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Thread: How to use a close-up filter??

  1. #1

    Default How to use a close-up filter??

    I have a macro lens kit for my Canon S5 IS.

    The macro lens is much like a magnifying glass.

    I got no idea on how to use it or focus it? Any guides or library books on this??

    Macro shooting with Macro lens.
    Last edited by soons; 6th January 2008 at 10:54 AM. Reason: Title sah-lah!

  2. #2
    Senior Member zac08's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Well, you'd get a much closer focusing distance than without.

    So what you need to do is to practise with different subjects and learn how close you can focus to.
    Michael Lim
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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by soons View Post
    I have a macro lens kit for my Canon S5 IS.

    The macro lens is much like a magnifying glass.

    I got no idea on how to use it or focus it? Any guides or library books on this??

    Macro shooting with Macro lens.
    thats a close-up filter (technically termed)

    a macro lens is a lens on SLR/DSLR/exchangable lens system, that allow you to focus closer often, 1:1 or 1:2 in some higher end ones, 2x-3x.

    Ratio is determined by actually comparing the negative with actual size, hence like 1:1, its you put a shot taken 1:1 with a macro lens on a film body, then you see the film = actual size.

    Yours is a close-up filter, often its labelled +1,+2,+4. You have to check your model.

    Difference between a macro lens and a close up filter is that the macro lens still can focus to infinity (full range of focusing distance). but if you put a close up lens on the front of any other lenses, it will not do infinity focus, and the focusing will be harder, as you need to move closer to get focus.

    Simple newbie assignment, take a coin, preferably a 10cent coin, put on the table, take your S5 IS, put on the filter, use the longest (tele) portion of the lens, then select manual focus, use the minimum focusing distance. then move the camera from nearest to the coin to furthest. and slowly see the coin goes from blur to sharp and then blur, that will tell u where is the focusing distance to get the optimum result.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by Del_CtrlnoAlt View Post
    thats a close-up filter (technically termed)

    a macro lens is a lens on SLR/DSLR/exchangable lens system, that allow you to focus closer often, 1:1 or 1:2 in some higher end ones, 2x-3x.

    Ratio is determined by actually comparing the negative with actual size, hence like 1:1, its you put a shot taken 1:1 with a macro lens on a film body, then you see the film = actual size.

    Yours is a close-up filter, often its labelled +1,+2,+4. You have to check your model.

    Difference between a macro lens and a close up filter is that the macro lens still can focus to infinity (full range of focusing distance). but if you put a close up lens on the front of any other lenses, it will not do infinity focus, and the focusing will be harder, as you need to move closer to get focus.

    Simple newbie assignment, take a coin, preferably a 10cent coin, put on the table, take your S5 IS, put on the filter, use the longest (tele) portion of the lens, then select manual focus, use the minimum focusing distance. then move the camera from nearest to the coin to furthest. and slowly see the coin goes from blur to sharp and then blur, that will tell u where is the focusing distance to get the optimum result.
    Hey Del_CtrlnoAlt,

    Thanks for ur 5 paragraphs! Now I understand how close up filter works!!
    P.S: please do not blame me for saying this is a Macro lens as:

    It is a lens and label Macro. Macro lens lor. ^_^

    Here, using Canon S5's Super Macro:

    With External Flash bounce off wall nearby.

    This.. using with close up filter at 1/4 of max zoom:

    Aka the wrong way of using it. Now I do notice the softness on the corners. Similarly, flash bounce off the wall.

    Lastly,

    Taken as instructed by mod. 12X Full telezoom, Auto focus at Super Macro mode. Flash bounce off wall. Now it is more than 20cm from object rather than previously (pic2) 2cm.
    EDIT: still a bit softness on the corner.. is it normal??
    BTW, my close up filter never say it is +1 or +2... it came from a 0.5X wide angle lens kit.

    No editing of picture is done other than resizing the image. My P3 laptop is struggling even what I open these image with MS paint to resize. >.< My BT rig can only BT and surf internet and post at forums. >.<

    Thanks Del_CtrlnoAlt for ur helpful and meaningful input.!!
    Last edited by soons; 7th January 2008 at 09:50 PM.

  5. #5

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    shouldn't you be able to go even closer.. than the original minimum focusing distance?

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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    shouldn't you be able to go even closer.. than the original minimum focusing distance?
    longer focal length = further minimum focusing distance...

    like if you use a 50mm macro can go pretty near, but if you use a 200mm macro, you have to go far far away...

    so if shooting static, can always use wide angle go near. but if shooting insects how?

    thats y the newbie assignment i gave is for him to try further distance, then i explain it now. So that he can use this new skill to shoot insects or whatever that come along.

    Some more explanation...

    On lense, short focal length, like anything below 50mm (on 35mm equiv) will have shorter focusing distance than compared to long focal length, (anything beyond 50mm) *50mm is what we commonly call standard, just treat is as the mid point*

    If you notice, if you use wide angle, everything seems sharp, but if you use telephoto, the item you focus on seem to be sharp but others seem out of focus. Thats normal... the blurness is the bokeh.

    *Let P be you, M be model, I be the infinity *infinity is the point in lens where by everything beyond is in focus aka sharp.

