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Thread: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

  1. #181

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    Who will employ the employees if the employers go out of business? The government of France is very pro-employee, but guess what, unemployment is high and it is worse for the young and new graduates.

    The best way for a government to look after its citizens to to make sure the employers and businesses can survive in a tough business environment.
    Let me state my position, tthere should be a balance, but it should not be one sided.

  2. #182
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    There is a saying:" Dun ask what the Nation can give u but ask what u can contribute to the Nation!"

    "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country," JFK (1961), he spoke of the need for all Americans to be active citizens. Active Singaporeans? I don't think JFK meant exercise active. Are Singaporeans active, say politically?

    I will stop here, less I get deported, being a foreigner (from the land 50km North).

  3. #183

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Ok, upon your request, I will not mention about paying tax to feed the ministers.
    Thanks!

    But I do pay tax when I earned 3k per month, assuming no tax relief, I have to pay $720 for income tax.
    well... to put things into perspective, that's $60 a month. Even the power bill (mine at least) is higher than that.

  4. #184

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    There is a saying:" Dun ask what the Nation can give u but ask what u can contribute to the Nation!"
    Then pls remove all those OB markers and let us explore.
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  5. #185

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw View Post
    Who will employ the employees if the employers go out of business? The government of France is very pro-employee, but guess what, unemployment is high and it is worse for the young and new graduates.

    The best way for a government to look after its citizens to to make sure the employers and businesses can survive in a tough business environment.
    This I agree, business must come first...else who will provide employment in the first place. So pro-business envrioment is a win-win situation for everyone.

    However, as an Govt elected by it's citizens, it cannot totally ignore the citizen's cries for a better live. Cost like public housing,transport and utilities are stretching it's citizens resources thin even when policies allows for pro-business envrioment... something will eventually give way. The question is should it be the Govt vast coffers or it's citizens to take the brunt of it.
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  6. #186

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Gentlemen;

    It is getting very interesting with so many people putting up controversial points for discussion. We debate about Health care, then Public housing and now employment. We are like in the Parliament, don’t we? Elites trying to defense the policies while the Oppositions try to overturn it.…Hahaha.

    My Friend went to Job Fair last year. He is 28 years old and had just completed his basic degree. He wanted to join the Arm force. He first went to the Police booth, then the Air force and lastly the Army. He was rejected by all three, reason given was over age, cut off age is 27. When my friend asked why cut off at 27, the unanimous answer was “Older Man can’t keep up with the physical”. But my friend is an athlete, he clocks below 8 minutes for 2.4 and do a minimum of15 chin up.
    Government is one of the biggest employer and is practicing preferential selection, I can’t see why others employers are not following. This may also explain why, in the newspapers, it is common to see job advertisement which says: below 25 years old, Mandarin speaking and Female.
    In unionized countries, you will be in deep troubles if you can’t proof rigorously why 25 years and older, non mandarin speaking and a male can’t do the same job.

    The garment is also not keen to create jobs for Singaporeans. Why I say that?

    Driverless North-East Line.

    Pro
    Less labour

    Cons
    Train fare more expensive than SMRT.
    Cost more to build.
    Cost more to maintain.
    Cost more to operate.
    Prone to technical problems.

  7. #187
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Gentlemen;

    It is getting very interesting with so many people putting up controversial points for discussion. We debate about Health care, then Public housing and now employment. We are like in the Parliament, don’t we? Elites trying to defense the policies while the Oppositions try to overturn it.…Hahaha.

    My Friend went to Job Fair last year. He is 28 years old and had just completed his basic degree. He wanted to join the Arm force. He first went to the Police booth, then the Air force and lastly the Army. He was rejected by all three, reason given was over age, cut off age is 27. When my friend asked why cut off at 27, the unanimous answer was “Older Man can’t keep up with the physical”. But my friend is an athlete, he clocks below 8 minutes for 2.4 and do a minimum of15 chin up.
    Government is one of the biggest employer and is practicing preferential selection, I can’t see why others employers are not following. This may also explain why, in the newspapers, it is common to see job advertisement which says: below 25 years old, Mandarin speaking and Female.
    In unionized countries, you will be in deep troubles if you can’t proof rigorously why 25 years and older, non mandarin speaking and a male can’t do the same job.

    The garment is also not keen to create jobs for Singaporeans. Why I say that?

    Driverless North-East Line.

    Pro
    Less labour

    Cons
    Train fare more expensive than SMRT.
    Cost more to build.
    Cost more to maintain.
    Cost more to operate.
    Prone to technical problems.
    All the cons all becos of 1 word driverless
    Actual fact oso gt a guy in every trian mah...so nt excatly driveress

  8. #188
    919956g
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CreaXion View Post
    To be on the fair side, think abt it in this way.

