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Thread: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

  1. #81

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    How nice! Wish can be like u but i only got to sleep under the rose in my garden!
    Christmas coming, can try Christmas tree.

    Lights are optional

  2. #82

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    1995-6 period got ppl bought bishan HDB Executive flat for S$1 Million.
    Toh Yi drive, got ppl offer 850K for my dad's 2nd flr exec flat. Lucky my dad never sell to him, else they can also jia ga gi.
    But we manage to sell at 505K a few years down the road, we lugi but at least save the other person's ass.
    I'm wondering how are the poor souls doing right now...those who bought at sk high prices. Feel sad for them though.

  3. #83
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by VR Man View Post
    Christmas coming, can try Christmas tree.

    Lights are optional
    Not a bad idea! can gif it a try but the tree can survive our climate?

  4. #84
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryonpepper View Post
    1995-6 period got ppl bought bishan HDB Executive flat for S$1 Million.
    Toh Yi drive, got ppl offer 850K for my dad's 2nd flr exec flat. Lucky my dad never sell to him, else they can also jia ga gi.
    But we manage to sell at 505K a few years down the road, we lugi but at least save the other person's ass.
    I'm wondering how are the poor souls doing right now...those who bought at sk high prices. Feel sad for them though.
    Ya...dat period is call the crazy period glad dat there is no more!

    Those buy at sky hi price now can only stay till retirement n working very hard to upkeep the monthly installment

  5. #85
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryonpepper View Post
    1995-6 period got ppl bought bishan HDB Executive flat for S$1 Million.
    Toh Yi drive, got ppl offer 850K for my dad's 2nd flr exec flat. Lucky my dad never sell to him, else they can also jia ga gi.
    But we manage to sell at 505K a few years down the road, we lugi but at least save the other person's ass.
    I'm wondering how are the poor souls doing right now...those who bought at sk high prices. Feel sad for them though.
    I buy mine at 400K for 5I. Now selling at 300K

  6. #86
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CreaXion View Post
    I buy mine at 400K for 5I. Now selling at 300K
    Where? Bishan?

  7. #87
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    Where? Bishan?
    No lah. Clementi area

  8. #88
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CreaXion View Post
    No lah. Clementi area
    Clementi still ok will nt fall below $300k some other pl go below $300k

  9. #89

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    You could work out the cost psf if you really wanted to but as a rule of thumb developers want a 40% profit min when they build a condo

    The price is as it should be market driven.

    Find some land that sold in your area get the psf divide the number of units over the land area drop the 40% and see whats left.

  10. #90
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by waynem View Post
    You could work out the cost psf if you really wanted to but as a rule of thumb developers want a 40% profit min when they build a condo

    The price is as it should be market driven.

    Find some land that sold in your area get the psf divide the number of units over the land area drop the 40% and see whats left.
    dun think so.... different parcel of land diff price be it in same area or nt

  11. #91

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CreaXion View Post

    2. Govt has tried ways and means of controlling price of HDB. Before 1997 or 8, the price of the HDB flats are ridiculous. Govt in order to prevent prices from spiraling out of control due to speculative purposes, introduced measures to curb speculation. Since then prices has been more or less quite stable or lesser. That is why I suffered a big loss. Jialat
    This one I dun agree... new HDB price was controlled in the first place. It's Govt that allowed the price to float at market value that created the first problem... then Govt added measures to prevent speculation, but if you look at the solution closely. It's still penalising buyers/sellers more $$$.
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  12. #92

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

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  13. #93
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    This one I dun agree... new HDB price was controlled in the first place. It's Govt that allowed the price to float at market value that created the first problem... then Govt added measures to prevent speculation, but if you look at the solution closely. It's still penalising buyers/sellers more $$$.
    For eg?

  14. #94

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    For eg?
    Already mentioned below.

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    dun think so.... different parcel of land diff price be it in same area or nt
    even the exact same plot of land will be differently priced*.

    *Disclaimer:
    The above statement was made out of jest and to provide some humour as seen with the use of the internet smilie and have no solid backing whatsoever to the statement made.

