View Poll Results: What is your stand on reserving seats using Tissue/belonging in the Food Court etc.

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  • Yes, I am OK with it.

    76 26.48%
  • No, I do not agree on the pratice

    211 73.52%
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Thread: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

  1. #41
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Get the cleaner to clear the packets of tissues, especially when the packets are half-filled/opened

    Or collect 4 unopened packets and sell them at $1
    Last edited by Randius; 23rd January 2008 at 05:41 PM.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member Canew's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by DiGdUb View Post
    this does not happen just in the cbd area. last night i was having dinner at a hdb central coffeeshop, a table was 'chopped' with tissues.
    Ya, seems that this practice is creeping into the heartlands.

  3. #43
    vince123123
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Wah cool sia, no need to buy tissue paper anymore - so many free ones to collect!

  4. #44
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    Wah cool sia, no need to buy tissue paper anymore - so many free ones to collect!
    Sekali later we see ppl use hp, laptop, gold chain, diamond ring to reserve seats

  5. #45
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    Wah cool sia, no need to buy tissue paper anymore - so many free ones to collect!
    Sekali later we see ppl use hp, laptop, gold chain, diamond ring to reserve seats

  6. #46
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    -double post-

  7. #47

    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    * GASP *

    You mean the packets of tissues was to reserve seats?

    I thought it was part of the food centre's generous gesture to give every seat a free pack of tissues.



  8. #48
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    * GASP *

    You mean the packets of tissues was to reserve seats?

    I thought it was part of the food centre's generous gesture to give every seat a free pack of tissues.
    I consider it littering.

  9. #49
    vince123123
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    They wont, cos they fully expect their item to get taken, thats why they use a low value item. So I feel nothing whatsoever in taking it since after all, they were prepared to lose it

    Quote Originally Posted by redstone View Post
    Sekali later we see ppl use hp, laptop, gold chain, diamond ring to reserve seats

  10. #50
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    * GASP *

    You mean the packets of tissues was to reserve seats?

    I thought it was part of the food centre's generous gesture to give every seat a free pack of tissues.
    The other day we saw a pack of sanitary towel on the seat of an empty table in Funan Food Court.

    Everybody was avoiding sitting on that table.

    Must be a VIP Reserved Table.

  11. #51
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Too many variables in an actual incident.
    The surrounding environment, people involved, their mood, etc, matters.

    For example, if an elderly 70+years lady left the tissue for the purpose of reserving the seat, I would not just chuck it aside and take the seat to eat my food. These are basic Asian values and civilities.

    I do not know if the expat would still insist on his right to the seat in this case. If he would, then Singapore is better off without him, whatever "foreign talent" he may have.

    Or if the tissue seat reserver turns out to be a beautiful young girl who is not rude but just following usual practice, then guys may just shrug and give way.

    Reserving seats with items is a small thing.
    Yet it can escalate to violence if both parties don't back down.
    In extreme cases, between two violent guys who feel their "face" has been attacked, it can lead to fatal stabbings.

  12. #52

    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by longkangman View Post
    I will just dump the tissue and let pple take over the seat.
    This sounds like a good act... maybe all of us should do that
    Canon 30D, G11, 50 f1.8II, 10-22 f3.5-4.5, 24-70 f2.8L, 70-200 f2.8L IS, EX580II

  13. #53
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Theft:"A person is guilty of theft, if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it"

    Singapore Penal Code Cap 224, Sec 378
    Theft
    "Whoever, intending to take dishonestly any movable property out of the possession of any person without that person’s consent, moves that property in order to such taking, is said to commit theft."

    Sec 379
    Punishment for theft.
    "Whoever commits theft shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 3 years, or with fine, or with both."

    Don't fall into the trap where someone can prove the tissue belongs to them.
    “How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.” - Adolf Hitler

  14. #54
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by yanyewkay View Post
    Theft:"A person is guilty of theft, if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it"

    Singapore Penal Code Cap 224, Sec 378
    Theft
    "Whoever, intending to take dishonestly any movable property out of the possession of any person without that person’s consent, moves that property in order to such taking, is said to commit theft."

    Sec 379
    Punishment for theft.
    "Whoever commits theft shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 3 years, or with fine, or with both."

    Don't fall into the trap where someone can prove the tissue belongs to them.
    Especially there is a stain on the tissue paper. They can prove it by a DNA test.

  15. #55
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex View Post
    Too many variables in an actual incident.
    The surrounding environment, people involved, their mood, etc, matters.

    For example, if an elderly 70+years lady left the tissue for the purpose of reserving the seat, I would not just chuck it aside and take the seat to eat my food. These are basic Asian values and civilities.

    I do not know if the expat would still insist on his right to the seat in this case. If he would, then Singapore is better off without him, whatever "foreign talent" he may have.

    Or if the tissue seat reserver turns out to be a beautiful young girl who is not rude but just following usual practice, then guys may just shrug and give way.