    A simple idea to visualise is, short focal length have shorter distance to infinity, so everything in infinity

    P---M-I

    So its very near, and it will be sharp...

    but in telephoto, its...

    P-----M-------I

    So pushing infinity away, everything beyond and before will be blur...

    in macro is the same theory, except, we make the M come nearer...

    so in wide angle, not so noticable

    P-M--I

    but in telephoto

    P--M----------I (or rather no I to even talk about)

    and when you push things nearer, bokeh get even blurer easier, same like when you put a finger infront of your eye, you visualise your finger, the background is extremely blur...

    Anyway, just go shoot more and any question just pm me.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    no, as in.. let's say you have 200mm macro lens yar

    let's say (for discussion's sake), the min focusing distance is 50 cm..too lazy to check what the rough actual one will be
    if you use a closeup filter, shouldn't you be able to focus NEARER to the object? if not how will close-up filters allow you to "magnify" the object with the same perspective
    can i confirm this, because that was my understanding, i have not actually used a closeup filter before

    from the last post, i'm thinking you mean that you asked him to practise using the closeup filter, this is not the actual way to use it?

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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    no, as in.. let's say you have 200mm macro lens yar

    let's say (for discussion's sake), the min focusing distance is 50 cm..too lazy to check what the rough actual one will be
    if you use a closeup filter, shouldn't you be able to focus NEARER to the object? if not how will close-up filters allow you to "magnify" the object with the same perspective
    can i confirm this, because that was my understanding, i have not actually used a closeup filter before

    from the last post, i'm thinking you mean that you asked him to practise using the closeup filter, this is not the actual way to use it?
    problem is, his lens isn't a 200mm macro... lol... its a normal lens on a prosumer.

    a close-up filter will make any lens focus nearer losing its infinity focus. thats understood.

    and your saying is correct, if MFD is 50cm, put a CUF, sure can go below 50cm.

    Well, actual way to use it, unless have time to do a workshop, but it already served it purpose, he knows how to shoot with his picture posted, good enuff for me. The rest is up to him to be creative already.

    So go buy a close-up filter now... spare the newbies the technicalities... and well, i'm also not proficient enuff to offer much details either.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by Del_CtrlnoAlt View Post
    problem is, his lens isn't a 200mm macro... lol... its a normal lens on a prosumer.

    a close-up filter will make any lens focus nearer losing its infinity focus. thats understood.

    and your saying is correct, if MFD is 50cm, put a CUF, sure can go below 50cm.

    Well, actual way to use it, unless have time to do a workshop, but it already served it purpose, he knows how to shoot with his picture posted, good enuff for me. The rest is up to him to be creative already.

    So go buy a close-up filter now... spare the newbies the technicalities... and well, i'm also not proficient enuff to offer much details either.
    yar, i know what you mean

    ok, just got a little confused by what was going on above cannot buy anything here la, damn expensive. in summer, in summer. cheers and thanks for the clarification

  10. #10
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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    yar, i know what you mean

    ok, just got a little confused by what was going on above cannot buy anything here la, damn expensive. in summer, in summer. cheers and thanks for the clarification
    after thinking... i think you misunderstand the minimum focusing distance in lenses...

    so just to clarify...

    when he say using 1/4 of max zoom, i assume its about 35 or 50mm, make it 50...

    then he say max zoom, probably assume its 300mm.

    so when he uses the 50mm, its very near, cos the minimum focusing distance is in default nearer, say 25cm from subject.

    then the 300mm minimum focusing distance is lets say 1.5m

    so in comparison, when he shoot with the 50mm, he gets to 2cm as close for the same shot achieved by 20cm on the longest tele. some shots can take as close as you like, for eg product shoot, still life, things dun fly off... but for outdoor butterfly or some other macro... the tele part is very important.

    its easier to understand that close up filter makes distance shorter than actually magnifying...
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  11. #11

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    no la, i know, the closest focusing distance for shorter lenses tends to be shorter than that for telephoto

    i had a prosumer before

  12. #12

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Sorry to hijack the thread to ask further questions on macro photography using close-up filter.

    I am using Sony A100 and kit lens, trying to take close-up of butterflies resting, but with wings spread out. I use the 75-300 tele lens, zoom all the way to 300mm, put on tripod, use flash, and able to capture the butterfly, at quite a distance away so as not to frighten the butterfly away. However, the butterfly image taken is small and I need to zoom and crop it to make it bigger.

    As I do not yet invest in a macro lens (which is expensive). I purchased a Hoye +4 close-up filter. Using the same set-up as above, I thought by just putting the close-up filter, the butterfly image taken would be bigger, so I have no need to crop.

    But this was not the case. Once I put the close-up filter onto the lens, everything is blur and out of focus. In fact, I cannot even focus properly. It seems that the close-up filter is useless. How do I make good use of the filter? I know it's better to get a macro lens but this is not the point yet.

    So, the close-up filter do the job of magnifying, but by having to go closer to the subject, which will scare them away? How to magnify the image and yet have a good working distance away from the subject?

