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Thread: NETS fee hike is ok

  1. #41
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    I think we have lost sight of one thing, that is why a fee for NETS needs to be imposed, and if it justified. Whether the fee is on the consumer or retailer is irrelevant, the implication is that the cost of the goods (or at least the cost of providing the goods) will be increased.

    There has been so much heat here, lotsa of people here who have stated they would rather walk a longer way to an ATM, carry more cash, avoid shops with NETS etc, to save on the small increase in cost. Well, it goes right to the point, NETS is a SERVICE, a SERVICE which provides a CONVENIENCE (so that you dun have to walk so far or carry so much cash) to the retailer and customer. A SERVICE that comes with a COST, yes? COST of infrastructure, manpower, adminstration, financing. As a SERVICE, the are entitled to charge a fee, yes? Or does anyone here disagree with that?

    Point 1: The providers of NETS provides a service which incurs a cost to the provider, and are entitled to charge a fee.

    Next, does NETS provide a social service or should it function as a commercial entity? Perhaps in the early days of its inception, due to the foresight of our policy makers (who only suffer brickbats in this forum, btw), there was an ideal that we should make cashless transactions accessible to heartlanders who do not have access to credit cards. To that end, it may have been possible that public funds were made available as seed money to get this off the ground. This is my understanding from speaking with folk who have some history of the system but I have no way of verifying, so if someone has contrary information, I stand corrected. However, as it has evolved, it is now very much a commercial entity. I.e. it needs to be self-sustaining and not dependent on public funding. I believe this makes the best sense for this type of operation.

    Point 2: NETS should be self-sustaining and not dependent on public funding

    Last, how about pricing? IMO, if an entity is a commercial one, my only concern about how they price is whether or not I wish to use their service. I have no interest for any rationalisations nor do I expect any commercial company to explain to me how they price their product/service. As a commercial entity, my expectation is that they will price as high as the market can bear. If NETS becomes a cash-cow for the involved banks, so be it. If I were a shareholder in DBS bank, I would certainly expect the bank to maximise value from NETS. As stated by the competitions commission, there are alternative modes of payment out there. If the retailer wishes not to pay the NETS fees and provides goods at a lower price than one who does, that is a very legitimate business strategy. Likewise for the reverse. The consumer has the choice to lug around a bunch of cash to pay a little less at a shop without NETS, or pay a little more for the convenience. A very common decision trade-off we make all the time, so I fail to see the reason for all the angst.

    Point 3: As a commercial entity, NETS have a right to set whatever price they like.

    In a nutshell, our spoilt Singaporeans have gotten too used to a good thing, something which may have been provided as a privilege and has now somehow become a 'right'. Typical.
    My dear friend, with ur reply, I suddenly see the number of ur enemies increase by a hundred fold.

    U'd probably be unconsciously labelled as the same label and tarred with the same brush that some ppl here would label Civil Servants, Businessmen and anyone else who had their votes swing towards the incumbent regardless of their personal reasoning might be.

    U know what those labels are. Dun wanna say....

  2. #42
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by shinken View Post
    Different strokes, different folks. But good to have a perceptive fellow forumer. Would be even better if the perception didn't arise from a personal interest, but from having a more marcro mindset.
    Shinken, perhaps you can explain what you mean by "arise from personal interest"? I hope you are in no way implying that I am somehow connected with NETS or related parties, because I would consider that to be perjorative and ask that you retract your imputation. I would put you it to you that the reluctance to pay out of pocket is driving the majority of the negative responses in this forum and that is the greatest "personal interest" driving the lack of a "macro mindset". Yes, IMO, the naysayers are being narrow minded.

  3. #43
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by mybearbrick View Post
    from a different perspective, which i heard over a discussion on train in the morning,

    "Singaporeans so rich, see how they buy like mad at sales and IT shows, I don't think they cannot afford to 2% hike and 1.5% NETS charge. Some just like to whine"

    I dunno i should agree or be mad.....

    I guess ultimately, they all contribute to our "economy growth" bah....
    U wonder? Well, I wonder too.

    Paradoxical spending/saving culture. Even as a Singaporean (born & bred here), such mentality fascinates me.

    People would not hesitate to dump in more than $600,000 for an Executive flat, get a car (serious liability). But when hard times hits, they still refuse to liquidate their fixed assets to cut further losses. Hmmmm....

    Ok, this my thoughts on ur reply. Now back to our regular scheduled programme - NETS transaction fee hike.

