To teerex

[Kit]

So your point of opening up a closed thread was to take cheap shots at somebody and close it back again?

Is that the way of a moderator?

Here's 2 responses I got soon after I sent out my first message for the record...


I beg to differ. I think the first 2 shots are story telling shots and they are more that just snapshot.
Those in your flickr album are snapshots.

I beg to differ on many many points here, not because I like vortex or anything.

1) The thing about IR is the effects make almost any photos look better, including snapshots.

If that is the case, then IR filters would have been marketed to beyond glory because they have godlike powers to make anything look better. What hogwash.

2) Ordinary snapshots? Maybe they do not look like much thought have gone into it, but I think composition wise, I can see the attempt.


and I'm accused of not being courteous to the rest???

Look, my comments were directed to no one else but the images and I don't mock those who didn't agree with me did I? As such, I would expect the same courtesy extended towards my comments. Am I being arrogant to ask for that much??

At no time did I toss out a challenge to anybody. Read the posts with a subjective mind, you are a moderator for god's sake and I refer you to the following:


It isn't whether it's palatable or not, the main point that I'm disputing is still the IR point, tsk.

That's definitely an overly sweeping statement, if you choose to dispute it I go and take lots of IR snapshots to prove you wrong, want or not.

Besides, no one really attacked YOU, only your points. No reason to get personal, sheesh.


I did not asked him to prove anything. He volunteered himself.

What differentiates between a "negative" and "positive" comment? Things that people don't like to hear become "negative"? and therefore had to be explained? Since "Great shots" didn't get questioned(well, they got thanked), why should I explain myself then?

Admin, I would like to enquire on the roles of a moderator. Aren't they supposed to be subjective and fair at all times? I remembered being asked to be a moderator for this very site at one point in time(I rejected) and I think that was what the moderators believed in then. Time has changed I supposed.

[Kit]

Eikin,I got your message btw and was ready to forget this incident but I'm left with no choice after reading the cheap shots on me and had no way to defend myself on the original thread. I don't have that kind of power in hand to abuse.

[night86mare]

I don't think I've been very aggressive in addressing you, in a sense I viewed your sweeping statement as a direct insult to the entire IR community. Labeling something as "helps you to make snapshots look better" is like saying that DSLRs help you take photos better. Does that not qualify my naming of your point on IR as total hogwash?

You seem to be taking out your biased viewpoint on IR by just stirring up a nest of serpents. I suggest you put your time to better positive energy, like going out to photog. Personally, I do not agree with Max for calling your Flickr album snapshots, but I think he was pretty gracious after he calmed down. And you just insist on turning this into some smelly mess of crap.

Live and let learn - how old are you? In working life do you take such attitudes? Honestly, dude, this is not the way to treat stuff. If you think you have the right to criticize (and you do), then I do have the right to address your points in stride, especially when I feel strongly about it. The only time when one cannot be attacked is with regards to stuff he CANNOT control, like race, circumstance. Other than that, it is my firm belief that ANY line of thought can be attacked so long as there is logic. You were invited to bring up your line of thought so that vortex could actually improve.

Calling someone's stuff snapshottish gives the idea of snobbishness. There is definitely a better way of giving critique, and while no one expects you to babysit anyone else, there is something such as mutual respect. I think eikin is a very good example of this. He generally shows respect to people. And for that I respect him as a fellow forumer and SuperUser - one who really deserves it.

You can go on pushing this issue, but my advice (whether you like it or not) is to just relax. And take things less literally. I was pissed at first, even wanted to just replicate your Flickr album works in IR form. But we're adults. There's no need to hurt when you don't really need to. And it's simply childish, like some kindergarten spat.

I hope this issue can be resolved amiably, because the IR people are really one of the best and helpful bunch in these forums. I can personally attest to that, and from my viewpoint, because I -am- relatively new, you have to understand the context that there is some ideology of brotherhood because of the long period of knowing each other. It is easy to say that one can distinguish personal issues from critique proper, but it is not so easy to do.

[night86mare]

And fyi, Mods can post in threads that have been posted.

I'm quite sure about that, at least it is true for some of the forums I used to frequent in the past.

Do not be so swift in passing judgement, life is in a way like photography. If you stop for a while, think better, compose better, you will get a better output.

And do not take everything so personally. It is bad for health. This is just an online discussion. Why do you want to keep beating the ol' dead horse? Teerex was out of the country, he just came back. I guess IR forums is in a way, his "baby", I can only see why he wants to keep it peaceful, because generally the people are very friendly when giving critiques.

