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Thread: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

  1. #1

    Smile How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    I've seen a lot of amazing shots in most photo websites and sometimes following the comments of a certain image reveal that the photo was post processed.

    I understand that post processing can help bring out the best in your images and others sometimes add up creativity by few tweaks, but isn't it great to know that the most creative shot posted turn out to be the non-PP'd image? How much actually of your images goes post processed (either via PhotoShop or equivalent SW)?

    (p.s. Sometimes I take 2 images per shot, i.e. RAW+JPG, so I can have the option to PP some images later.. if I have more time to spare, hehe)

  2. #2

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    ...i would like to point out that effectively when you put such a thread title, it would appear that anyone replying to the thread might see himself as a pro.

    but that is not true, because there are only so many "pros". in fact i would refrain from using the term altogether, it is immensely misleading as to what the term actually means, whether it is a professional in the usual sense, or a person good at photography. the first is more solidly defined, i.e. someone who earns his income primarily from photography, and the second is of course, very very subjective.

    in any case, my two cents, i have spoken strongly on this most of the time, the fact is, there is nothing to fear from post-processing. as mentioned time and time again in a flogged to death debate, FILM, where it all began, also involved the darkroom process, dodging and burning was invented in the darkroom. famous photographers like ansel adams also "post processed" their pictures in the darkroom painstakingly, perhaps even more so than what the normal photographer does today with photoshop. some trivia - photoshop was apparently based on what people could do in the darkroom.

    history aside, since one could argue that oooh, one could get a good shot without doing any darkroom work (which i hear, is bullshit).. the fact is that even with film, where the dynamic range and image quality is still perceived to be superior to digital as of today.. even if you do not do any darkroom work (i won't know why, i don't know anything about the darkroom) i would perceive that you would need filters, etc.

    so effectively, there is a manipulation of the image. what say more about digital, where dynamic range is limited? - that would jump at you immediately, i would imagine.

    it is my opinion that every photographer has a vision in mind when he clicks the shutter. i am almost certain that it is not what he sees in the lcd when previewing the image. post processing is a means to achieve this vision, and to not post process your pictures almost certain reeks of laziness and a lack of commitment, at least to me, unless the shot is really, coincidentally what you want when you press the shutter. in which case, to be bluntly honest i would think you are a very boring person since you let the camera decide what you want out of your hobby/passion. a jellyfish with no backbone, even.

    i hope i do not offend the purists who frequently lurk around and jump at any chance to ask "was there any post processing done?" in tiny high squeaky voices when they already know the answer.. and then do a visible hop and prance around before giving an "oh..." in some dejected internet tone like it matters anythign to the person whom they have directed the question to.

    but yes, to be honest, i do not care, this is my opinion, and i'm entitled to it. cheers.
    Last edited by night86mare; 14th November 2007 at 02:31 AM.

  3. #3

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    IF you do a bit of reading up, the question wouldn't even arise in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by jefkinetics View Post
    I've seen a lot of amazing shots in most photo websites and sometimes following the comments of a certain image reveal that the photo was post processed.

    I understand that post processing can help bring out the best in your images and others sometimes add up creativity by few tweaks, but isn't it great to know that the most creative shot posted turn out to be the non-PP'd image? How much actually of your images goes post processed (either via PhotoShop or equivalent SW)?

    (p.s. Sometimes I take 2 images per shot, i.e. RAW+JPG, so I can have the option to PP some images later.. if I have more time to spare, hehe)

  4. #4
    Moderator nightwolf75's Avatar
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Quote Originally Posted by jefkinetics View Post
    I've seen a lot of amazing shots in most photo websites and sometimes following the comments of a certain image reveal that the photo was post processed.

    I understand that post processing can help bring out the best in your images and others sometimes add up creativity by few tweaks, but isn't it great to know that the most creative shot posted turn out to be the non-PP'd image? How much actually of your images goes post processed (either via PhotoShop or equivalent SW)?

    (p.s. Sometimes I take 2 images per shot, i.e. RAW+JPG, so I can have the option to PP some images later.. if I have more time to spare, hehe)
    u must be really living in heaven... do u think dat only shooters of today post-process their images? factoid - a lot of the terms dat we are most familiar with in photoshop originated from the darkroom.
    If Life worked on auto mode then manual mode for photography would have never existed. ― Deeksha Mittal

  5. #5

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Way too many people here never heard of film and think that film users are dumb to use it, waste money, etc.... Sign of the times.

  6. #6

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    Way too many people here never heard of film and think that film users are dumb to use it, waste money, etc.... Sign of the times.
    speak for urself,i knew personally a few film user,and i absolutely adore what they can do.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    wow... that's the fastest i've seen a thread degenerate ...
    Last edited by F5user; 14th November 2007 at 11:52 AM.

  8. #8

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Sorry for the confusion, I'm actually just referring to digital images here -- this is why I have enclosed in parenthesis, if you notice, the statement "either via PhotoShop or equivalent SW"

    Of course, as I know NEF/RAW files will need post processing for us to define the perfect color saturation or whatever enhancement the picture needed to demonstrate a more vivid or astounding clarity. I'm just amaze to see pictures come out the digicam that already startles and speaks creativity without the need to do PP.

    I saw another thread that best answer my question..

