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Thread: Employ Singaporeans for what?

  1. #301

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deceased View Post
    Which is quite true.

    I presume you are in the advertising industry.

    Let me ask you.
    Who are the pioneers for our creative ad industry?
    Ian Batey who crafted the Singapore Girl for SIA.
    Jim Aitchson and Neil French who had trained our locals to become better admans, to bring our creativity to the global standards.

    Let's face it.... ang mohs are more creative...
    If not, our ads won't be looking exactly the same style as the western countries.
    Unlike the thais and the japs.

    Singapore men like chinese, malaysia, thailand girls. Singapore woman like British, American, Europeans. Citizenship is not a criteria in todays globalization trends. Information booming results in the problem you mentioned " Employ Singaporean for what?". Singapore is globalised in a very fast way and people who lost the pace will become the "complaining groups". By pushing the top ends working here will eventually benefit the rest. Have far sight abit and compete yourself with US, European, Japan, China and don't think that migrate aywhere will solve the problem.

    You can survive aywhere, anytime as long as you are marketable and understand the "supply and demand" games. There is no single success stories and you can be creative how to survive in this kind of environment. You will ask : Can I be more specific? No way.
    Last edited by SnakeJackal; 21st January 2007 at 05:18 PM.

  2. #302

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Ang View Post
    Well, how to promote creativity when you are busy trying to get food on the table? An expats with 5 digits salary juz need to get creative. They don't try to think of how to get the moola for tonight's dinner.
    How to take you seriously when you give this kind of reasoning? I hope you are just joking...

  3. #303
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by amateur_photographer View Post
    so we blame the foreigners for this?



    so we blame the unmarried people or male staff for the advantage of not able to be pregnant?
    Its local culture. You have to understand, always blame it on something else and not themselves ?

  4. #304
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by beemaro View Post
    Its local culture. You have to understand, always blame it on something else and not themselves ?
    you registered just to post in this thread. well done, please continue your little dream about the blaming game.

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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Ang View Post
    Yes I can do that, no problem.
    If da boss pays me the 5 digits salary as the Expats are getting & the 50 plus leaves per year.
    Sorry, the same Msian worker can do but without all yr demands

    thats the problem !

  6. #306
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by theonlyone View Post
    How to take you seriously when you give this kind of reasoning? I hope you are just joking...

    Ka ka Ka.. Thats the problem

  7. #307
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    you registered just to post in this thread. well done, please continue your little dream about the blaming game.
    I cant help but to register after saw this thread esp first few pages.

    Until today, the mind set and thinking patterns of some sporeans never stop to amaze me.

  8. #308
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by beemaro View Post
    I cant help but to register after saw this thread esp first few pages.

    Until today, the mind set and thinking patterns of some sporeans never stop to amaze me.
    likewise, the existence of some people who register just to post in specific threads to stir up sentiments and trouble never fail to amaze me.

  9. #309
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    likewise, the existence of some people who register just to post in specific threads to stir up sentiments and trouble never fail to amaze me.
    sorry boss, i do not mean to cause any trouble

  10. #310

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deceased View Post
    Sorry, i don't come up that theory but results had shown ang mohs are indeed more creative in terms of annual awards given.

    Look at the number of awards given to our ad agencies.
    Look at the names of the art directors and copywriters.

    See how many foreign names appearing compare to locals.


    Of coz, i dun wish to see we are always followers...but then again, in this industry, clients trusted the ang mohs more than the locals.

    How many local agencies creativity are on par with the global agencies?
    10am and Kinetic.

    Only 2 of them which i considered the best....
    Isn't that pathetic?

    If you can name any 5....do let me know.
    The rest of the local agencies doesn't come close.....when comes to creativity standards.

    Although i would like to support the locals.....unfortunately, results speaks more clearly than anything else.

    Well as you said it Clients trust Ang Mohs more than locals. End of the day it boils down to budget. The ang moh will get all the big budget jobs that allow them to spend on whatever they want. The locals? Always getting the peanut jobs that are never ever going to win an award simply because it is not meant to.

