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Thread: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

  1. #121
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    .....just to clarify, i am straight hor.
    As straight as Edison?

  2. #122

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by mattlock View Post
    How have I addressed the issue in general.The issue is irrelevant in the first place for this thread specifically because the whole basis of your thread is done with intent to soothe your damaged ego.

    I don't have issues with irreverence and informal chat. I just think that kopitiam has brought up some interesting topics and discussion in the past.

    I'm not interested in attacking you, I just feel that you seem to be very involved in CS so why not try to raise the quality of discussion here.
    even if you meant this thread to seriously address the issue you raised you managed to OT your own thread within the first page.
    this is kopitiam

    you must remember that the dynamics of kopitiam is different, you being an old member here you should know that people will ot here

    if i had ignored all serious discussion and posts directed to the issue at hand, and only entertained ot i would certainly be ashamed of myself. but you can't blame me for entertaining both sides of the coin, could you?

    to be honest, my ego has not been damaged, the bulk of whatever has been taking place in the thread with regards to serious discussion is with regards, honestly, to the perceived inanity (note, i use perceived) of questions in recent times and past times as well.. along with the well, commonplace complaint that clubsnap seems to be a festering ground of newcomers who want to be spoonfed. some have also brought up the sugar-coating syndrome here in cs.

    i am actually more than happy to find out everyone's views on what warrants an inane question. i am also certain that you would not deny that the question quoted in the mentioned thread could be perceived as inane - perhaps some could see it as a valid question, and from response here, some don't. so in all fairness perhaps i was wrong in enforcing my strong views on standards and enquiry so quickly and should have bothered to sound it out cordially with the threadstarter (sapphy). if you had bothered to follow it to the end - i mentioend that i have apologised to him in a pm, although i still expressed the view that it was not a very thoughtful question. so whether you think it fit or not, i think i have been pretty fair and am not starting this topic just to find out how many people are on my side. the only reason why i quoted this thread is so that it would not appear as if i have nothing better to do than to dream up problems with cs community.

    moving on - in MY view, as mentioned earlier, what should be done to threads where you think you should say something, but you really don't think what you have to say is going to add on to anything that everyone knows already. take for example the earlier nose oil on lcd thread before.. i'm curious as to whether anyone actually thinks that there would be any valid solution that could resolve either nose oil, nose pressing on lcd when taking, etc with current design of dslr. in some sense maybe i might have used the wrong phrase - a rhetorical question might have been what i meant instead.

    on the other matters, i think the discusisons have more or less run its course - i am more or less resigned to the fact that as one of the more experienced members has told me a long time ago - cs is a mixed community. psychobiologist brought it up again here actually. sugarcoating is here to stay no matter what.. and truthfully, nothing can really be done about it, can it?

  3. #123

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    As straight as Edison?


    i got better things to do

    than to sit around and compare leh

  4. #124
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    this is kopitiam

    you must remember that the dynamics of kopitiam is different, you being an old member here you should know that people will ot here

    if i had ignored all serious discussion and posts directed to the issue at hand, and only entertained ot i would certainly be ashamed of myself. but you can't blame me for entertaining both sides of the coin, could you?

    to be honest, my ego has not been damaged, the bulk of whatever has been taking place in the thread with regards to serious discussion is with regards, honestly, to the perceived inanity (note, i use perceived) of questions in recent times and past times as well.. along with the well, commonplace complaint that clubsnap seems to be a festering ground of newcomers who want to be spoonfed. some have also brought up the sugar-coating syndrome here in cs.

    i am actually more than happy to find out everyone's views on what warrants an inane question. i am also certain that you would not deny that the question quoted in the mentioned thread could be perceived as inane - perhaps some could see it as a valid question, and from response here, some don't. so in all fairness perhaps i was wrong in enforcing my strong views on standards and enquiry so quickly and should have bothered to sound it out cordially with the threadstarter (sapphy). if you had bothered to follow it to the end - i mentioend that i have apologised to him in a pm, although i still expressed the view that it was not a very thoughtful question. so whether you think it fit or not, i think i have been pretty fair and am not starting this topic just to find out how many people are on my side. the only reason why i quoted this thread is so that it would not appear as if i have nothing better to do than to dream up problems with cs community.

    moving on - in MY view, as mentioned earlier, what should be done to threads where you think you should say something, but you really don't think what you have to say is going to add on to anything that everyone knows already. take for example the earlier nose oil on lcd thread before.. i'm curious as to whether anyone actually thinks that there would be any valid solution that could resolve either nose oil, nose pressing on lcd when taking, etc with current design of dslr. in some sense maybe i might have used the wrong phrase - a rhetorical question might have been what i meant instead.

    on the other matters, i think the discusisons have more or less run its course - i am more or less resigned to the fact that as one of the more experienced members has told me a long time ago - cs is a mixed community. psychobiologist brought it up again here actually. sugarcoating is here to stay no matter what.. and truthfully, nothing can really be done about it, can it?
    Time to give this a rest mate.

    Mattlock rarely speaks.

    When he speaks, we usually sit up and listen.

