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Thread: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

  1. #81

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by LazerLordz View Post
    Math and Physics form the fundamentals of both hard sciences and social sciences.

    I wonder, how many students under the age of 19 today have any foundation in Pure Physics?
    You are right. All are important but which one? Chem? Phy?Bio(life Sc), Maths??? And what is/are the best combination?

  2. #82

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy View Post
    You are right. All are important but which one? Chem? Phy?Bio(life Sc), Maths??? And what is/are the best combination?
    actually, now, the fundementals are no longer physics. it's economics. get what i mean?

  3. #83

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    actually, now, the fundementals are no longer physics. it's economics. get what i mean?
    why ... should have been like that long ago!
    Economics should be inculcated in kids like in secondary school...like seriously...unless every kid wants to be a biochemist or sth ><
    or rather, i believe more kids wants to be in the coporate sector more than in sciences..

  4. #84
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by seanlim View Post
    why ... should have been like that long ago!
    Economics should be inculcated in kids like in secondary school...like seriously...unless every kid wants to be a biochemist or sth ><
    or rather, i believe more kids wants to be in the coporate sector more than in sciences..
    Singapore was and is totally dominated by "business" which is not sustainable for much longer. It worked as long as Singapore was a low-cost country and could compete in manufacturing; this economic pillar is rapidly crumbling away (see e.g. the electronics sector). What remains is overpaid merchants, lawyers, office lemmings etc. which want to take a cut of the productivity that isn't there any more - look how people start to bypass Singapore distributors (not only for photo stuff, but also e.g. industrial equipment) as the latter add hefty charges (sometimes more than doubling the price of a product) with little in return. And sometimes less than nothing in return, as people who have to go through technically incompetent Singapore distributors (there are exceptions) for support instead of being allowed to contact the manufacturer directly can readily attest.

    The only way to survive as an economy with a high cost of labor is to provide expertise/knowledge that others don't have. This is the reason why the government is investing into research - and a frequent criticism of international advisors is that research still isn't at a basic enough level. The reason is simple: the know-how and intellectual property for high-tech products is usually created/patented many years before any commercial application is in sight.

    To give just one example, the basis of semiconductor research was laid largely in Europe, but research was killed off when "modern" business practices replaced the scientists and engineers in the corporate boards with myopic managers who killed off long-term strategic research to boost short-term profits. The commercial breakthroughs came from US outlets like Bell Labs where researchers were paid to work for what they thought was interesting. Europe largely missed the semiconductor revolution and could never catch up.

    At the same time, the local research scene is suffering from a lack of young Singaporean scientists. Research institutions are desperate to hire qualified Singaporeans to balance the foreign talent; but there are very few local applicants, and even fewer appear to have the suitable skills and mindset.

    You may have noticed recent advertisements for careers in science & engineering commissioned by government agencies. If even Singapore's $$$-oriented government is getting worried, so should you.

    If kids WERE to consider economics, more of them would end up in science & research. And hopefully in a more diverse mix of disciplines than what's popular now. You can't do interdisciplinary research with a monoculture of tunnel-visioned bio-nano-medical-first-world-polis-hub lemmings.

  5. #85

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleWolf View Post
    Singapore was and is totally dominated by "business" which is not sustainable for much longer. It worked as long as Singapore was a low-cost country and could compete in manufacturing; this economic pillar is rapidly crumbling away (see e.g. the electronics sector). What remains is overpaid merchants, lawyers, office lemmings etc. which want to take a cut of the productivity that isn't there any more - look how people start to bypass Singapore distributors (not only for photo stuff, but also e.g. industrial equipment) as the latter add hefty charges (sometimes more than doubling the price of a product) with little in return. And sometimes less than nothing in return, as people who have to go through technically incompetent Singapore distributors (there are exceptions) for support instead of being allowed to contact the manufacturer directly can readily attest.

    The only way to survive as an economy with a high cost of labor is to provide expertise/knowledge that others don't have. This is the reason why the government is investing into research - and a frequent criticism of international advisors is that research still isn't at a basic enough level. The reason is simple: the know-how and intellectual property for high-tech products is usually created/patented many years before any commercial application is in sight.