    Check this thread out

    Thanks.

    ciao! =)

  9. #9

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    IF you do a bit of reading up, the question wouldn't even arise in the first place.
    Quote Originally Posted by nightwolf75 View Post
    u must be really living in heaven... do u think dat only shooters of today post-process their images? factoid - a lot of the terms dat we are most familiar with in photoshop originated from the darkroom.
    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    Way too many people here never heard of film and think that film users are dumb to use it, waste money, etc.... Sign of the times.
    Quote Originally Posted by indaybadiday View Post
    speak for urself,i knew personally a few film user,and i absolutely adore what they can do.


    in any case, to pp or not to pp is a very personal thing

    though i think you'd find that most good photographers pp their image, i can't really think of one who never pps his images, everytime one shot one kill in camera, that's almost impossible, unless you're talking about perhaps, photojournalism, where the contents of the pictures alone are more than sufficient to inspire awe at times

  10. #10

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Creativity has nothing to do with pp or not pp. If it comes out as a wow! shot, it's because someone planned it so. For example, a landscape photographer might have waited days for the perfect light, for that bird to fly at just the right spot, for the wave to hit at just the right angle, etc.

    In other words, "99% perspiration, 1% pp-ation".

    Quote Originally Posted by jefkinetics View Post
    Sorry for the confusion, I'm actually just referring to digital images here -- this is why I have enclosed in parenthesis, if you notice, the statement "either via PhotoShop or equivalent SW"

    Of course, as I know NEF/RAW files will need post processing for us to define the perfect color saturation or whatever enhancement the picture needed to demonstrate a more vivid or astounding clarity. I'm just amaze to see pictures come out the digicam that already startles and speaks creativity without the need to do PP.

    I saw another thread that best answer my question..

    Check this thread out

    Thanks.

    ciao! =)
    Last edited by waileong; 14th November 2007 at 11:02 PM.

  11. #11

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    to me i believe photography and PP come hand in hand.

    if you pull a photo straight out of the camera, chances are that you've used the cameras settings to include contrast,sharpness,colour,etc... this is a form of postprocessing. i personally prefer to do my own instead of letting a camera do it for me.

    to me PP just improves on the image. so if you can make an amazing image straight out of the camera....why not spend the extra time to make it even better by doing a little pp?

    but with that said... we're photographers first (hope this is a correct assumption)...so we should take the time to prepare the scene/model and compose as to reduce the amount of time spent doing pp

  12. #12
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Amateurs worry about gear
    Professionals worry about money
    Masters worry about light
    -Vernon Trent

    That's all you need to know for now. Hope that answers your questions.

  13. #13

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Does this thread help answer your question.
    Gallery | Facebook Page Spreading the Good photography.

  14. #14

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Ok, I must admit that my initial view of PP'g digital image was manipulating an image to your liking such that "most of the real elements" of a photograph gets washed away due to over-polishing. Perhaps this is the result of my browsing around the gallery of some photo sites and gettin' a bit upset when too much PP was made to an almost perfect image.

    I almost forgot that PP is indeed an integral part of photography with the aim to add a little more spice and be able to deliver amazing photos.

    Waileong, I agree with what you've said except for this part... "Creativity has nothing to do with pp or not pp." because I believe creativity has a lot to do with a lot of things, even if we pp or not. thanks

    dw2chan, I like how you explained what I was asking in the first place. thanks

    hazmee, sorry but I guess ur reply didn't answer my question. but thanks anyhow.

    Thanks all folks for clarifying things.

    ciao!

  15. #15

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Creativity comes from the person's imagination and vision. Not from a tool like PP.

  16. #16

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    Creativity comes from the person's imagination and vision. Not from a tool like PP.
    errrm, I didn't say it's from a tool, I meant you can be creative in a lot of diff'rent things.. whether you use tools or not.

    ciao!

  17. #17
    Senior Member zac08's Avatar
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    I believe each image can be better with a lil massaging from curves, levels, etc... but when the PP process includes too many processes like multiple images, or editing till the image does not look like the original anymore is over-kill...
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  18. #18
    Member retrovox's Avatar
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    To PP or not to, it's very subjective. To me, I think pp as a tool to help me convey my message across to the viewers. Think of yourself as a magician, an artist...and your photos as a whole package (or product). Do whatever it takes to recreate that magic that you have envisioned and present it to the viewers' very eyes.

    If one thinks that pp is not required and will do justice to their photos, so be it. But I think rarely one would be contented with the unprocessed version. Pros would most probably do more pp than average photographers! To do it subtly or not, depends on the concept and message you are trying to send across to the viewers. (BTW, I'm no pro. I'm just a photo-avid sharing my 2 cents' worth)
    Last edited by retrovox; 15th November 2007 at 03:43 PM.

  19. #19
    vince123123
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    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    There's no end in debate to this, because in every image, whether during film days, pinhole days, or digital days, goes thorugh "post processing" or processing of some sort. The only true no post processing is your eye, if you can capture the scene as you see it. Even then, there may be some changes.

    Hence, such a discussion will only go in circles, because processing in one form or another is inherent in the image. What's more important is the final result.

  20. #20

    Default Re: How does a pro think in terms of PP'g images?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    Creativity comes from the person's imagination and vision. Not from a tool like PP.
    i have to disagree with this one. i think PP can be used to express your creativity. look at dave hill's work. his images are all heavily PP'ed and extremely creative.

    at the end of the day to PP or not to PP is a personal preference. and arguing about which option is better or more 'true' just takes away from photography.

    it's all about how the photographer sees a scene and wishes to present it to their audience. whether this involves PP or not does not matter...

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