My fellow TS brother
THINK HARD! - you have pysched yourself into a 'dangerous' position, reinforced by all the feedbacks you get.
1. Is this what you really want?
2. Once in it, with your stated $ situation, it will make your dream of owning dslr much more diffcult.
3 Operating cost is going to pain you - if you already are in tight $ situation.
Tahan a bit lah!
going film way, IMHO, is a deliberate move. It should not be a no-choice choice.
I respect all the eager 'good' advices on film given to you, but none really consider your inner wants. This is 21st century already. Think Hard Again, please.
since you are new to slr, i would suggest sticking to AF for the time now...if your interest still strong after trying film slr, then you can look towards manual slr or rangefinder to enhance the film experience. but not at the moment.
some decent film slr going for around $300.
canon - eos 30/33, eos 50
nikon - f80/n80
dont have to invest in expensive lenses for now... some quite cheap and good lenses
canon - 50 f/1.8, 28-135 USM
nikon - 50 f/1.8, 28-105 f/3.5-4.5
for film, you can try fuji superia 200 or 400. these go for about $9 for pack of 3 rolls. processing should be around $3 - total about $12-$15 with 4R prints or scan. if you shoot b&w, you can learn to process yourself to save a bit and have some fun at the same time.
anyway....do give it a try...go for it!
are you a film shooter? it will be very narrowminded of you to think film has no place in the 21st century.
personally i dont think going with film slr will hinder his future move to digital. even after going digital, he can still continue to shoot film. its not a mutually exclusive activity. having a film slr around will not cost him extra. he might shoot a roll or 2 every month of so..but how much will that cost? the investment made in lenses will see him thru to digital - unless he switches brands
if you think digital is cheap...think again. the lifespan of dslr is much shorter than film slr. a well maintained film slr can last you years. the depreciation for new dslr is very high. you can lose up to 1/2 if you sell within a year. even if you dont sell....will you not be tempted by the newer models with more advanced ccd/cmos sensors? how long can the sensor last? how about cf cards? every few months, lexar and sandisk release newer faster models with higher capacity...will you not be tempted to buy them? how about disk storage and backup media? how about your pc? can it cope with processing the many digital images? the list goes on
I agree wholeheartenly.
Btw, there are a lot of makes and models of AF cameras in the market that might confuse you. In this case, your own self research is the key. I recommend Nikon or Canon as they are the market leaders and it's easier to find lenses and accessories for them. Lenses are usually compatible as well.
And the debate goes on...
But then again, this is not a discussion of whether film photography is better than digital photography (or vice versa), is it? For me, I think it will be better if you can get a 3rd from top or 2nd from top of line camera, especially if you chance upon a very good deal. But decide on the brand, and stick to it. Not only does the lens carry you to digital, but the interface will be largely similar, so the change will not be too drastic.
ok,guys,I didnot expect that it goes on into a film/digital debate,please all calm down and relex,though a newbie as i am,i think that both film and digital has its own strong points,film produce better colors and digital is convenient,for instance,and they both play very important part in the world of photography,it really depends on the photographer's preference,there is no absolute better or worse b/t the two.
Okay,back to the topic,maybe I should have included more about my own situation,I started photography passion with Canon P&S S3IS not long ago,but I am really into the world of photography,so I want to upgrade to a SLR due to the found limitations of my S3,S3IS is a great P&S camera,by the way,I am not throwing it away even when I have upgraded to SLR.I just need another alternative to go with my S3, to complement each other, I mean. And I have never thought of turning professional photographer, though I do have a strong desire and passion for photography. I just want to be an amatuer, I do have my major as a computer engineering student, so I don't have the time to shoot photographs that often, probably a session per week or even less frequent, so I won't use that many films.Besides, I will still use my S3, only for some specific situations like portraiture shooting would I use the SLR.
Ok,I guess I have said quite a lot,so keep the good advice coming,I would love advice on which model to buy first of all.