    To give just one example, the basis of semiconductor research was laid largely in Europe, but research was killed off when "modern" business practices replaced the scientists and engineers in the corporate boards with myopic managers who killed off long-term strategic research to boost short-term profits. The commercial breakthroughs came from US outlets like Bell Labs where researchers were paid to work for what they thought was interesting. Europe largely missed the semiconductor revolution and could never catch up.

    At the same time, the local research scene is suffering from a lack of young Singaporean scientists. Research institutions are desperate to hire qualified Singaporeans to balance the foreign talent; but there are very few local applicants, and even fewer appear to have the suitable skills and mindset.

    You may have noticed recent advertisements for careers in science & engineering commissioned by government agencies. If even Singapore's $$$-oriented government is getting worried, so should you.

    If kids WERE to consider economics, more of them would end up in science & research. And hopefully in a more diverse mix of disciplines than what's popular now. You can't do interdisciplinary research with a monoculture of tunnel-visioned bio-nano-medical-first-world-polis-hub lemmings.
    We are now a developed country. We have to live like one and sometimes act like one.
    There is no turning back.

    Do you know that you could buy a bowl of mee at 20cents? You travelled on bus paying only 5 cents and 25 cents round the island. A second hand car VW costed only $2000. A semi detached at Bt Timah valued at $20,000 and when you eat satay you dip the sauce from a common pot .....

    Sgd has become so strong that it eats into the export and import become actually cheaper but cost of living goes up!... Ask me why? Profit .. who do not to have more!

  6. #86
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Doing well in a branded school and no one remembers you that well, the impact would be more significant when you're from a simple school and kicking some butts
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  7. #87

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Override2Zion View Post
    Doing well in a branded school and no one remembers you that well, the impact would be more significant when you're from a simple school and kicking some butts
    you rather
    getting a C at a "simple school" when everyone is getting an F
    or getting a B at a "branded" sch...
    Moreover, papers at branded school tougher etc etc.
    +
    is there the motivation in a "simple" school?

  8. #88
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by seanlim View Post
    you rather
    getting a C at a "simple school" when everyone is getting an F
    or getting a B at a "branded" sch...
    Moreover, papers at branded school tougher etc etc.
    +
    is there the motivation in a "simple" school?
    Actually what I meant is being a scholar in a "simple" school scoring better at 'O' or 'A' levels than the students from "branded" schools.
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  9. #89

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    We r the one make the school branded

  10. #90
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by kkk81 View Post
    We r the one make the school branded
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  11. #91

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by kkk81 View Post
    We r the one make the school branded
    It is all in the mind. Unfortunately people do not accept it.

    Do well in your primary school - Step 1
    Score 6 digits in your Secondary School - Step 2
    Get 5 As in your 'A' level - Step 3

    They are in the scholars platoon!!!! So?

  12. #92

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy View Post
    It is all in the mind. Unfortunately people do not accept it.

    Do well in your primary school - Step 1
    Score 6 digits in your Secondary School - Step 2
    Get 5 As in your 'A' level - Step 3

    They are in the scholars platoon!!!! So?
    get Astar, dsta, psc scholarship.
    get into ivy league uni.
    get first class honours.
    get masters.
    get phd.
    get back serve bond.
    get 6 figure pay.
    get big car.
    get big house.
    get married.
    get babies.
    get promoted.
    get 7 figure pay.
    get children to best primary schools.
    get children best tutors.
    get children to best secondary schools.
    get children to best tertiary institutes.
    get children to best universities.
    get children to best jobs.
    get retired.
    get enjoyment from past savings to do things you like.
    get dead.


    but of course, this path is taken by the ultimate "elite" people.

  13. #93

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Hahaha, why DSTA? A* and PSC I can imagine why, they are after all very hyped up and prestigious.

    Aiya, who cares what brand or no brand, so long as you succeed in one way or another, by orthodox means in the end.

  14. #94
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy View Post
    We are now a developed country. We have to live like one and sometimes act like one.
    There is no turning back.
    Singapore's rapid development is quite evident in the shocking contrast between generations when it comes to education, career possibilities, etc. Schools certainly have progressed; I'm sure not that many years ago noone would have cared whether a school was "branded" or not. (I think the entire branding fetish is a sign of decadence and decay anyway, but that's just my personal opinion.) What I would caution against is calling Singapore, or any country, "developed", as in past tense/completion form. Development is an ongoing process, resting on your laurels means falling behind.

