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Thread: Shot which could have been better...

  1. #21

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Yes, location sucks, but expression will change if change location.

    Quote Originally Posted by ahbian View Post
    Why didn't you consider taking the shot at a place with better light conditions then, since the current background is distracts rather than add value?

  2. #22

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by CasualSnaper View Post
    Yes, location sucks, but expression will change if change location.
    My take... just a quick one.. corrected colour, tweaked saturation, tweaked levels, did some compositional cropping, desaturated and blurred the background.

    I think the cropping made the biggest difference. Making other distracting thing in the background blurrer would give the impression that the subjects faces are clearer. Everything is relative. That's why desaturating the background help bring out the subjects even though I reduced the saturation also. The problem is partly aesthetics and partly technical. In the original image, the viewer's attention is drawn more to the green foliage because it's more correctly exposed. What needed to be done is to draw the viewer's attention back to the subject by making use of various techniques like rules of thirds on the guy, giving more forward space for the girl etc.. The space behind the girl in the original picture is somewhat redundant and I took it out.
    Last edited by lsisaxon; 11th March 2008 at 04:56 PM.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    The was a very, very useful link to an article put up on CS a few weeks back by tohcp which might explain why your subjects seem out of focus:

    http://visual-vacations.com/Photogra...pose_sucks.htm

    Since you say you focused on the face of the girl, I suspect that your picture may suffer from focus-recompose issues, especially with the large aperture (f2.8). Do read the article for more details on focus-recompose, because it certainly explains a lot about why pictures which shouldn't be OOF turn out that way.

    Of course, if you focused by pointing straight and selecting a focus point which corresponded to her face, then this shouldn't be an issue and may be indicative of your lens needing calibration.

    As for the exposure problems, I believe many others before me have touched upon the subject.

    Hope this helps!

  4. #24

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    the problems here are more technical than artistic ones.

    thread moved.
    Did you leave a original thread at original place? Look like you got lost.
    Did not see him come back?

  5. #25

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by dw8888 View Post
    Did you leave a original thread at original place? Look like you got lost.
    Did not see him come back?
    HI!! I'M BACK!!! haha!!

    i thought my thread got deleted, and i thought to myself wth... then i signed in and found out i got PM! ha!

  6. #26

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by lsisaxon View Post
    My take... just a quick one.. corrected colour, tweaked saturation, tweaked levels, did some compositional cropping, desaturated and blurred the background.

    I think the cropping made the biggest difference. Making other distracting thing in the background blurrer would give the impression that the subjects faces are clearer. Everything is relative. That's why desaturating the background help bring out the subjects even though I reduced the saturation also. The problem is partly aesthetics and partly technical. In the original image, the viewer's attention is drawn more to the green foliage because it's more correctly exposed. What needed to be done is to draw the viewer's attention back to the subject by making use of various techniques like rules of thirds on the guy, giving more forward space for the girl etc.. The space behind the girl in the original picture is somewhat redundant and I took it out.
    thank you bro for doing that. i think that looks very artistic. the background is b+w, and the subjects are in colour.

    to be honest, that never occurred to me. now i have one more option in the event that i face such scenarios! thanks!

  7. #27

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    what was the metering mode for this scene?
    i believe the metering was evaluative.

    canon 20d got no spot metering... =(

    i think i should have used partial metering right?

  8. #28

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    i think here's a classic example of subjects against a bright background. i.e. you need to ''light up'' the people either by filling in with a flash or overexpose the background to get them in better exposure if you choose not to use a flash.

    anyway, i think you should use spot metering to meter your subjects so that the picture exposes for your subjects instead of the bright background.

    keep your aperture slightly smaller as f2.8 might be giving you too thin a DOF.

    if there's insufficient shutter speed to cancel your hand movement, up the iso.

    if you think the iso is already too high and the picture will get too grainy, use a flash.

    when using a flash, you should still keep a setting that exposes the background reasonably to prevent a ''black hole'' in the background.

    if you have an external flash unit, as this seems to be indoors, try to bounce the light off the ceiling (if it's not too high) or nearby walls to give you a better 3 dimensional lighting

    if you don't have an external flash unit, and thinks your pop-up flash is giving you a harsh light, bring along a translucent piece of paper that can be fixed onto your pop-up flash easily to soften the light.
    if i overexpose the background in order to properly expose the subjects, might the overexposed background spoil the picture as a whole? in the first place, i didn't even know if i had correctly expose the subjects. i really have alot more to learn about photography!

    canon 20d have no spot-metering... =(

    i used f2.8 because i saw that both subjects were equidistant from me. so i thought can use thin DOF and achieve a natural blurring of the background. but it seems like i forgot that the background was brighter than the foreground!!

    i think i will try homemade remedies to diffuse the built-in flash.

    thanks for comments!!