    You agree that by reading that statement you will not hold me or ClubSNAP liable for any loss, damages or injuries caused either directly or indirectly as a result of reading or using the above statement in this post.
    Last edited by yanyewkay; 3rd November 2006 at 05:47 PM.
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  16. #96

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Something no one brought up..

    http://www.parliament.gov.sg/Publica...ee%20_Parl.pdf

    para 26... car park... left pocket -> right pocket... but still kena.
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  17. #97

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    So what? HDB doesn't sell flats at $500k, it's resellers. Nobody forced you to buy the HDB flat to begin with.

    In fact, nobody forced you to live in Singapore, you can migrate to Australia if you want and get a big house for $500k.

    So if you don't want to be in debt for the next 25 years-- simple, don't buy.

    Did you expect the govt to give you 5-room flats for $10k? Or bungalows for $500k?

    Even if they could (and we supposedly can, since we have so much national reserves)-- why should the govt do that? Are you entitled to it simply because you voted P A P?

    If you expect HDB to be a money-losing organisation, you're in the wrong country.

    ===
    The cost of building a flat is typically not the highest component of the total cost, esp. if the flat is very tall. Construction is not that expensive, once you build so many units, there's economies of scale.

    Any property agent will tell you the cost of a property depends mainly on location. In other words, if you're harping on how much HDB flats cost to build, you're looking at the wrong aspect of the cost.

    Now, the question is, how much does HDB pay for land vs how much private developers pay. And how much profit should HDB make vs how much a private developer makes. Should HDB make profit at all?

    1. Should HDB sell at flats at the cost of construction? Of course not, then HDB will be losing money if it has to pay for land. In the long run, HDB will go bankrupt.

    2. Should HDB sell flats at the cost of construction + cost of acquiring the land + its own overheads? In other words, just cover cost.

    That depends on whether you believe HDB should be a non-profit organisation. While it sounds good, if HDB does this, it could "spoil" market and bring down a lot of property prices, both HDB and condos. It could also create huge queues at HDB as people want to strike lottery rather than buy resale.

    3. Should HDB sell flats at below market cost (ie compare to resale market) but still make a profit from selling the flats?

    I think that's what people are unhappy. That govt makes money from people. But you have to realise, if HDB don't make the $$, then the balloters will. And if HDB sells too cheap, then guess what?-- everyone will want to ballot, as a result the demand for resale flats will come down, then the resellers will also suffer.

    So which scenario you want? Of course, I know the best is HDB sell you at $100k and you sell to the market at $500k.

    Do you think that is sustainable, even assuming that it costs $100k to build a flat? Who will be so stupid to pay $500k if they can queue and get a flat for $100k?

    ===
    I've come to treat HDB as just another developer. I don't expect favours from them. Yes, their flats are cheaper than resale, but not that much cheaper. The so-called subsidy is really a discount from the resale price rather than a true subsidy (which would cash paid out of govt pockets). $ for $, their flats are cheaper but not as good as condos. Quality, finish, etc. are not as good. They got racial quotas, stupid restrictions, etc. You decide whether you want them.

    HDB mission is to provide affordable housing, but does not mean that they cannot make profit, esp from selling bigger flats. This mission is fulfilled through providing low rental flats for those in need, providing cheap housing loans, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teo View Post
    Well, if a unit sell for $500K and the particular block is having 24 stories with 4 units each level. Simple calculations : $500K x 4 x 24 = $48 million for a block of flat which only last for 99 years?? vs the actual materail cost...wow big profit man... .. and how much land area can a point block occupy?

    So you know who is the richest developer here?
    Check it out our neighbouring country with S$500K, you living in big big landed property..

    Not to foget, lets say for a average salary man to buy a 5-rm flat using 25 years loan from your CPF...do you still get to see $$ in you CPF when you retire?
    Last edited by waileong; 3rd November 2006 at 06:25 PM.

  18. #98

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    So what? HDB doesn't sell flats at $500k, it's resellers. Nobody forced you to buy the HDB flat to begin with.

    In fact, nobody forced you to live in Singapore, you can migrate to Australia if you want and get a big house for $500k.

    So if you don't want to be in debt for the next 25 years-- simple, don't buy.

    Did you expect the govt to give you 5-room flats for $10k? Or bungalows for $500k?

    Even if they could (and we supposedly can, since we have so much national reserves)-- why should the govt do that? Are you entitled to it simply because you voted ***?

    ===
    HDB mission is to provide affordable housing, but does not mean that they cannot make profit, esp from selling bigger flats. This mission is fulfilled through providing low rental flats for those in need, providing cheap housing loans, etc.