    Do you know that you could buy a bowl of mee at 20cents? You travelled on bus paying only 5 cents and 25 cents round the island. A second hand car VW costed only $2000.
    In all likelihood, this is not due to "development", but simple inflation. In my childhood, similar prices were common, even in a then-already-"first-world" country. A brand new VW beetle cost less than S$10000 (assuming today's conversion rate) ca. 1980 in western Europe, and a used one could go for a few hundred. Of course, the exchange rate back then may have been rather different, but the prices for some basic commodities have certainly multiplied by huge factors since when I was a kid.

    To go back to the topic of the thread, "branded" or "elite" schools may mean kids get more possibilities shoved up their rear ends. But kids from "normal" neighborhood schools may have a plus in their resume, since if anything they made it to a given level on their own, with less help, and likely driven by higher motivation. Otherwise, noone, at least in my work environment, seems to care about what primary/secondary school or JC one attended. And if there are more kids who "made it" in the "elite" schools, one has to wonder if this is due to the school, or simply the fact that the better kids, who would have made it at any school, tend to end up there.

    Actually, a job applicant who went through the polytechnic route before attending university has quite an advantage - he/she has practical, hands-on knowledge and experience, whereas many "prestigious" JC kids who went to university are excellent at scoring grades and regurgitating memorized facts, but not necessarily at working on real problems. (Some even seem to be shocked that they have to do "mundane" manual tasks instead of making Nobel-prize winning discoveries straight away.) At least in the company I work for, we look at skills and personality, not paper qualifications when we hire. And since diversity in the staff profile makes it much more likely that there is someone who knows how to solve a problem that pops up, we tend to hire people with nonstandard CVs, rather than having 100 clones of the "standard Singapore scholar, model 2007" who are all excellent at the same thing, but all equally helpless when they encounter something that they haven't seen before in their books (which, in the real world, is the rule rather than the exception).

    This entire "elite school" thing is very Singaporean to me - a lot of stress and hype about nothing. What becomes of oneself is maybe 5&#37; the school, but 95% yourself. And maybe instead of going to all those tuition classes and spend the rest of the time on computer games, kids should get out more so that they see a bit of reality. It was quite sad to see a local young dad struggle to tell his kid that a bird was an ostrich or a peacock at a pet farm near Seletar when in fact, it was a casuar [edit: the name cassowary appears to be more commonly used], a very distinctive local (!) species. One will gain a much better understanding of science from observing and _experiencing_ nature than merely memorizing formulas.
    Last edited by LittleWolf; 25th July 2007 at 09:23 PM.

  15. #95
    Senior Member Override2Zion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    Hahaha, why DSTA? A* and PSC I can imagine why, they are after all very hyped up and prestigious.

    Aiya, who cares what brand or no brand, so long as you succeed in one way or another, by orthodox means in the end.
    Agreed
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  16. #96

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleWolf View Post
    Singapore's rapid development is quite evident in the shocking contrast between generations when it comes to education, career possibilities, etc. Schools certainly have progressed; I'm sure not that many years ago noone would have cared whether a school was "branded" or not. (I think the entire branding fetish is a sign of decadence and decay anyway, but that's just my personal opinion.) What I would caution against is calling Singapore, or any country, "developed", as in past tense/completion form. Development is an ongoing process, resting on your laurels means falling behind.



    In all likelihood, this is not due to "development", but simple inflation. In my childhood, similar prices were common, even in a then-already-"first-world" country. A brand new VW beetle cost less than S$10000 (assuming today's conversion rate) ca. 1980 in western Europe, and a used one could go for a few hundred. Of course, the exchange rate back then may have been rather different, but the prices for some basic commodities have certainly multiplied by huge factors since when I was a kid.

    To go back to the topic of the thread, "branded" or "elite" schools may mean kids get more possibilities shoved up their rear ends. But kids from "normal" neighborhood schools may have a plus in their resume, since if anything they made it to a given level on their own, with less help, and likely driven by higher motivation. Otherwise, noone, at least in my work environment, seems to care about what primary/secondary school or JC one attended. And if there are more kids who "made it" in the "elite" schools, one has to wonder if this is due to the school, or simply the fact that the better kids, who would have made it at any school, tend to end up there.