  5. #125

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    Time to give this a rest mate.

    Mattlock rarely speaks.

    When he speaks, we usually sit up and listen.
    even if he is asking questions?

  6. #126
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    please hand out donuts here.

    on personal reflection due to great photographers speaking on my poor character, i have tried to be helpful and maybe my english is horrible, no one understands or lubs me.
    That thread is seriously entertaining. So, over or under? Cannot make up your mind?

  7. #127

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    this is kopitiam

    you must remember that the dynamics of kopitiam is different, you being an old member here you should know that people will ot here

    if i had ignored all serious discussion and posts directed to the issue at hand, and only entertained ot i would certainly be ashamed of myself. but you can't blame me for entertaining both sides of the coin, could you?

    to be honest, my ego has not been damaged, the bulk of whatever has been taking place in the thread with regards to serious discussion is with regards, honestly, to the perceived inanity (note, i use perceived) of questions in recent times and past times as well.. along with the well, commonplace complaint that clubsnap seems to be a festering ground of newcomers who want to be spoonfed. some have also brought up the sugar-coating syndrome here in cs.

    i am actually more than happy to find out everyone's views on what warrants an inane question. i am also certain that you would not deny that the question quoted in the mentioned thread could be perceived as inane - perhaps some could see it as a valid question, and from response here, some don't. so in all fairness perhaps i was wrong in enforcing my strong views on standards and enquiry so quickly and should have bothered to sound it out cordially with the threadstarter (sapphy). if you had bothered to follow it to the end - i mentioend that i have apologised to him in a pm, although i still expressed the view that it was not a very thoughtful question. so whether you think it fit or not, i think i have been pretty fair and am not starting this topic just to find out how many people are on my side. the only reason why i quoted this thread is so that it would not appear as if i have nothing better to do than to dream up problems with cs community.

    moving on - in MY view, as mentioned earlier, what should be done to threads where you think you should say something, but you really don't think what you have to say is going to add on to anything that everyone knows already. take for example the earlier nose oil on lcd thread before.. i'm curious as to whether anyone actually thinks that there would be any valid solution that could resolve either nose oil, nose pressing on lcd when taking, etc with current design of dslr. in some sense maybe i might have used the wrong phrase - a rhetorical question might have been what i meant instead.

    on the other matters, i think the discusisons have more or less run its course - i am more or less resigned to the fact that as one of the more experienced members has told me a long time ago - cs is a mixed community. psychobiologist brought it up again here actually. sugarcoating is here to stay no matter what.. and truthfully, nothing can really be done about it, can it?
    Have you considered that with each OT you make you make everyone less interested in reading the thread as we have to sift through all the OT to read each person's point.

    this is not exactly relating to forums but I found this point to make sense:

    -----------

    *taken from http://www.lkozma.net/idea.php?dea=16

    When one tries to scale such a recommendation system, several problems arise:

    - As the community grows, the quality of the average opinion declines. This doesn't necessarily imply that most people are stupid. As users see their opinions having smaller and smaller effect, they spend less effort in making educated decisions and taking part in quality discussion.

    ----------------

    I think it would be really good if you could make your points as concisely and clearly in as few posts as possible (I don't know how excessive OTing is useful for other viewers)
    How about less OT and more focused, quality discussion? I think it will be of benefit to everyone.

    This is just my opinion on what would help make the transfer of information on a forum board like this more efficient.

    Hopefully you'll consider it :smile:
    Last edited by mattlock; 1st March 2008 at 10:31 AM.

  8. #128
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by calebk View Post
    That thread is seriously entertaining. So, over or under? Cannot make up your mind?
    it's not over and not under.

    It's medium-rare and well-done.

  9. #129
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    talking about quality discussion, if you guys really want to help, save your energy here and use it on critique corner. after so much yakking, i wonder how many who posted here actually used your photography knowledge to help those in critique corner. there is a substantial number of newbies using that section, and i believe they can learn alot from some of you here.
    Last edited by eikin; 1st March 2008 at 11:03 AM.

  10. #130

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    it's not over and not under.

    It's medium-rare and well-done.
    Oh my goodnes..
    Canon 40D, 10-22, 35, 70-200
    http://theserialhobbyist.multiply.com

  11. #131

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    When a person ask a general qn, it doesnt mean tt the person didnt do any research at all ad not at all interested. If the person isnt interested in photography, why in the first place does he post that qn in the first place anyway? Nver mind.

    I just feel that clubsnap is more for pple who are already great at photography and not a good platform for newbies because when they ask a "stupid" qn, there will bound to have someone to bombard that "stupid" qn in a sacarstic tone. If you really wanna help, pls be at least try to be polite, and if u think tt qn is real really stupid, you can look away. I dun mind truthful comments. Thanks

  12. #132
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by chikubang View Post
    When a person ask a general qn, it doesnt mean tt the person didnt do any research at all ad not at all interested. If the person isnt interested in photography, why in the first place does he post that qn in the first place anyway? Nver mind.