  9. #29

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by CasualSnaper View Post
    it is obvious the metering is on the background.

    the lighting on the background and foreground are many stops apart.

    the background is properly exposed, but the foreground is not.

    the only way to hold detail for both backgound and foreground is to match(increase) the lighting of the foreground to the background.

    in this photo, the background is not important (messy). you should take the metering(manual mode) for the subjects only and let the background be dark.

    "dw8888: i used manual mode. i used the built in exposure meter as a gauge. was that a bad call?"

    the metering in manual and non-manual mode is different.

    using manual mode is a bad call for you, not me. however, you will learn more with manual mode(control).

    focusing is another problem. but exposure is so much worse.

    always notice difference in light level.
    how is the metering in manual and non-manual mode different? am i right to say that metering is evaluated by the camera when i "half-press" the shutter?

    and am i right to say that not only was the exposure bad, the focusing was wayyyyyy off too?

    thanks for your comments!!

  10. #30

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    use flash next time,

    this is a classical die die must shoot with available light with lens wide open, but don't know when is the right situation scenario.

    best camera and lens will not help you with this, learn more about the basic photography, if you want to shoot with available light only.
    ya! that was exactly what i wanted to do!! i die die wanted to shoot with available light with lens wide open!! but guess i didn't know when is the right situation... but.. when is the right situation then?

    can help me with that question please?

  11. #31

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by ahbian View Post
    Hand shake varies from person to person, 32mm at 1/50s can be manageable for most.

    Maybe I add something here that isn't really technical.
    From your posts, I gather that
    1) You do not wish for ISO to be too high
    2) You are afraid that flash will ruined the shot,
    Why didn't you consider taking the shot at a place with better light conditions then, since the current background is distracts rather than add value?

    it was a very impromptu shot. i had 10 seconds from the time i got their attention till the time they posed. so i set my settings on manual mode to suit the metering of the camera.

    yes choice of background is very important. i just learnt that. thanks!

  12. #32

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    it is not about what mode to use, is about your understanding of the "what is exposure" and "how is metering work."
    hello catchlights!

    how does metering work?

  13. #33

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by scrappy View Post
    The was a very, very useful link to an article put up on CS a few weeks back by tohcp which might explain why your subjects seem out of focus:

    http://visual-vacations.com/Photogra...pose_sucks.htm

    Since you say you focused on the face of the girl, I suspect that your picture may suffer from focus-recompose issues, especially with the large aperture (f2.8). Do read the article for more details on focus-recompose, because it certainly explains a lot about why pictures which shouldn't be OOF turn out that way.

    Of course, if you focused by pointing straight and selecting a focus point which corresponded to her face, then this shouldn't be an issue and may be indicative of your lens needing calibration.

    As for the exposure problems, I believe many others before me have touched upon the subject.

    Hope this helps!
    hey i think focus recompose was a problem! this is really really helpful!! thanks!! next time i'll choose my own focusing point instead!! i sure hope my lens dun need recalibration. only 2 days old when that picture was taken!!

  14. #34

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Read your camera manual

    Quote Originally Posted by aErOpLaNe View Post
    how is the metering in manual and non-manual mode different? am i right to say that metering is evaluated by the camera when i "half-press" the shutter?

    and am i right to say that not only was the exposure bad, the focusing was wayyyyyy off too?

    thanks for your comments!!

  15. #35

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by aErOpLaNe View Post
    it was a very impromptu shot. i had 10 seconds from the time i got their attention till the time they posed. so i set my settings on manual mode to suit the metering of the camera.

    yes choice of background is very important. i just learnt that. thanks!
    And your framing too.. The initial framing wasn't tight enough and does not draw attention to the subjects. The one I reframed for you in the earlier posting, even if I had not dropped the saturation for the background, would have drawn more attention to the subjects.

    Here's an example to show that the composition is more important. Nothing much done except cropping and adjusted the colour and levels a little.
    Last edited by lsisaxon; 14th March 2008 at 11:45 AM.

  16. #36

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by lsisaxon View Post
    And your framing too.. The initial framing wasn't tight enough and does not draw attention to the subjects. The one I reframed for you in the earlier posting, even if I had not dropped the saturation for the background, would have drawn more attention to the subjects.

    Here's an example to show that the composition is more important. Nothing much done except cropping and adjusted the colour and levels a little.
    .....!

    that's pure magic! thanks!! i better learn to use photoshop...

  17. #37

    Default Re: Shot which could have been better...

    Quote Originally Posted by aErOpLaNe View Post
    .....!

    that's pure magic! thanks!! i better learn to use photoshop...
    Just need to watch your composition. You can practice by using your fingers to frame everyday scenes when you don't have your camera around. Everyday scenes can look quite different if you put a frame around them.

    People may think you're wierd but tell them you're practising photography.

    Last edited by lsisaxon; 17th March 2008 at 02:56 PM.

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