    Reserving seats with items is a small thing.
    Yet it can escalate to violence if both parties don't back down.
    In extreme cases, between two violent guys who feel their "face" has been attacked, it can lead to fatal stabbings.
    What if the on who left the tissue is an ugly fat uncle (not his fault being ugly, probably his own doing being fat)? will you still be symphatetic to him practicing the tissue chop?

  16. #56
    vince123123
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    In this case, criminal misappropriation would be a better provision to cite than theft. Trying to make out liability under theft would be fraught with the following difficulties:

    1. Proving that the tissue paper is "in the possession" of that first person. When leaving tissue paper lying around, is it still considered "in the possession"? Here, I note that the key element is "possession" and not "belonging" since "belonging" is not used in Section 378.

    2. Permanent deprivation - this can easily be circumvented by merely moving the tissue packet onto the floor, or onto the table or somewhere except actually taking away. There will hence be no permanent deprivation.

    3. Even if someone removes it permanently, there is the practical difficulty of locating that person or acting fast enough to stop the person from leaving. For most ordinary folks who take the tissue and eat, they can easily leave the tissue behind, thereby again falling out of the requirement of "permanent deprivation".

    I do note that the words "permanently depriving" is not in the actual Section 378, and points (2) and (3) are based on the first sentence, although I don't know where it is gotten from.

    Quote Originally Posted by yanyewkay View Post
    Theft:"A person is guilty of theft, if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it"

    Singapore Penal Code Cap 224, Sec 378
    Theft
    "Whoever, intending to take dishonestly any movable property out of the possession of any person without that person’s consent, moves that property in order to such taking, is said to commit theft."

    Sec 379
    Punishment for theft.
    "Whoever commits theft shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to 3 years, or with fine, or with both."

    Don't fall into the trap where someone can prove the tissue belongs to them.
    Last edited by vince123123; 24th January 2008 at 11:24 AM.

  17. #57
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    In this case, criminal misappropriation would be a better provision to cite than theft. Trying to make out liability under theft would be fraught with the following difficulties:

    1. Proving that the tissue paper is "in the possession" of that first person. When leaving tissue paper lying around, is it still considered "in the possession"? Here, I note that the key element is "possession" and not "belonging" since "belonging" is not used in Section 378.

    2. Permanent deprivation - this can easily be circumvented by merely moving the tissue packet onto the floor, or onto the table or somewhere except actually taking away. There will hence be no permanent deprivation.

    3. Even if someone removes it permanently, there is the practical difficulty of locating that person or acting fast enough to stop the person from leaving. For most ordinary folks who take the tissue and eat, they can easily leave the tissue behind, thereby again falling out of the requirement of "permanent deprivation".

    I do note that the words "permanently depriving" is not in the actual Section 378, and points (2) and (3) are based on the first sentence, although I don't know where it is gotten from.
    Speak english. This is too cheem. Any lawyers around here to discipher this for me?

    Anyways while everyone is saying they should do this, they should do that. Did anyone here actually thought of telling the people with this practice to stop?

  18. #58
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    In this case, criminal misappropriation would be a better provision to cite than theft. Trying to make out liability under theft would be fraught with the following difficulties:

    1. Proving that the tissue paper is "in the possession" of that first person. When leaving tissue paper lying around, is it still considered "in the possession"? Here, I note that the key element is "possession" and not "belonging" since "belonging" is not used in Section 378.

    2. Permanent deprivation - this can easily be circumvented by merely moving the tissue packet onto the floor, or onto the table or somewhere except actually taking away. There will hence be no permanent deprivation.

    3. Even if someone removes it permanently, there is the practical difficulty of locating that person or acting fast enough to stop the person from leaving. For most ordinary folks who take the tissue and eat, they can easily leave the tissue behind, thereby again falling out of the requirement of "permanent deprivation".

    I do note that the words "permanently depriving" is not in the actual Section 378, and points (2) and (3) are based on the first sentence, although I don't know where it is gotten from.
    Does it mean that if I leave my wallet to chope seat people can take it without being considered as theft?

  19. #59
    vince123123
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    I think it would be debatable whether it is theft, but it has a much higher chance of falling under criminal misappropriation, which is also a criminal offence.

    In practical terms, the prosecutor (if any) will probably just frame two alternative charges and hope one sticks. Not entirely sure about this.

    Quote Originally Posted by JillValentine View Post
    Does it mean that if I leave my wallet to chope seat people can take it without being considered as theft?

  20. #60
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    Default Re: What is your stand on reserving seats using using Tissue in the Food Court etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by aryanto View Post
    What if the on who left the tissue is an ugly fat uncle (not his fault being ugly, probably his own doing being fat)? will you still be symphatetic to him practicing the tissue chop?

    I was chatting with an ugly fat uncle this afternoon and he was having a beer. Should be no problem.

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