    1. Pp who lived in developed countries in the city areas like Japan is even worse. Take Tokyo for example. The common pp are staying in houses that are much smaller and much more expensive. That is why Japan expats love to stay in Singapore.

    2. Govt has tried ways and means of controlling price of HDB. Before 1997 or 8, the price of the HDB flats are ridiculous. Govt in order to prevent prices from spiraling out of control due to speculative purposes, introduced measures to curb speculation. Since then prices has been more or less quite stable or lesser. That is why I suffered a big loss. Jialat

    3. Some pp argue that Govt has to earn money from pp to sustain the ministers pay. Think of it in this way. Singapore Ministers and high officials has high pay so dun need to be corrupt. Other countries (dun need to mention what countries hah) low pay so corruption exist. Biz men who came in from overseas to Singapore know exact cost. Can calculate cut loss pt or expenditure. Biz men go other countries lost money also dunno why die.

    4. Some pp also say why ministers must have high pay. They are serving the pp. Difference of opinions. I actually supports the view that ministers shd get pay like CEO. Afterall, Singapore is like a big MNC. Singapore if I am correct is the top 20 richest country in the world. That itself is a super big achievement considering the size of Singapore and lack of natural resources.

    5. Revenue generated from sale of hdb flats is to generate more money for the economy. More money means money can be used to support functions like IMF mtgs to raise reputation of Singapore. Reputation improve means more investments in. More investments in means more job. Part of economics leh. BTW this is just one eg only.

    Last thing is a disclaimer cause my whole yr is till very much lesser than a minister pay.
    yes i used to live in asia foreign land before /orruption dan qialat/////the polis say their pay is low

  9. #189

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Gentlemen;

    He first went to the Police booth, then the Air force and lastly the Army. He was rejected by all three, reason given was over age, cut off age is 27. When my friend asked why cut off at 27, the unanimous answer was “Older Man can’t keep up with the physical”. But my friend is an athlete, he clocks below 8 minutes for 2.4 and do a minimum of15 chin up.
    actually i find it quite strange that police rejected him because i have a close fren who joined the police force as a senior officer 2 years ago and he was 30 plus! if he's still hasn't found a job, maybe can ask him to call up the recruitment hotline to try again, it's always better to have more cops to patrol our country and not many ppl seem keen to join the blue boys these days.

  10. #190

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by feryl View Post
    actually i find it quite strange that police rejected him because i have a close fren who joined the police force as a senior officer 2 years ago and he was 30 plus! if he's still hasn't found a job, maybe can ask him to call up the recruitment hotline to try again, it's always better to have more cops to patrol our country and not many ppl seem keen to join the blue boys these days.
    Thanks Feryl for sharing the information. I will convey your message to my friend.

    Is your close friend a prison warrant officer? If I remember correct, my friend was told to join the Prison warrant, but he does not have an honour degree. They pay First Class and second class differently and you can’t join the officer rank if you do not have an honour degree, right?

  11. #191

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Brother,

    Thanks for your consolation. You are very right, A dollar in the future is worth less in today’s value. But Net Present value is not going to help me because I have no capital to start with and the monthly $700 is my future money. And I will again be sad if I look into the ROI of my foregone 57k. If I invest $2280 annually for 25 years with a return of 4%, on top of the 57k principle sum that I have saved, I still earn an interest of $41,000.

    About downgrading, not everyone has that kind of luxury, especially for those who bought their properties at high price. I assume downgrading from a four room flat, you will have to pay a resale levy of $40,000. If you sell at $220,000 and buy a three room at $160,000. How much you got left after paying the agent fee; GST; lawyer fee; stamp duty and resale levy? All these assuming that you have pay up your loan fully.

    I have heard about this, but not very sure. If your flat tenure is less than 30 years, banks will not provide loan. This could mean your old flat will not have much resale value, since buyer could not loan form the bank.

    Ok, upon your request, I will not mention about paying tax to feed the ministers.
    But I do pay tax when I earned 3k per month, assuming no tax relief, I have to pay $720 for income tax.
    Hello everyone:

    I am very concern about the above statement highlighted in red. Anyone from the bank, can please advise me?

    Does HDB reset the 99 lease when I buy a 30 year old resale flat? Or do they continue with 69 years of lease left?
    Last edited by Silence Sky; 11th November 2006 at 11:33 AM.

  12. #192

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Hello everyone:

    I am very concern about the above statement highlighted in red. Anyone from the bank, can please advise me?

    Does HDB reset the 99 lease when I buy a 30 year old resale flat? Or do they continue with 69 years of lease left?

    No resetting.

    However, I've yet to see a 70 yrs old HDB.