  4. #44
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by jsbn View Post
    My dear friend, with ur reply, I suddenly see the number of ur enemies increase by a hundred fold.

    U'd probably be unconsciously labelled as the same label and tarred with the same brush that some ppl here would label Civil Servants, Businessmen and anyone else who had their votes swing towards the incumbent regardless of their personal reasoning might be.

    U know what those labels are. Dun wanna say....
    It is fine with me what they want to tar me with. As I have said before, there are folk here who know me personally and know I am neither connected with the establishment nor have any affinity for their political tactics. I am merely speaking as a private citizen who cares about his country and voicing a personal opinion on the matter. The fact is this is supposed to be the internet, the "vehicle" for free speech, but yet those who purport to support free speech are the same folk who are so quick to put labels on those who express a different opinion, as mine is from the majority here.

  5. #45

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    Shinken, perhaps you can explain what you mean by "arise from personal interest"? I hope you are in no way implying that I am somehow connected with NETS or related parties, because I would consider that to be perjorative and ask that you retract your imputation. I would put you it to you that the reluctance to pay out of pocket is driving the majority of the negative responses in this forum and that is the greatest "personal interest" driving the lack of a "macro mindset". Yes, IMO, the naysayers are being narrow minded.
    Because I do not know you as a person, I do not know whether there's a vested interest behind your perception. There is nothing wrong at all, for people with vested interests in organisations, to better comprehend the rationale of their decisions and policies, especially because they're more likely to be granted the benefit of the availability and depth of information from the decision making process. And if you don't have any vested interests and don't belong to that group of people, as far as I can see, that automatically means you are even more perceptive than this group of people.

    I don't see why I have to retract my 'imputation'. But convince me, and I will. Though I would appreciate it if you retract the word 'imputation' and replace it with something more suitable.

    Reluctance to pay 2%? Give me a break. So you expect freedom of speech but yet see those from the opposite side of the fence as naysayers? Amuse me.
    Last edited by shinken; 27th June 2007 at 10:15 AM.

  6. #46
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by shinken View Post
    Because I do not know you as a person, I do not know whether there's a vested interest behind your perception. There is nothing wrong at all, for people with vested interests in organisations, to better comprehend the rationale of their decisions and policies, especially because they're more likely to be granted the benefit of the availability and depth of information from the decision making process. And if you don't have any vested interests and don't belong to that group of people, as far as I can see, that automatically means you are even more perceptive than this group of people.

    I don't see why I have to retract my 'imputation'. But convince me, and I will. Though I would appreciate it if you retract the word 'imputation' and replace it with something more suitable.
    I have no need to convince you, you implied a falsehood without even knowing the person. Is this the type of responsible internet posting you will encourage to your children? You did not have the courtesy to ask if I was connected to NETS, which I would gladly have replied that I was not. You made the assumption that I was voicing an opinion "arising from personal interest". I ask again, what do you mean by that? Prove it. The burden of proof is on you. I.e. If you say I am someone that I am not, then you are lying, pure and simple.

  7. #47

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    I have no need to convince you, you implied a falsehood without even knowing the person. Is this the type of responsible internet posting you will encourage to your children? You did not have the courtesy to ask if I was connected to NETS, which I would gladly have replied that I was not. You made the assumption that I was voicing an opinion "arising from personal interest". I ask again, what do you mean by that? Prove it. The burden of proof is on you. I.e. If you say I am someone that I am not, then you are lying, pure and simple.
    First, I did not assume. You assumed that I assumed.

    I merely presented 2 possibilities. First, is that you're related to NETs. Second, is that you're NOT related to NETs. Both ways, I complimented on you being more perceptive.

    I hope you're ready to be responsible for what you typed. Because I am.

  8. #48
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    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    It is fine with me what they want to tar me with. As I have said before, there are folk here who know me personally and know I am neither connected with the establishment nor have any affinity for their political tactics. I am merely speaking as a private citizen who cares about his country and voicing a personal opinion on the matter. The fact is this is supposed to be the internet, the "vehicle" for free speech, but yet those who purport to support free speech are the same folk who are so quick to put labels on those who express a different opinion, as mine is from the majority here.
    hehehe..... Well, understand perfectly where u're coming from my friend.

    But still, u know the witch hunt in Old England in the early 13th century? I guess the so-called modern world isn't so much of a difference.

    Its awful to say but the word 'mindset' isn't just a single word but consists of 2 different words.

  9. #49

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    im so gonna shop for my home appliances at Courts on July 1st,
    'cos they are absorbing the GST hike! woohoo! ................ until July 2nd.

