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Thread: Photographers' rights in Singapore

  1. #61
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    From the get go, I already know that copyright is not the subject. In fact, privacy has nothing to do with releases either.
    And earlier by Vince:

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    Both copyright and privacy/confidential information are... relevant to the same subject matter, ie whether releases are required in the situation the thread starter said.





    LittleWolf and Draccoyap... copyright is a complex issue. Not sure this is the place for it so I'm going to leave it as it is.

  2. #62
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Yeap don't see anything wrong.

    You do realise when arguing law, even negative points are considered relevant issues to be discussed even if they are ultimately dismissed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jed View Post
    And earlier by Vince:

  3. #63
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    You do realise when arguing law, even negative points are considered relevant issues to be discussed even if they are ultimately dismissed.
    You have to make a distinction between negative points and relevancy. Occasionally you need to find out if something is indeed relevant, but by and large the need to consider irrelevant issues never arises. Otherwise we would be here discussion a motion that "tea pots" should be renamed "non-distinctional liquid carrying containers", before dismissing it as irrelevant to releases. For someone with the legal background that you have (that's the impression that's been conveyed), you should know from the off that it's not relevant.

    I can't see how you fail to see anything wrong with your statements if one moment you're saying something is "relevant" and the next moment you're saying that "from the get go, you already know (sic)" that the same thing had nothing to do with it.

    Common guys, this all started as a totally non-accusatory statement that the thread was branching in different directions. Now it's branching in at least one more direction that it was before!

    Have a good day ^.^

  4. #64

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    while i understand that many posts are fairly relevant to the subject, i would just like to noe 2 things:
    1. r photo releases required in singapore? and
    2. can u be sued (locally) for publishing ur photo of some1 from singapore overseas?

  5. #65
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by Buckteeth LCL View Post
    Privacy laws varies from countries to countries, even within the many states in the US. If you are interested to read up on them, I will post some online here for you.

    In Singapore Context, the Singapore Constitution is based on the British system and does not contain any explicit right to privacy. Only thing that we need to take note is the prohibited material or entertain discussion on prohibited themes.Prohibited material includes pornography, material that "advocates homosexuality or lesbianism," and material that "glorifies, incites or endorses ethnic, racial or religious hatred, strife or intolerance," among other prohibitions. Political content, especially during elections, is regulated.

    Of course, there is a lot of stuff open to interpretation based on the above.

    Morally, this is my point of view. Try not to depict people in the public/ or publish pictures

    * Borders on pornography
    * Sexual Orientation
    * Undesirable intent/content (upskirt/downblose)
    * Incite religious, racial/ethnic hatred
    * Mock the political leaders

    Any lawyers with more inputs?
    Does it mean artistic nudes in sg are a no-no??? how stifled we are.

  6. #66
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    They are relevant in discussion, although I know that they do not affect the final answer. As long as the thread starter feels they are relevant, they will continue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jed View Post
    You have to make a distinction between negative points and relevancy. Occasionally you need to find out if something is indeed relevant, but by and large the need to consider irrelevant issues never arises. Otherwise we would be here discussion a motion that "tea pots" should be renamed "non-distinctional liquid carrying containers", before dismissing it as irrelevant to releases. For someone with the legal background that you have (that's the impression that's been conveyed), you should know from the off that it's not relevant.

    I can't see how you fail to see anything wrong with your statements if one moment you're saying something is "relevant" and the next moment you're saying that "from the get go, you already know (sic)" that the same thing had nothing to do with it.

    Common guys, this all started as a totally non-accusatory statement that the thread was branching in different directions. Now it's branching in at least one more direction that it was before!

    Have a good day ^.^

  7. #67
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    In my view and personal opinion (which you may take with a grain of salt if you wish),

    1. No. The legal effect of model releases are suspect in Singapore, and their requireemnt equally doubtful. Most photographers or the like, in Singapore, import what they read from the Internet into the Singapore context without remembering that these sites are largely based on laws in the United States.

    2. This is however, a more complex question that I do not have an opinion on at this time as it involves principles of conflicts of laws and interantional jurisprudence. There would be some academic risk if you take a photo of someone in Singapore, and say, went to publish it in the United States.

    However, practically, it also means that someone will have to go to the United States, sue you there (and get your ass there to be sued), then try to enforce a foreign judgement here in Singapore (assuming you have no assets in the United States). That alone presents large practical and financial burdens that may make the effort not worthwhile.




    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    while i understand that many posts are fairly relevant to the subject, i would just like to noe 2 things:
    1. r photo releases required in singapore? and
    2. can u be sued (locally) for publishing ur photo of some1 from singapore overseas?

  8. #68

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    However, practically, it also means that someone will have to go to the United States, sue you there (and get your ass there to be sued), then try to enforce a foreign judgement here in Singapore (assuming you have no assets in the United States). That alone presents large practical and financial burdens that may make the effort not worthwhile.
    i see. so i suppose its very unlikely (even impossible) that u can be sued for publishing a photo which u took of a person in singapore.

    i guess i'll continue taking more portraits then

  9. #69
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Well it is just my personal opinion, if you want greater reliance, it may be worthwhile to get independent legal advice from a lawyer or something

    Cheers and happy photographing!