    Results? Well I do not think that we are any less creative just unfortunately the person taking the price is Ang Moh. What about the rest of the team below him or her? Convinently swept under the door. Perhaps you have not heard of the times local clean the backside for all these jokers and never saw heir efforst recognised.

  11. #311

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by alexlim78 View Post
    People getting EPs initially in Singapore can get to convert to PRs most of the time, well some might not for some reason but I can't be bothered to find out all of them. So if people feel that EPs and PRs are equally disadvantage and no benefits, why are there still so many people converting to PRs? Gut feeling is that they want to take the CPF lah. Correct me if I'm wrong. Maybe also to be able to buy HDB in Singapore. haha..So for PRs and EPs, if you are not happy, then why you come here???
    Actually,from what I read, I feel that those complaining are the citizens. Most of the PR and EP in these thread just intend to voice out that they are not really that better off as presumed by most citizens. That's is just my view.

    Cheers & have a nice day.

  12. #312

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by centuryegg View Post
    Errrrr sorry even in Australia and USA.... WESTERN WHITE NATIONS, they do the same... it is called taking care of your own before you suck up to foreigners. Only Singapore NO 1 Foreigners are King, Locals are S***
    Yah... that reminds me of my "sacrifice".
    But can't blame the Americans for "welcoming visitors, but children are fed 1st".

  13. #313

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by eikin View Post
    so afterall you're pushing the responsibility to the government. Singaporeans blaming foreigners? you need to wake up your idea, stop psychoing people into thinking that it's a blaming game. why would i not dare to do so? what about you? just sitting around blaming your own people. you know why problems don't get solved? because we have people like you thinking that the government will solve everything, and other people's effort are pointless, and simply negligible. just some useless complaints.
    For a start, I have a suggestion to make with regards to HR and employment.
    Remove the below questions when hiring such as: (if possible make it a law)

    1. Place of birth
    2. Age
    3. Citizenship
    4. National Service status
    5. Number of Dependants / Family members
    6. Maritial Status
    7. Race
    8. Religion
    9. Employment status (some employers tend to cut-throat retrenched employees knowing that they are out of job)

    The above typically has nothing to do with the job. In the U.S., if an employer asks you the above, you can sue for being profiled / discriminated.
    Since the employer doesn't know if you are foreigner / local, he / she can only evaluate you through your merits / qualifications / experiences.

    Do you think this possible in SG?
    Last edited by Hoky; 21st January 2007 at 11:27 PM.

  14. #314
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoky View Post
    For a start, I have a suggestion to make with regards to HR and employment.
    Remove the below questions when hiring such as: (if possible make it a law)

    1. Place of birth
    2. Age
    3. Citizenship
    4. National Service status
    5. Number of Dependants / Family members
    6. Maritial Status
    7. Race
    8. Religion
    9. Employment status (some employers tend to cut-throat retrenched employees knowing that they are out of job)

    The above typically has nothing to do with the job. In the U.S., if an employer asks you the above, you can sue for being profiled / discriminated.
    Since the employer doesn't know if you are foreigner / local, he / she can only evaluate you through your merits / qualifications / experiences.

    Do you think this possible in SG?
    what needs to be removed is the mentality that Singaporeans are incapable, both on the employer's and employee's side, not application form. information may be blanked out temporarily, but that's not the root of the problem.

  15. #315
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    i agree tt local HR practice is mostly stone age. but i think (ya, i think, cos i dun hav d facts ) a major change is oni possible if it gets on d front page of Straits Times newspaper. & since change will oni happen when issues r reported & published den i wonder wad d gov has been doing? must an issue b splashed on d front page of papers b4 remedial action is taken?

    oh wen war approaches there unlikely b any FTs ard cos most would not hav stayed on, so defending FTs is not an issue, ya? it also is counterproductive 2 hav soldiers who hav no heart 2 fight, ttz a really serious issue 4 any army. "it worth fighting for Froddo" in d LOTR says it plainly.

    d voice of discontent will oni get louder but d desired outcome of all our blabbering may not achieve a thing.