    The oldest flats in TPY, Queenstown...etc have been SERed.
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  13. #193

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Thanks Feryl for sharing the information. I will convey your message to my friend.

    Is your close friend a prison warrant officer? If I remember correct, my friend was told to join the Prison warrant, but he does not have an honour degree. They pay First Class and second class differently and you can’t join the officer rank if you do not have an honour degree, right?
    He joined police force as a Asst Superintendent. Prison Service is a different dept altogether.
    From what i know there are 2 kinds of officer grade. If you have a normal degree, you're eligible for Inspector rank. If you have an Honours Degree (second upper and above) then you get Asst Superintendent rank.

  14. #194

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by CYRN View Post
    No resetting.

    However, I've yet to see a 70 yrs old HDB.

    The oldest flats in TPY, Queenstown...etc have been SERed.
    Exactly, some blocks around my area are considered ancient, but they're still only 30 years old, and they've already been upgrade or earmarked for selective en-bloc.

    I think Singapore wldn't allow old flats to remain for too long, since it may actually cost more to maintain them as opposed to rebuilding them for a higher market value, even for owners.

    This is especially since older flats tend to be on prime land. For example, the condos around where i stay (Tiong Bahru) can easily sell for $1 million per unit (by comparison, new HDB flats there cost $350 if you're new buyer and $450 if you buy resale); i don't think the govt wans to keep 30 yr old flats with low market value there.

  15. #195

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    In 1970, a 4 room flat cost $20,000
    In 2000, a 4 room flat cost $180,000

    Above firgures cited from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_Development_Board.

    Mr A. Median household income 2000 is $ 3607 (figure cited from Wikipedia), average cost of 4 rm $180,000
    Mr B. Median household income 1975 is $ 850 (my own estimation), average cost of 4 rm $25,000

    Assuming 20% of the income is used to service housing loan at 2.6% interest.

    Mr A will take 30 years to service the loan.
    Mr B will take 15 years to service the loan.

    If A and B both started off at age 30 and retire at 60.
    Mr A will have no time to build his nest egg.
    Mr B, on the hand, has another 15 years to build his nest egg.

    I find this worrying. the garment sounded the alarm as early as 2002 and we are still pretending to be deaf.

    Garment raised the official retirement age from 55 to 62, and recently went on to say work for as long as you can.

    Remember home ownership is one of the cornerstones in government policy?
    Today’s Straits Times: More rental flats to be built to help the poor families.
    Last edited by Silence Sky; 11th November 2006 at 04:31 PM.

  16. #196

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by feryl View Post
    He joined police force as a Asst Superintendent. Prison Service is a different dept altogether.
    From what i know there are 2 kinds of officer grade. If you have a normal degree, you're eligible for Inspector rank. If you have an Honours Degree (second upper and above) then you get Asst Superintendent rank.
    I see, thanks.

  17. #197

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HBD flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by 919956g View Post
    yes i used to live in asia foreign land before /orruption dan qialat/////the polis say their pay is low
    This is never an justification for corruption.

    How to define low... are they below the proverty line? Same here is Ex NKF CEO's pay too low?
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  18. #198

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by melvin View Post
    All the cons all becos of 1 word driverless
    Actual fact oso gt a guy in every trian mah...so nt excatly driveress
    Hahaha, now the probability of finding yrself a seat in MRT has decreased and the probability of you standing has increased.
    Can pack in more sardines now.

    We have the best public transport provider in the world. The only one that makes handsome profit.
    Last edited by Silence Sky; 12th November 2006 at 10:25 AM.

  19. #199

    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    I think it is right that our oldest estate is about 40 years old.
    If CYRN has got it right, there is no resetting of lease when you purchase a resale flat, then what is going to happen to a 25years old chap who bought a 40 years old resale flat?
    If this chap lives up to the age of 86, he’s going to be kicked out of the flat, wouldn’t he?

  20. #200
    Senior Member melvin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What is the actual cost of a HDB flat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Silence Sky View Post
    Brother,

    Thanks for your consolation......

    I have heard about this, but not very sure. If your flat tenure is less than 30 years, banks will not provide loan. This could mean your old flat will not have much resale value, since buyer could not loan form the bank.....
    1) Tenure of HDB flats is always 99yrs. Only factories have tenure of 30years!
    2) I believe the abv sentence should be "If your flat tenure is left with 30years or less, the banks will not provide loan."
    3) At the moment there is no flat under this category as yet.
    4) Most of these flat buyers will not be in dat situation, before they reach the above mention, as most of them will be hit by SERS.
    5) If your flat is really dat old just prepare for SERS no need to think abt resale and SERS get ready your reno contractor to do up your brand new home!

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