Originally Posted by Kit The thing about IR is the effects make almost any photos look better, including snapshots.

By putting this in you are already going to generate animosity from ANYONE who likes IR. Why don't you do some self-reflection?

P.S. You are definitely welcome, any day to pass your criticism. But it does show double standards when you say that people cannot pass criticism on your critique. Unless you profess to be the Best Photographer In the Universe, end all and be all?

[teerex]

I did not open and close any thread to get a "cheap shot" at you. I do not take "cheap shots", don't need to.

I am not bothered to read your long reply or any retaliation.

As far as the goys in this forum and I am concerned you are one that comes and goes and we feel that you are not contributing anything constructive here.

Enough said, don't want to disrupt the peace.

[teerex]

Guys,

Chill out, let's move on.

[Dennis]

Kit,
Do you know why you have been issued with such remarks.
It is because of your statement and not your comment on the photo itself.
By saying

"The thing about IR is the effects make almost any photos look better, including snapshots. Sorry, those were just ordinary snapshots."

You put down the whole world of IR shooters and lovers and on top of that did not give any constructive comments on the photo itself.

[night86mare]

Yeah, Kit, why don't you go into Underwater Photography and say:
The thing about Underwater Photography is that the water makes almost any photos look better, including snapshots.

Or P&P: The thing about taking photos of humans is that they make almost any photos look better, including snapshots.

Or Night: The thing about taking photos at night is because the night just makes almost any photos look better, including snapshots.

You want me to write the whole translated version for every section, also can. This one need less effort than making IR snapshots.

Make any sense? No? Why don't you try and see the response?

[eikin]

chill yah? if not going to bring in the satay and start barbeque fire again

[Francis247]

Alright All,

You all read Teerex comments.
Let's not comment any further and move on.
So much rage and unhappiness, what is the point.
Put down all and go out and shoot more.
Have peace in your heart and mind.
Cheerz.

[Kit]

Originally Posted by night86mare I don't think I've been very aggressive in addressing you, in a sense I viewed your sweeping statement as a direct insult to the entire IR community. Labeling something as "helps you to make snapshots look better" is like saying that DSLRs help you take photos better. Does that not qualify my naming of your point on IR as total hogwash? You seem to be taking out your biased viewpoint on IR by just stirring up a nest of serpents. I suggest you put your time to better positive energy, like going out to photog. Personally, I do not agree with Max for calling your Flickr album snapshots, but I think he was pretty gracious after he calmed down. And you just insist on turning this into some smelly mess of crap. Live and let learn - how old are you? In working life do you take such attitudes? Honestly, dude, this is not the way to treat stuff. If you think you have the right to criticize (and you do), then I do have the right to address your points in stride, especially when I feel strongly about it. The only time when one cannot be attacked is with regards to stuff he CANNOT control, like race, circumstance. Other than that, it is my firm belief that ANY line of thought can be attacked so long as there is logic. You were invited to bring up your line of thought so that vortex could actually improve. Calling someone's stuff snapshottish gives the idea of snobbishness. There is definitely a better way of giving critique, and while no one expects you to babysit anyone else, there is something such as mutual respect. I think eikin is a very good example of this. He generally shows respect to people. And for that I respect him as a fellow forumer and SuperUser - one who really deserves it. You can go on pushing this issue, but my advice (whether you like it or not) is to just relax. And take things less literally. I was pissed at first, even wanted to just replicate your Flickr album works in IR form. But we're adults. There's no need to hurt when you don't really need to. And it's simply childish, like some kindergarten spat. I hope this issue can be resolved amiably, because the IR people are really one of the best and helpful bunch in these forums. I can personally attest to that, and from my viewpoint, because I -am- relatively new, you have to understand the context that there is some ideology of brotherhood because of the long period of knowing each other. It is easy to say that one can distinguish personal issues from critique proper, but it is not so easy to do.

You let me worry about how I use my time.

Before this incident, I don't even know anyone in this so called IR community(I still don't). So you think I would bother causing trouble? I call it as I see it and if you don't like what I say, that's regrettable but rest assure I won't loose any sleep over it. I'm not out to hurt anyone but if they see it that way, I can't control that either. Again, I won't loose any sleep over it.

I see a "snapshot" comment as short and to the point if you understand the meaning of it. Nothing disrespectful about it. People here have to learn to divorce themselves from any precious feelings they have towards their work if they were to ask for critiques. Otherwise, they won't gain anything from it, especially the harsh ones. If they take pride in "good shots", then that's a different story. My comments were never directed to any individual but to the pictures.