  16. #316

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Ang View Post
    Well, how to promote creativity when you are busy trying to get food on the table? An expats with 5 digits salary juz need to get creative. They don't try to think of how to get the moola for tonight's dinner.
    Going by your reasoning, the locals will neber ever produce any creative works.
    which is why i said...pathetic.

    Only 2 of them really prove themselves to be the creative bunch.

    The rest of the local agencies will just tell themselves...."Forget about creativity, think about the food tnight."

    If that is the vision of their company, they will never never grow....and on par with the global agencies.

    They will forever stuck at this local, small size.
    and clients will still go for the Ang moh Creatives.

    Blame who?? Blame ourselves lor.
    We created an opportunity for the ang mohs to justified their high pay.


  17. #317

    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoky View Post
    For a start, I have a suggestion to make with regards to HR and employment.
    Remove the below questions when hiring such as: (if possible make it a law)

    1. Place of birth
    2. Age
    3. Citizenship
    4. National Service status
    5. Number of Dependants / Family members
    6. Maritial Status
    7. Race
    8. Religion
    9. Employment status (some employers tend to cut-throat retrenched employees knowing that they are out of job)

    The above typically has nothing to do with the job. In the U.S., if an employer asks you the above, you can sue for being profiled / discriminated.
    Since the employer doesn't know if you are foreigner / local, he / she can only evaluate you through your merits / qualifications / experiences.

    Do you think this possible in SG?
    Yes, I agree with all the above except no 3.

    You don't seem to know what's the problem with small business. Many of my friends those owning small business (5 staffs or less) will be very difficult to employ EP holders. The chance of rejection is quite high. So it's kinda waste of time and effort, if after interviewing, in the end, the candidate can't get a work pass. That's why they need to know the citizen status. If not citizen/PR, straight away the application form will be fed to the shredder.

  18. #318
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    One thing definately have to add in is the photographs.
    Andy Ang :lovegrin: - "A Photo speaks a thousand words. Have you spoken today?"
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  19. #319
    Senior Member creampuff's Avatar
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Actually while I believe there is quite a lot of issues already discussed, there is a confusion between citizen's rights and employee rights. To me citizen's rights (exemplified by NS) is not an issue and shouldn't be one in the context of discussion. For example, a fresh grad from the university will have a higher starting salary having completed NS. That alone is an head start. From then onwards, how one's career path develops is really up to the individual.

    Like it or not, foreign talent and labour do contribute to the economy. With regards to foreign workers, this country needs them because there's not enough locals to do or want to do the manual and low cost jobs. As for the FT professionals, they are here to fill a gap in the labour market that the local population can't easily fill.

    The crux of the problem is really about worker's rights, which is almost non-existent here. By this I'm not talking about the far end of the spectrum (strikes or work stoppage for better conditions), but very basic stuff. Discrimination by employers on maternity leave and benefits, discrimination against older workers, minimum wage, etc.

    If locals feel aggrieved that FT are having their cake and eating it at their expense, perhaps they should direct their fury and angst at local businesses and employers and their hiring policies. But then again, if you want to attract the best from all over the world, what carrots do you have to offer? My take is that disgruntled Singaporeans are barking up the wrong tree and should count their blessings for what they already have.

  20. #320
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    Default Re: Employ Singaporeans for what?

    Quote Originally Posted by creampuff View Post
    For example, a fresh grad from the university will have a higher starting salary having completed NS. That alone is an head start. From then onwards, how one's career path develops is really up to the individual.
    Lol, you called that a head start?

    Guys spend 2 yrs in army, come out 2 years later, with say $250 more then others. Called head start?

    Example a girl, finished school. Go work for 2 years (while the guys are in army). Got 2 years of salary plus increment, which is almost equivalent with the $250 extra now, plus 2 years of working experience (while the guys have none), plus 2 years of bonus, plus seniority. Most probably when the guy started to work, they will find their classmates (girls) their senior or even their direct manager by then.
    Andy Ang :lovegrin: - "A Photo speaks a thousand words. Have you spoken today?"
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