    Actually, a job applicant who went through the polytechnic route before attending university has quite an advantage - he/she has practical, hands-on knowledge and experience, whereas many "prestigious" JC kids who went to university are excellent at scoring grades and regurgitating memorized facts, but not necessarily at working on real problems. (Some even seem to be shocked that they have to do "mundane" manual tasks instead of making Nobel-prize winning discoveries straight away.) At least in the company I work for, we look at skills and personality, not paper qualifications when we hire. And since diversity in the staff profile makes it much more likely that there is someone who knows how to solve a problem that pops up, we tend to hire people with nonstandard CVs, rather than having 100 clones of the "standard Singapore scholar, model 2007" who are all excellent at the same thing, but all equally helpless when they encounter something that they haven't seen before in their books (which, in the real world, is the rule rather than the exception).

    This entire "elite school" thing is very Singaporean to me - a lot of stress and hype about nothing. What becomes of oneself is maybe 5% the school, but 95% yourself. And maybe instead of going to all those tuition classes and spend the rest of the time on computer games, kids should get out more so that they see a bit of reality. It was quite sad to see a local young dad struggle to tell his kid that a bird was an ostrich or a peacock at a pet farm near Seletar when in fact, it was a casuar [edit: the name cassowary appears to be more commonly used], a very distinctive local (!) species. One will gain a much better understanding of science from observing and _experiencing_ nature than merely memorizing formulas.
    Hi Littlewolf..

    It is happening all over the world. You have Cambridge, Oxford, MIT, Havard, Beijing, Xinwah .. just to name a fews.

    It makes a different whether you come from Cambrdge or NTU or NUS until we are established.

    Yappy

  17. #97

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    get Astar, dsta, psc scholarship.
    get into ivy league uni.
    get first class honours.
    get masters.
    get phd.
    get back serve bond.
    get 6 figure pay.
    get big car.
    get big house.
    get married.
    get babies.
    get promoted.
    get 7 figure pay.
    get children to best primary schools.
    get children best tutors.
    get children to best secondary schools.
    get children to best tertiary institutes.
    get children to best universities.
    get children to best jobs.
    get retired.
    get enjoyment from past savings to do things you like.
    get dead.


    but of course, this path is taken by the ultimate "elite" people.
    Hi Satay...

    I think we can stop at after 7 digit pay until the child get himself branded in Primary school. Otherwise he cannot go further!

    Yappy

  18. #98

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy View Post
    Hi Satay...

    I think we can stop at after 7 digit pay until the child get himself branded in Primary school. Otherwise he cannot go further!

    Yappy
    hahaha, ever heard of "donations"? esp hefty ones?

  19. #99
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    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy View Post
    Hi Littlewolf..

    It is happening all over the world. You have Cambridge, Oxford, MIT, Havard, Beijing, Xinwah .. just to name a fews.

    It makes a different whether you come from Cambrdge or NTU or NUS until we are established.

    Yappy
    It makes a difference not so much in that NTU or NUS are not "branded", but in having some life experience/perspective that extends beyond the tiny nation of Singapore. Someone who goes from kindergarten to university exclusively in Singapore, possibly never even living on his/her own away from mom&dad, may suffer a bit from tunnel vision.

    One also has to realize that many universities are commercial enterprises, effectively selling courses that end in basic degrees. This caters to the mass market of those who "invest" into a university course (or "upgrade themselves") based on projected income levels, the "brand name", etc. and are not driven by genuine interest for the subject. (Look at recent advertisements by NUS and NTU, and ask yourself who they are targeted at.) In this case, it doesn't matter whether it's branded mediocrity or non-branded mediocrity. Those who are serious about getting an education don't stop after a "basic degree". For doctoral or postdoctoral research, it matters even less where you did it, but what you did (i.e. earning your own laurels).

  20. #100

    Default Re: Branded School or make yourself BRANDED

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    hahaha, ever heard of "donations"? esp hefty ones?

    Agreed. $$$$$ can also make you 'Branded'... with $$$$$ U not need go to branded school because when you did not make it to the next branded school what will become of U?

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