    I just feel that clubsnap is more for pple who are already great at photography and not a good platform for newbies because when they ask a "stupid" qn, there will bound to have someone to bombard that "stupid" qn in a sacarstic tone. If you really wanna help, pls be at least try to be polite, and if u think tt qn is real really stupid, you can look away. I dun mind truthful comments. Thanks
    No no no...you're wrong, CS is a great place for newbies, free donuts is always avaliable for them.

    btw, nice comments, love your description, hope to see more posting from you.

  13. #133

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Thanks, i sense ur sarcasm.... What i mean is i dun mind heart breaking or bad bad comments from the experts...But to get mockerings all the time when you are trying to learn sth, kind of disheartened me. I dunnoe but everybody is newbie once and newbies tend to ask some silly qns... Some times when newbies post pics, they hardly get any comments mainly because they were lousy. This is somwthing that u cant learn from books, like asking the books if your pics are ok?

  14. #134
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by chikubang View Post
    Thanks, i sense ur sarcasm.... What i mean is i dun mind heart breaking or bad bad comments from the experts...But to get mockerings all the time when you are trying to learn sth, kind of disheartened me. I dunnoe but everybody is newbie once and newbies tend to ask some silly qns... Some times when newbies post pics, they hardly get any comments mainly because they were lousy. This is somwthing that u cant learn from books, like asking the books if your pics are ok?
    To be very frank, i very seldom comments on any of the photo in the forum even it is bad. Try to give comments and feedback to some posting, but end up look stupid of myself as the whole world is giving good comments on a lousy photo.

    Giving truth comments here but end up become a bad/evil/proud person. Many of the time, it is the poster can't take truth comments. I very active in other forum and don't meant teaching people on-line, it's because the culture there is different.

    To be frank, go and take a course and form a buddy group, it will help a lot.

  15. #135
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by chikubang View Post
    Thanks, i sense ur sarcasm.... What i mean is i dun mind heart breaking or bad bad comments from the experts...But to get mockerings all the time when you are trying to learn sth, kind of disheartened me. I dunnoe but everybody is newbie once and newbies tend to ask some silly qns... Some times when newbies post pics, they hardly get any comments mainly because they were lousy. This is somwthing that u cant learn from books, like asking the books if your pics are ok?
    Question like shutter speed, aperture and exposure is not silly question.

    Shooting with left or right eyes, LCD get dirty because of oily nose and etc.........you tell me what kind of question is it.
    Last edited by Leong23; 1st March 2008 at 08:30 PM.

  16. #136

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    ok thanks.. May you intro me to ur other forums..? Lol, i think i will learn more if someone could critique me be it good or bad... And I agreed on the part where they ask some qns that are totally out of the scope of photography. lol...

  17. #137

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    Quote Originally Posted by psychobiologist View Post
    my opinion is that why not leave it as a sugar coated donut society after all everyone's looking forward to their works being appreciated etc, it probably fulfils some basic need etc.

    everyone's in this photography thingey for something anyway, whilst a small percentage is in it for the business aspect, the rest are just hobbyists, taking pictures of things that would never ever been published, sold, whatsoever. give credit where credit's due. life's much better that way.

    its tiring in life just to be uptight abt everything here and there. you should have seen my participation in mostly in the nikon subforum, repeating answers to people whenever i happen to see anything i know of. others may call me a spoon feeder, a nanny and what not, but the bottomline is that, whether the person with the question has ultimately found the answer that he/she needs is more important

    if one has met up with several different forummers from time to time, be it in buy/sell, or be it to give camera lessons etc, one will realize that clubsnap is made up of a diverse group of people of all ages and all walks of life. some are slightly literate, some are nearing their mid forties to early fifties, some are business owners, others are retirees. we cannot expect the participants in this forum to be uniform, i.e. dynamic, energetic, young, quick thinking etc, and that they would know where to find the answers they need by searching or looking into the correct subforum.

    its time for everyone to have a little bit of humility in them as and when possible. this guy/lady i'm flaming on a forum might be twice my age and what not.


    you are young, capable and schooling overseas, to return some day to be one of the leaders in singapore. whilst we hone our rationalism, perspectives, beliefs and values over the years, one musnt lose touch with society, be it the upper tier, or the lower tiers, society is never uniform. the needs of the lower tiers might be different from that of the higher up elites. a little patience helps too.
    A true gentleman who accords DIGNITY to human regardless of status and giving respect and earning LOTS in return. I believe in honesty but not lacking diplomacy to encourage people to learn. If replies invoked negative emotions, hurtful especially on personel level should be avoided. But then this is Singapore, the one conern our government has, citizens lacking kindness and human touch !

  18. #138
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    be civil gentlemen

    or take it offline

  19. #139

    Default Re: how far should a "newbie" tag allow one to get away with?

    maybe i should lock this thread, it doesn't seem to be achieving what i hoped to achieve with it.

    if the mod sees fit and does not think that any good or further good will come of it, you may lock it with my blessings

    in any case, it will be there anyways, at least for a while.. what i see now are people carrying out personal vendettas and massaging their virtual egos.. which does absolutely nothing to help the situation, or clubsnap. cheers.
    Last edited by night86mare; 1st March 2008 at 07:04 PM.

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