  10. #50

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    The government's move is pushing up the prices of goods, not by 2%, but by 20%!

    Why? I bought a rice dumpling in Chinatown last saturday, and found that it's usual price of $1.30 have gone up to $1.50!

    Gst increase has not even started yet, and now, prices have gone up!

    My suggestion is, from now onwards, stop spending as freely as you would in the past. Let all the retailers feel the heat of a slow business. Even better, let the economy run into a recession due to lesser spending from the people.

  11. #51

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by johnlim View Post
    The government's move is pushing up the prices of goods, not by 2%, but by 20%!

    Why? I bought a rice dumpling in Chinatown last saturday, and found that it's usual price of $1.30 have gone up to $1.50!

    Gst increase has not even started yet, and now, prices have gone up!

    My suggestion is, from now onwards, stop spending as freely as you would in the past. Let all the retailers feel the heat of a slow business. Even better, let the economy run into a recession due to lesser spending from the people.

    Brother...... relax... the rice dumpling increase is due to the dumpling festival and not GST or NETs....... We should only start "whining" when the price dont decrease after the dumpling festival.


    And why on earth do you want to punish the retailers? They have no choice... everything increase, they absorb.... they will die over the long road. Should instead show your displeasure over this via your votes next time round. And your statement "let the economy run into recession...." do you know how many people are going to get retrenched because of that??
    Last edited by centuryegg; 27th June 2007 at 10:56 AM.

  12. #52

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by centuryegg View Post
    Brother...... relax... the rice dumpling increase is due to the dumpling festival and not GST or NETs....... We should only start "whining" when the price dont decrease after the dumpling festival
    No, I don't think it is due to festival, because that is a small corner shop that only sell dumpling all years round. I noticed all the prices of the different dumpling are up, I am very sure the prices is permanent.

  13. #53

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by centuryegg View Post
    Brother...... relax... the rice dumpling increase is due to the dumpling festival and not GST or NETs....... We should only start "whining" when the price dont decrease after the dumpling festival.


    And why on earth do you want to punish the retailers? They have no choice... everything increase, they absorb.... they will die over the long road. Should instead show your displeasure over this via your votes next time round. And your statement "let the economy run into recession...." do you know how many people are going to get retrenched because of that??
    That's the government's blunder. Let them solve the problem.

    And, not everyone gets to vote! This could only happen in Singapore, a democratic country!

  14. #54

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by johnlim View Post
    No, I don't think it is due to festival, because that is a small corner shop that only sell dumpling all years round. I noticed all the prices of the different dumpling are up, I am very sure the prices is permanent.
    Alamak everyone also increase price for dumplings cos it is dumpling festival.. my goodness if you really doubt me, go to Bugis and have a look. the dumpling festival is being celebrated there. It is called more demand so price go up. same for fish, meat and vegetables increasing price during CNY..... Of course all the prices of all dumplings go up. be it nonya, five spice dumplings, they are still rice dumplings.....

    And to your statement let the govt handle the blunder and so hence have recession??? So when you lose your job or if you are still a student, your father loses his job... you tell the govt solve my problem?? When it is a prob u created in the first place.

  15. #55

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by centuryegg View Post
    Alamak everyone also increase price for dumplings cos it is dumpling festival.. my goodness if you really doubt me, go to Bugis and have a look. the dumpling festival is being celebrated there. It is called more demand so price go up. same for fish, meat and vegetables increasing price during CNY..... Of course all the prices of all dumplings go up. be it nonya, five spice dumplings, they are still rice dumplings.....

    And to your statement let the govt handle the blunder and so hence have recession??? So when you lose your job or if you are still a student, your father loses his job... you tell the govt solve my problem?? When it is a prob u created in the first place.
    I don't have the ability to create the problem. Let the market decides.

    As to the prices, no point arguing, it is going up definitely! Don't tell me, they are going to increase the prices by 2%, which is a one or two cents! No hawker or retailer sell in that way, maybe supermarkets will.

  16. #56

    Default Re: NETS fee hike is ok

    Quote Originally Posted by johnlim View Post
    I don't have the ability to create the problem. Let the market decides.

    As to the prices, no point arguing, it is going up definitely! Don't tell me, they are going to increase the prices by 2%, which is a one or two cents! No hawker or retailer sell in that way, maybe supermarkets will.
    Not arguing..... nothing to argue about. Anyway happy dumpling festival to you and all. Do try the dumplings at Bugis, they are quite tasty...

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