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Thread: Recommended Media for archive

  1. #1

    Default Recommended Media for archive

    Hi. Ever since i switched from film to digital, the space in my computer and ext HD is filling up fast. discovering RAW format only made my suitation worse .

    So right now, i was wondering which kind of media is more recommended, another ext HD, or DVD-RAM? (I ruled out dvd-r due to the need to rewrite files, and also dvd-rw due to its unreliability for long time archiving)

    some might be wondering why i chose DVD-RAM. basically, what happened to my friend was that he has a stack of ext HD. whenever he finished fillling up one with photos, he would go buy another one. so in his cupboard, there are quite alot of HD which contains infomation and some are left untouched for quite some time. however, lately, i asked him to show me some of our old class pictures. he plugged in the ext HD, and it started making funny noise. it was spoilt.

    so basically, dvd-ram seems to be the more reliable choice since some particular dvds would be left untouched for quite a long time. and even if one dvd is spoilt, the damage won't be that great.

    however, what's pulling me back is the future support for dvd-ram. i believe some here have heard of ZIP and MO disks. my mum still have some MO disks with infomation, but the drive is long unavailable.

    being relatively new at digital archiving, i was wondering if my fears are justified and if there are any other things i need to consider or forgotten. do share some experiences. thanks!

    PS: no monster huge data storage like buffalo. too expensive.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    every media is vulnerable to problems.

    for me, i have my photos on the hard disk, a backup hard disk as well as on a dvd-r.
    the odds of two having problems at any time should be quite slim. it doesn't mean dvd-ram will not have problems.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    You need RAID 5 -Disk Array with hot spares.. haha

  4. #4

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by djork View Post
    every media is vulnerable to problems.

    for me, i have my photos on the hard disk, a backup hard disk as well as on a dvd-r.
    the odds of two having problems at any time should be quite slim. it doesn't mean dvd-ram will not have problems.
    so do you have any hard disks stacking up now? and what's the size of your hard disks? any problems or inconvinence you having now or last time?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    always have 2 copies, either hd+dvd or dvd+dvd. dvd media got lifespan so make copies again after 1 yr.

    for hardisks, keep them powered up at least once a week.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    I'm using internal 3HDD RAID 5 setup. Giving me 500GB worth of space. It uses 2 CD drive slots, so my CD drive is now on external casing.

    If the above still not enough... I use "del" button on those less then favorable pics.

    As you progress, you'll notice that you'll accept less and less pics anyway.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    I always thought DVD-RW was a good media for archiving. Does anyone know how long its shelf life is? I think changing it after 1 year is way too early. 5 years perhaps? 10 years? Anyone have any data on this?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by digisnap View Post
    I always thought DVD-RW was a good media for archiving. Does anyone know how long its shelf life is? I think changing it after 1 year is way too early. 5 years perhaps? 10 years? Anyone have any data on this?
    Due the the chemical make up

    DVD RW have about on average 2-5 years shelf life. But it very much depends on storage condition.

    DVD R will have longer shelf life of up to 10-20 years. But then again, storage condition is also a major factor.

    This is so because RW is designed to be "temporary" so the data would "fade" easier.

    Anyway... there's no diff between the shelf life of DVD +/- R/RW and DVD RAM.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by miniUltraman View Post
    You need RAID 5 -Disk Array with hot spares.. haha
    How about RAID6 with dual power and dual storage controller with 4 Fiber channel output to 4 fiber channel card on two clustered server, all running on a Online-UPS(Not switched) with bypass switch for maintenance plus a backup generator? How about all this plus a Remote site sych on the RAID6 LUN? And a continuous data protection software to backup everything to a VTL, then purging it to a LTO media?

    Comon.. get real.. your data isn't worth that much eh? Just burn a few copies of the DVDs. The easiest way will be to systematically do it. Work out a filling system for your pictures. That way, you dun have to keep archiving the same data. For me, I'll file my pics by the Month and Year. Then I'll just burn 2-3 copies of the new photos i generate every month and file it in my DVD folders. If i run out of space, just delete off the oldest month folder. In years to come, you might be able to re-archive your monthly DVD to some other newer technology that will be able to archive it by the year. A 1 month loss in pic is acceptable to me.. You decide what is the acceptable loss period for your pics. Unless u're a pro.. you have a different requirement altogether.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by AhSeng View Post
    How about RAID6 with dual power and dual storage controller with 4 Fiber channel output to 4 fiber channel card on two clustered server, all running on a Online-UPS(Not switched) with bypass switch for maintenance plus a backup generator? How about all this plus a Remote site sych on the RAID6 LUN? And a continuous data protection software to backup everything to a VTL, then purging it to a LTO media?