I would suggest getting a manual mechanical camera for learning. They somehow pushes your learning curve much more than automated stuff. A 2nd hand Nikon FM/FM2 should set you back about 300-400 bucks. With a 50mm manual lens, it should be well within your budget. If you have about 200 bucks more you can get a scanner, and trust me, my scanner is my most worth investment. The amount of scanning i do is worth at least a dozen times the price i paid for the scanner.
Why nikon? Not that the other camera manufacturers are worst off but the mere fact that there are many nikon manual cameras and lens around makes them much easier to get and spare parts for repairs are easier to find.
Since you have access to the darkroom , you should try your hand on developing your own B&W film. The joy that you get out of it is so totally different from what you will get from the instant gratification of digital imaging.
Btw Film doesn't really give better colour as its dependent on your scanning process. A great image with poor colour management will still produce poor colours. Film does provide greater dynamic range and details to highlight areas.
when you shoot film, later when you develop the pictures, you will not really remember at that point of time what was the lighting condition, and how else you should have adjusted your settings, exposure, white balance etc for a better picture then.
chezburgr i can haz?
at the same time do consider the lens arsenal that the ntu photog club has.. if they hold any inventory at all, tripods etc? you could loan from them and shoot when you need. that is somewhere where you can save on than buying something or some lense/tripod for rare/occasional use
chezburgr i can haz?
Film Slrs: if u are interested in canon: u cud look at eos 1v, eos 3 or eos 30(elan 7) . rebel might be too basic. eos 30 should be good to start out with. rebel has mirror and not pentaprism viewfinder, if I am right.
manual slrs: I saw a nikon fe with aunt. really awesome. simple to start out with and has depth of field. really liked it. inexpensive too. not sure if new lens will work with them.
auto/ manual. u may want to get a camera which has auto-exposure, shutter-priority, aperture - priority and manual. to start off, u cud use shutter priority (where u set time and camera sets aperture) - this is for controlling action, aperture priority - (set aperture and camera sets shutter speed) - control depth of field.
if u want, u can use manual exposure when ur fully comfortable. when ur buyin, watch out for the kit lenses. lenses coming as part of kit may not be too good. read the net a bit before buying lenses.
hope that helps. any zoom with more than 3x will generally be not too good
I have an old F 601 and it comes with a Nikon 70-210mm f4-5.6
condition 9, if you want it I can let you have the lot for $300. Plus the lens will work later on with dslrs (tested with my D80)
pm me if you are keen
Nikon D750; FM2; FG; 55mm Micro Nikkor; 28-300 VR; 70-200 VR; Nikon V1 + 10-30mm
Dont listen to them.
Save up for a dslr by hook or by crook as your first camera... else you will be wasting time. dslr is the best tool to learn.. actually.. any digital camera with manual control is the best... once you understand the fundamentals.. only then you can go to film...
dslrs allow you a very steep learning curve whereas film hinders progress especially if you are a beginner. Once you understand the effects of the four variables (ISO, Aperture, Shutter Spd, Focal length), then go film.. you'll enjoy photography much better.
PS: nothing wrong with a 2nd hand 350d.. should be lots out there since many ppl upgrading to 400 or 30ds..
Last edited by cibs; 15th August 2007 at 12:14 PM.
Negara Brunei Darussalam
YES... manual camera for learning ... but make sure you stock up your films
get a reliable body cam with some good primes and you are on your way.
oh ya...u can opt for a manual body with a meter or a manual body with a dead meter .
and if you think its all too much to think, then get a compact rangefinder that allows full manual control. eg canonet ql17.
if you are going with film and later to digital, i would advise to look at the full system before deciding
i suggest going the nikon way as the lenses can still be use on the DSLR bodies
lots of film cameras going cheap, save abit more and you might be able to afford a F4 or F5
I'll have to agree that digital allows faster learning even though I come from a film background. I'm almost fully digital now.
If your budget is $500, someone is selling a 300D with kit lens at $590 herehttp://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=302066
I shoot both film and digital, I won't say film SLR way of shooting is cheaper. It is different and require more steps to get it into the computer when you want a digital copy to 'play' in your digital darkroom.
Unless you want to try black and white in the traditional darkroom, going the Dslr way does help to speed up the learning curve.