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    i see. so i suppose its very unlikely (even impossible) that u can be sued for publishing a photo which u took of a person in singapore.

    i guess i'll continue taking more portraits then

  10. #70

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    Well it is just my personal opinion, if you want greater reliance, it may be worthwhile to get independent legal advice from a lawyer or something

    Cheers and happy photographing!
    wasnt even thinking of anything close to doing that

    was just wondering since i read tt if i submitted a photo of a person (i think the theme was portraits) or say a building i most prob would need a photo release or even a property release

  11. #71
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    wasnt even thinking of anything close to doing that

    was just wondering since i read tt if i submitted a photo of a person (i think the theme was portraits) or say a building i most prob would need a photo release or even a property release
    If you take a building from outside its property boundaries (lets say from the roadside opposite the bldg) you won't need a release, cause you took it from a public space......

    HS

  12. #72
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    The concept of a "property release" is even more far fetched than a model release. I'm not even sure that a "property release" exists in the United States, much less in Singapore.

    It may be a concept coined up based on analogy to model releases, but unlike the concept of model releases which is based on specific legislation in the United States, I doubt a similar concept exists for property - maybe those in the know could help to post some resources or authority on this.

    That said, in Singapore, I am fairly confident that "property releases" are even lower down the requirement scale even when compared to already shaky ground model releases stand on.

    I can say that under Singapore law, the copyright in a building is not infringed by the taking of the photograph of a building, and unlike traditional causes of action for photographs of people (defamation, privacy, outrage of modesty etc), such causes are highly unapplicable towards inanimate objects like buildings. Hence, other than copyright, I'm not sure what other areas can be explored in respect of buildings.

    Any other views?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    wasnt even thinking of anything close to doing that

    was just wondering since i read tt if i submitted a photo of a person (i think the theme was portraits) or say a building i most prob would need a photo release or even a property release

  13. #73
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Following on from the above, even if you took the photograph within the property boundaries, the management of the building have no rights to demand surrender of photographs already taken.

    Their sole legal remedy (barring other facts) is simply to ask you to leave the premises.

    Once again, this is my personal opinion, and I would love for contrary viewpoints if there are any, so that this can be further discussed if desired.

    Quote Originally Posted by hongsien View Post
    If you take a building from outside its property boundaries (lets say from the roadside opposite the bldg) you won't need a release, cause you took it from a public space......

    HS

  14. #74

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by Jed View Post
    LittleWolf and Draccoyap... copyright is a complex issue. Not sure this is the place for it so I'm going to leave it as it is.
    I am glad you realise that. I was not so comfortable to discuss legal issues here earlier. but since this is a forum where people exchange knowledge, why not. You are still welcome to share what you know.

  15. #75

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123 View Post
    The concept of a "property release" is even more far fetched than a model release. I'm not even sure that a "property release" exists in the United States, much less in Singapore.

    It may be a concept coined up based on analogy to model releases, but unlike the concept of model releases which is based on specific legislation in the United States, I doubt a similar concept exists for property - maybe those in the know could help to post some resources or authority on this.
    im pretty sure this thing exists in the US. though ive never heard this term mentioned in s'pore before, so it shld be fine here.

    abt taking pics in a building or a shop. like u said, the immediate response will be just to chase u out. if in a shop, i suppose if u bought smth the shop keeper would prob let u take a few pics without getting

  16. #76

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    im pretty sure this thing exists in the US. though ive never heard this term mentioned in s'pore before, so it shld be fine here.

    abt taking pics in a building or a shop. like u said, the immediate response will be just to chase u out. if in a shop, i suppose if u bought smth the shop keeper would prob let u take a few pics without getting
    what is "property release" BTW? or you are referring to "legal release"?

    actually, to put it simply, a release can be think of as a contract between parties to agree that either side or both are release from liability. If you wish, you are free to sign one with the subject of your photograph (if they are willing to sign) in Singapore, which may get you out of the trouble should the subject turn back to sue you for publishing a photograph of him or her.

  17. #77
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    What I was asking is whether there is a legal basis for this thing existing in the United States, not so much whether industry practice in the United States somehow created this concept. As an example, the legal basis of model releases in Singapore is highly suspect, yet it doesn't prevent many photographers (and indeed, some gurus or professionals or long time in the industry bigwigs) from saying that model releases are required in Singapore.

    It would be good if anyone knows of some legal basis for property releases to point them out here for further discussion. A very brief search on google does seem to show an attorneys' view that property releases are more to cover the backside than any real legal necessity. The last paragraph here is particularly instructive:

    http://www.pdnonline.com/pdn/feature..._id=1003605722

    In fact, I would go so far as to say that the last paragraph stated there could easily be transplanted to the views on model releases here in Singapore - good to have, but not strictly legally necessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8photography View Post
    im pretty sure this thing exists in the US. though ive never heard this term mentioned in s'pore before, so it shld be fine here.

    abt taking pics in a building or a shop. like u said, the immediate response will be just to chase u out. if in a shop, i suppose if u bought smth the shop keeper would prob let u take a few pics without getting

  18. #78

    Default Re: Photographers' rights in Singapore

    Quote Originally Posted by Draccoyap View Post
    what is "property release" BTW? or you are referring to "legal release"?

    actually, to put it simply, a release can be think of as a contract between parties to agree that either side or both are release from liability. If you wish, you are free to sign one with the subject of your photograph (if they are willing to sign) in Singapore, which may get you out of the trouble should the subject turn back to sue you for publishing a photograph of him or her.
    im not too sure either, but i noe that the two terms were mentioned on the photo contest site, 'photo releases' and 'property releases'. u can check out the NYIP photo contest site. i think its under contest rules. oh, it does mentoin 'model releases' too

    thats wat i was thinking. is it still absolutely necc to get a release form signed in singapore like it is in the US (i think). well so far from wat i gather - no

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