    Comon.. get real.. your data isn't worth that much eh? Just burn a few copies of the DVDs. The easiest way will be to systematically do it. Work out a filling system for your pictures. That way, you dun have to keep archiving the same data. For me, I'll file my pics by the Month and Year. Then I'll just burn 2-3 copies of the new photos i generate every month and file it in my DVD folders. If i run out of space, just delete off the oldest month folder. In years to come, you might be able to re-archive your monthly DVD to some other newer technology that will be able to archive it by the year. A 1 month loss in pic is acceptable to me.. You decide what is the acceptable loss period for your pics. Unless u're a pro.. you have a different requirement altogether.
    erm... guys? why suddenly talk about raid arrays? i was asking about ext HDs vs DVD-RAMs. please read first post. i noticed that it is diverging as the thread advances.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    erm... guys? why suddenly talk about raid arrays? i was asking about ext HDs vs DVD-RAMs. please read first post. i noticed that it is diverging as the thread advances.
    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN
    Anyway... there's no diff between the shelf life of DVD +/- R/RW and DVD RAM.
    I tot I replied.
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  12. #12

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    I tot I replied.
    so you recommend dvd-ram or ext HD?

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    DVD+/-RW is a better choice in term of $ when compared to a DVD-RAM... iirc one DVD-RAM cost about $10 while a DVD+/-RW is only $2.
    and most older dvd rom ain't able to take DVD-RAM

  14. #14

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    so you recommend dvd-ram or ext HD?
    For stability, DVD. HDD can die anytime due to too many potential failure points.

    But what happened to your friend may happen to DVD-RAM too. You need to have a system to check and/or re-burn them annually.

    And it's also human nature that once it's outta sight, it's outta mind.
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  15. #15
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    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    blu-ray drive will be good for u..... 25gb storage per disc..... each disc is about $50 ... the drive itself is around $1000...

  16. #16

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    For stability, DVD. HDD can die anytime due to too many potential failure points.

    But what happened to your friend may happen to DVD-RAM too. You need to have a system to check and/or re-burn them annually.

    And it's also human nature that once it's outta sight, it's outta mind.
    actually, one of the reasons why i chose dvd-ram is that it can retain data for 30 years minimum. and it is really one of those medium which has write verify intergrated into their hardware. and so far, i hear much more cases of hard disks failure than dvd-ram failure.

    but the usual argument would be that 30 years might be an overkill.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    sorry if i seem to OT abit.. but i think it's within the lines of thought here...

    wat kind of filing/archival system do u guys use? by date? or by genre of photography? or what? or do u guys have 2 separate systems? i know it's time consuming but will it cut down on retrieval time? im asking cos im trying to work out a better filing system for myself..

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    actually, one of the reasons why i chose dvd-ram is that it can retain data for 30 years minimum. and it is really one of those medium which has write verify intergrated into their hardware. and so far, i hear much more cases of hard disks failure than dvd-ram failure.

    but the usual argument would be that 30 years might be an overkill.
    you heard far lesser DVD-ram failure because the number of ppl using it as compared to HDD are far far far far far lesser... think of it this way. 100com = 100hdd (excluding 2nd drive or ext) but out of the 100 there might only be one person using dvd-ram.

    and it doesn't have to be dvd-ram in order to do a write verify... im able to verify with nero as well be it CD-R, CD-RW, DVD-R or DVD-RW.

    blu-ray drive will be good for u..... 25gb storage per disc..... each disc is about $50 ... the drive itself is around $1000...
    I rather get portable HDD.. Seagate 60GB for $100 including case. more prone to failure but with that $, i can easily get 2-3drive and do back up. Chances of all of them fail at the same time are <0.01%

    sorry if i seem to OT abit.. but i think it's within the lines of thought here...

    wat kind of filing/archival system do u guys use? by date? or by genre of photography? or what? or do u guys have 2 separate systems? i know it's time consuming but will it cut down on retrieval time? im asking cos im trying to work out a better filing system for myself..
    Easiest is by date.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by satay16 View Post
    actually, one of the reasons why i chose dvd-ram is that it can retain data for 30 years minimum. and it is really one of those medium which has write verify intergrated into their hardware. and so far, i hear much more cases of hard disks failure than dvd-ram failure.

    but the usual argument would be that 30 years might be an overkill.
    30 years is the theoretical lifespan for all types of DVD and CD medium. However, most only last 2 - 5 years.

    At the end of the day, you'll still need to have another solution when your collection piles up.
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  20. #20

    Default Re: Recommended Media for archive

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    30 years is the theoretical lifespan for all types of DVD and CD medium. However, most only last 2 - 5 years.

    At the end of the day, you'll still need to have another solution when your collection piles up.
    gee.....wondering why alot of info i got from many internet sources differ from yours.

    anyway, i have been calculating the cost of using both methods. anyone knows the price of a buffulo terastation? have this crazy idea that if the buffulo is within a certain price limit, it make be the cheapest method for me.

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