If "brotherhood" is that bloody precious, then close the IR section to the public. I can't imagine that this is the reason for the repercussions I got for making my comments to one of your brother but if this is indeed the case, some people obviously needs to grow up.

[Kit]

Originally Posted by Dennis Kit, Do you know why you have been issued with such remarks. It is because of your statement and not your comment on the photo itself. By saying "The thing about IR is the effects make almost any photos look better, including snapshots. Sorry, those were just ordinary snapshots." You put down the whole world of IR shooters and lovers and on top of that did not give any constructive comments on the photo itself.

So you mean I've bruised some egos in the process?

[night86mare]

Originally Posted by Kit My comments were never directed to any individual but to the pictures.

And mine were directed to you, as a person? Or to your points?

Originally Posted by night86mare I beg to differ on many many points here, not because I like vortex or anything. 1) The thing about IR is the effects make almost any photos look better, including snapshots. If that is the case, then IR filters would have been marketed to beyond glory because they have godlike powers to make anything look better. What hogwash. *your point is hogwash. Last I checked up, hogwash could not be applied to a person. I hope you trust in my clarity of communication* 2) Ordinary snapshots? Maybe they do not look like much thought have gone into it, but I think composition wise, I can see the attempt. *? Where's the personal attack?*

Read again, do not let your rage cloud your vision.

Just want to clarify this, then that's about it. Will not reply to any other points. Said what I want to say. I can only control my own actions as a person, life has already more than taught me that. I hope you don't learn it the hard way as I did.

[Kit]

Originally Posted by night86mare Yeah, Kit, why don't you go into Underwater Photography and say: The thing about Underwater Photography is that the water makes almost any photos look better, including snapshots. Or P&P: The thing about taking photos of humans is that they make almost any photos look better, including snapshots. Or Night: The thing about taking photos at night is because the night just makes almost any photos look better, including snapshots. You want me to write the whole translated version for every section, also can. This one need less effort than making IR snapshots. Make any sense? No? Why don't you try and see the response?

I'll give you a clue. For every IR shot you take, take a regular equivalent of it and see how many of the regular ones are your keepers...... you'll have your answers.

[eikin]

can we have a moment of peace?

or who wants to fight?

[Dennis]

Not at all and especially to me.
Just that you still don't see the root cause.
If you had simply say "your photos are all snapshots to me" or something to that effect nobody could have faulted you.

Originally Posted by Kit So you mean I've bruised some egos in the process?

[Kit]

Originally Posted by Dennis Not at all and especially to me. Just that you still don't see the root cause. If you had simply say "your photos are all snapshots to me" or something to that effect nobody could have faulted you.

So I did briused a few egos then.....

[night86mare]

Originally Posted by Kit I'll give you a clue. For every IR shot you take, take a regular equivalent of it and see how many of the regular ones are your keepers...... you'll have your answers.

Doesn't prove anything about your idea that IR makes snapshots look good.

Fine, you force my hand. You don't get it, do you. Why don't you pop into night photography and say the equivalent then? Some buildings look good at night. They look hideous in the day. You might as well say I go and take Esplanade like this in the day, then take in the night, wa, looks good at night looks hideous in day, conclusion is NIGHT MAKES ESPLANDE SNAPSHOTS BETTER?

Some things look hideous in non-IR shots, but they look good in IR shots.

Just because it provides an effect and has slightly different ways of appearing, doesn't prove your point in ANY WAY.

IR is quite close to B&W, btw. So go, go and slam Ansel Adams and all the lovers of B&W, I couldn't care less. Out, now.

You not only insult IR as a branch of photography, you also have the alongside connotation that a lot of the IR shots posted here are snapshots. That's the way I view it. Was that statement really necessary? Eh? No? Then why put it in?

If I wanted to be really malicious I could accuse you of wanting attention and trying to up your post count for some "e-Peen" reasons.

[Dennis]

hahaha don't think you understand do you.

Originally Posted by Kit So I did briused a few egos then.....

[night86mare]

Originally Posted by Kit So I did briused a few egos then.....

I think only your ego is bruised, that NO ONE wants to side with you.

Boohoohoo.

Two can play at this game, I was a master of it once, I can get back into it. And I'm VERY free, as you can see. Come, let's play.

And while we're at it, let's use some of the old tricks like:
1) Please spell LOSE correctly. It is not LOOSE.
2) Please spell BRUISED correctly. It is not BRIUSED.
3) My advice to you, as a self-declared friend is that you should download Mozilla Firefox, it has built-in spell check. Very useful for certain people. (Not necessarily you la, really!)