    If you expect HDB to be a money-losing organisation, you're in the wrong country.

    quote you in parts... pls see answer here...page 11 s/n 30.

    However, what I dun understand is this... mabbe need an accountant to explain.
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  19. #99
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong View Post
    So what? HDB doesn't sell flats at $500k, it's resellers. Nobody forced you to buy the HDB flat to begin with.

    In fact, nobody forced you to live in Singapore, you can migrate to Australia if you want and get a big house for $500k.

    So if you don't want to be in debt for the next 25 years-- simple, don't buy.

    Did you expect the govt to give you 5-room flats for $10k? Or bungalows for $500k?

    Even if they could (and we supposedly can, since we have so much national reserves)-- why should the govt do that? Are you entitled to it simply because you voted P A P?

    If you expect HDB to be a money-losing organisation, you're in the wrong country.

    ===
    The cost of building a flat is typically not the highest component of the total cost, esp. if the flat is very tall. Construction is not that expensive, once you build so many units, there's economies of scale.

    Any property agent will tell you the cost of a property depends mainly on location. In other words, if you're harping on how much HDB flats cost to build, you're looking at the wrong aspect of the cost.

    Now, the question is, how much does HDB pay for land vs how much private developers pay. And how much profit should HDB make vs how much a private developer makes. Should HDB make profit at all?

    1. Should HDB sell at flats at the cost of construction? Of course not, then HDB will be losing money if it has to pay for land. In the long run, HDB will go bankrupt.

    2. Should HDB sell flats at the cost of construction + cost of acquiring the land + its own overheads? In other words, just cover cost.

    That depends on whether you believe HDB should be a non-profit organisation. While it sounds good, if HDB does this, it could "spoil" market and bring down a lot of property prices, both HDB and condos. It could also create huge queues at HDB as people want to strike lottery rather than buy resale.

    3. Should HDB sell flats at below market cost (ie compare to resale market) but still make a profit from selling the flats?

    I think that's what people are unhappy. That govt makes money from people. But you have to realise, if HDB don't make the $$, then the balloters will. And if HDB sells too cheap, then guess what?-- everyone will want to ballot, as a result the demand for resale flats will come down, then the resellers will also suffer.

    So which scenario you want? Of course, I know the best is HDB sell you at $100k and you sell to the market at $500k.

    Do you think that is sustainable, even assuming that it costs $100k to build a flat? Who will be so stupid to pay $500k if they can queue and get a flat for $100k?

    ===
    I've come to treat HDB as just another developer. I don't expect favours from them. Yes, their flats are cheaper than resale, but not that much cheaper. The so-called subsidy is really a discount from the resale price rather than a true subsidy (which would cash paid out of govt pockets). $ for $, their flats are cheaper but not as good as condos. Quality, finish, etc. are not as good. They got racial quotas, stupid restrictions, etc. You decide whether you want them.

    HDB mission is to provide affordable housing, but does not mean that they cannot make profit, esp from selling bigger flats. This mission is fulfilled through providing low rental flats for those in need, providing cheap housing loans, etc.

    No coments!

  20. #100

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    It's very simple. MBT don't want to say how much profit HDB makes. He only say that they have a deficit. Note he didn't say "loss" which would be the usual term that is the opposite of "profit".

    Deficit seems to imply that HDB collected $530M less each year than it should have simply because it sold them below resale prices.

    They don't want to answer because it's politically sensitive.

    But again I ask-- so what? You voted this party, they form the govt, now they run HDB in this way. You don't want them to run HDB in this way-- don't vote this party, don't let them form the govt.

    But I think that it is highly difficult for HDB to sell a flat for $100k if the market price is $500k. If so, then (a) HDB will have overwhelming demand; (b) resale flats will have much less demand. And simple economics then tells us that will tend to knock down the price of resale flats (assuming HDB doesn't increase prices due to higher demand) so as to reach an equilibrium.

    Which means the resale price will drop from $500k to whatever premium people feel is fair for a resale flat bearing in mind they can queue and ballot for an HDB flat at $100k.

    You can't run away from economics.


    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    However, what I dun understand is this... mabbe need an accountant to explain.
    Last edited by waileong; 3rd November 2006 at 09:00 PM.

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