    Kit lens 1, 18-70mm, MFD = 0.38m.
    Kit lens 2, 75-300mm, MFD = 1.5m.

    When I use kit lens 1, it seems easier to focus. Note that I use MF instead of AF. Does it mean that that for kit lens 2, the focus is razor thin to actually get it, or is there a better technique or way to do it?

    Appreciate all your advice and help on the above points. Thanks alot.

  13. #13

    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Title changed to "How to use a close-up filter??"

    To understand more of closeup filter, please read Macros and Close-ups FAQ#7 at
    http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=261356

    In summary, the focusing distance is depend on diopter value as follows:
    +2 close-up filter will give about 1000/2 = 0.5m
    +4 close-up filter will give about 1000/4 = 0.25m
    +5 close-up filter will give about 1000/5 = 0.2m
    +10 close-up filter will give about 1000/10 = 0.1m

    Please take note focusing distance is the distance between the sensor plane to the object and Working distance is the distance between the lens front element to the object.


    So for your Canon S5 IS setup with a close-up filter e.g. +4,
    you need to focus the object from your camera around 25cm ( focusing distance ) or 20cm ( working distance ).
    1. Try to focus lock (half shutter) the object to 20cm working distance (any focal length)
    2. Hold the half shutter and move your setup to fine tune the focusing
    3. When you see the LCD shows the object in focus, full press shutter to snap
    4. Recommended settings are
    - turn off macro mode
    - use full zoom ( max magnification )
    - use small aperture like f8 ( wider DOF)
    - flash for fill in ( show more detail )
    Last edited by megaweb; 8th January 2008 at 01:51 PM.
    See my Photo Gallery at the Clubsnap

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    Default Re: How to use Macro lens??

    Quote Originally Posted by alpha5354 View Post
    Sorry to hijack the thread to ask further questions on macro photography using close-up filter.

    I am using Sony A100 and kit lens, trying to take close-up of butterflies resting, but with wings spread out. I use the 75-300 tele lens, zoom all the way to 300mm, put on tripod, use flash, and able to capture the butterfly, at quite a distance away so as not to frighten the butterfly away. However, the butterfly image taken is small and I need to zoom and crop it to make it bigger.

    As I do not yet invest in a macro lens (which is expensive). I purchased a Hoye +4 close-up filter. Using the same set-up as above, I thought by just putting the close-up filter, the butterfly image taken would be bigger, so I have no need to crop.

    But this was not the case. Once I put the close-up filter onto the lens, everything is blur and out of focus. In fact, I cannot even focus properly. It seems that the close-up filter is useless. How do I make good use of the filter? I know it's better to get a macro lens but this is not the point yet.

    So, the close-up filter do the job of magnifying, but by having to go closer to the subject, which will scare them away? How to magnify the image and yet have a good working distance away from the subject?

    Kit lens 1, 18-70mm, MFD = 0.38m.
    Kit lens 2, 75-300mm, MFD = 1.5m.

    When I use kit lens 1, it seems easier to focus. Note that I use MF instead of AF. Does it mean that that for kit lens 2, the focus is razor thin to actually get it, or is there a better technique or way to do it?

    Appreciate all your advice and help on the above points. Thanks alot.
    use your 75-300, @ 300, its having a 1:4 macro iirc.

    like i emphasized earlier, use your minimum focusing distance, aka focus all in. then from there slowly move in towards the subject. try practising with a coin at home before attempting a butterfly... understand your lens.

    anyway, sulhan is a good macro shooter, there is a alpha outing coming up, you could probably join him at the outing to shoot some macros.
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  15. #15

    Default Re: How to use a close-up filter??

    Hi both moderators,

    Thanks very much for your advise and explanation. Greatly appreciated, as I am a newbie in photography and learning alot from information in Clubsnap.
    Thanks also for the steps provided. Will try out on weekend.

    Yes, I have read through the macro photography link, but sometimes still don't quite understand, especially in practical sense, until i try out myself, and ask further questions, and then learning more as I shoot and the theory becomes much clearer.

    So now, I know that the lens focal length, whether at wide or at tele, is only to magnify the image. The focus distance is dependent on the diopter value, in the case of +4, is around 25cm, and the working dist is around 20cm. Looking at it, seems hard not to alert the butterflies, may have to get a macro lens (Tam 90mm, Sony/KM 100mm or Sigma 105mm), or find tactical means to approach the butterflies but not scare them off.

    Actually I was also confused by the earlier posts in this thread, using a same close-up filter (not sure the value), a 50mm lens focal length gives 2cm focus dist and 300mm focal length gives 20cm focus dist. But at 20cm focus dist, I can figure that out. So, if i want 100mm focus dist (about 95mm working dist so as not the alert the butterflies), a 100mm macro lens is indispensable, unless i find a way to approach the butterfly tacatically so as to use the 70-300 tele.

    Yup, have been lurking around the alpha outings sub-forum, and will like to join these outings one of the days

    Thanks once again

  16. #16

    Default Re: How to use a close-up filter??

    Same here. I was surprised that my thread was updated with lots of information.

    Thanks both mods.

    I wanna try when weekends comes.. darn need to sleep now. Need to fall in early again tml. Haiz....

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