does to exposure when you adjust it - and achieving a combination of exposure, composition and vision is how you get the photographs you want.
    thanks for sharing all these. i've already understand wats ISO, shutter speed and aperture is all about. i also roughly know wat aperture to use for wat kind of shots. the only i'm not sure is wat to set for a start at different ambient conditions.

    for instance, i went for night shoot. generally shutter speed is the key player. prob 5-20secs kind of exposure with aperture prob at ard f/8. n now, if i were to go for another shoot the next day in the afternoon, the settings i've used for the night shoot would have given me ridiculous results for the day shoot. so from there, with ISO 200, 20secs f/8 settings, wat would u change to for a shot in the afternoon? assuming i retain ISO value and aperture of f/8. wat shutter speed would u set to for the first shot? u definitely wont leave it at 15secs right?

    or to make it clearer. if i were to hand u my camera in the day and ask u to take a shot of me standing by the beach in the afternoon(a typical sg kind), first, u'll take a look at the settings that were set on my camera. it happens to be ISO 200, 20secs f/8, EV 0. so for u to take the shot of me standing by the beach, wat setting would u change to for a start?
    assuming all is taken in M mode.
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

  12. #12

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by fergo View Post

    or to make it clearer. if i were to hand u my camera in the day and ask u to take a shot of me standing by the beach in the afternoon(a typical sg kind), first, u'll take a look at the settings that were set on my camera. it happens to be ISO 200, 20secs f/8, EV 0. so for u to take the shot of me standing by the beach, wat setting would u change to for a start?
    assuming all is taken in M mode.
    ...alamak, what camera are you using? i fear we have a massive miscommunication.

    is it a dslr? if it is a dslr, then bro, you have a metering function, do you not?

    it will not be 100% accurate, but everything is based on metering - i couldn't tell you what exactly settings to dial into your camera, it is never as simple as that because light is so very subjective. maybe i could give you a rough estimation, but it isn't going to apply in 8 other situations for the situation i am thinking of - and yes, all of them are on the beach - along with "sunny" conditions.

    learning how your camera metering works and its temparement are how you handle this. for my own experience, my k100d tends to underexpose by half a stop or so. hence when i shoot in manual, i put in the iso and aperture i want for that situation, then i shift the shutter speed accordingly until the metering in-cam gives me 0.5.

    if there are tricky lighting situations, then i have to think about how my camera handles it. for example, if most of the area is dark, but i want to expose for the highlights, then i'll deliberately underexpose based on camera metering.

    every camera-lens combination usually gives very consistent metering results. learning and remembering how to expose accordingly based on the metering will become a part of you if you shoot actively, and remember every mistake, and how to avoid it.

    when all else fails, remember that you are using a digital camera with histogram function for most - if you are not sure how to expose, bracket, and go home to see which is the best - an lcd screen on your dslr is never accurate for the most part.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by fergo View Post
    for instance, i went for night shoot. generally shutter speed is the key player. prob 5-20secs kind of exposure with aperture prob at ard f/8. n now, if i were to go for another shoot the next day in the afternoon, the settings i've used for the night shoot would have given me ridiculous results for the day shoot. so from there, with ISO 200, 20secs f/8 settings, wat would u change to for a shot in the afternoon? assuming i retain ISO value and aperture of f/8. wat shutter speed would u set to for the first shot? u definitely wont leave it at 15secs right?
    suppose if you are using P / A mode.. your camera will meter the shutter speed should you dial for f/8 at ISO 200.. and you can dial the exposure compensation accordingly for variety of other combinations..

    suppose if you are using M mode.. then your question is quite impractical coz the night settings have pretty much no relation to the day settings.. and you have to adjust accordingly.. and the ability to second guess the correct exposure (be it day or night) takes lots of experience and practice..

    for a start.. you can use P mode to meter the scene and get an averaged reading.. and play around with the ISO / aperture / shutter from there..

    alternative you try the sunny 16 rule.. which says that on good day with good lighting your shutter should be around 1/ISO when your aperture is f/16..

    cheers..

  14. #14

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    ...alamak, what camera are you using? i fear we have a massive miscommunication.

    is it a dslr? if it is a dslr, then bro, you have a metering function, do you not?

    it will not be 100% accurate, but everything is based on metering - i couldn't tell you what exactly settings to dial into your camera, it is never as simple as that because light is so very subjective. maybe i could give you a rough estimation, but it isn't going to apply in 8 other situations for the situation i am thinking of - and yes, all of them are on the beach - along with "sunny" conditions.

    learning how your camera metering works and its temparement are how you handle this. for my own experience, my k100d tends to underexpose by half a stop or so. hence when i shoot in manual, i put in the iso and aperture i want for that situation, then i shift the shutter speed accordingly until the metering in-cam gives me 0.5.

    if there are tricky lighting situations, then i have to think about how my camera handles it. for example, if most of the area is dark, but i want to expose for the highlights, then i'll deliberately underexpose based on camera metering.

    every camera-lens combination usually gives very consistent metering results. learning and remembering how to expose accordingly based on the metering will become a part of you if you shoot actively, and remember every mistake, and how to avoid it.

    when all else fails, remember that you are using a digital camera with histogram function for most - if you are not sure how to expose, bracket, and go home to see which is the best - an lcd screen on your dslr is never accurate for the most part.
    yes sir.. i'm using a DSLR. the thing here is that i didnt even know that the exposure scale in the viewfinder shows you whether the pic is gonna be over/underexposed in M mode. i just found out yesterday. hahaha.. silly me! now i understand. whereas for Av & Tv mode, the exposure scale in the view finder shows the EV comp value. am i right?
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

  15. #15

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by fergo View Post
    yes sir.. i'm using a DSLR. the thing here is that i didnt even know that the exposure scale in the viewfinder shows you whether the pic is gonna be over/underexposed in M mode. i just found out yesterday. hahaha.. silly me! now i understand. whereas for Av & Tv mode, the exposure scale in the view finder shows the EV comp value. am i right?
    depends on your camera model, i think. can also be changed via settings

    mine can be used to display the number of shots remaining, pretty pointless option there, obviously

    i prefer to call it metering, i.e. if the camera thinks your scene is going to be overexposed by half a stop, then it'll display +0.5. take note of your metering settings too also, some cameras can set this, like meter based on the last 5 seconds, or last 3 seconds, it makes a difference especially when you're trying to capture a moment.

    also, don't trust your metering too much, like i've said before already. it is accurate in that you will always get some details, i.e. nothing like a white or black screen.. but it is also inaccurate.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Different modes and EV Comp

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    i prefer to call it metering, i.e. if the camera thinks your scene is going to be overexposed by half a stop, then it'll display +0.5.
    yup.. thats the one i'm talking abt. not accurate never mind. at least it gives me something to start with.. from there adjust is easier than adjusting from no where.

    anyway.. thanks alot guys. thanks for clearing my doubt. time to go read up more and shoot!!
    What i need is the skill and vision of a pro... not a pro camera!

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