View Poll Results: Who should be at the paying end

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  • The Photographer(s)

    2 3.64%
  • The Model(s)

    8 14.55%
  • Noone should pay a single cent

    15 27.27%
  • The cost should be split equally

    30 54.55%
Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

  1. #1

    Default TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Well, i remember hosting one of the first few TFCDs here in CS when Selena and Nadia brot the term in (metinks)..... anyways....just like to hear some views from you guys regarding the topic....

    Who do you think should be at the paying end? Since most TFCDs i suppose have to employ makeup artists etc....
    Last edited by Witness; 24th October 2006 at 03:57 PM.

  2. #2
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    no one should pay as you can also find MUA who needs a portfolio
    win-win-win situation

  3. #3

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    yeah...but wat i wanted to find out is...what is the real situation here....been out of touch with these things man......

  4. #4
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    the situation in CS is that the photographer will pay
    I don't know why they do

    i am sure that there are model forums and MUA forums
    if you org things over there then it will be the other way round

    a few thousand models and a few photogs

  5. #5

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    actually... no one... unless can get MUA to join in "portfolio"....I believe models/talents should at least know how to makeup themselves.

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  6. #6

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    well...probably true...... but for me...i see a vast difference between a model doing her own makeup and that done by a makeup artist i trust....tt's y at the end of the day..i tend to split all the costs down with the model.....

  7. #7

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    both parties need something, so i say it should be split

    btw what is MUA?

  8. #8
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Quote Originally Posted by compro_1975 View Post
    both parties need something, so i say it should be split

    btw what is MUA?
    Make Up Artist

  9. #9
    Senior Member Cheesecake's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    the models-to-be gets their shots and practise, the MUA gets their shots and practise and the fotographer gets his/her shots and practise.

    win-for-all situation. everyone gets together and discuss abt the looks, the dressing and location. no monetary issue.




    test shoot should always be what it is, jus a chance for everyone to try out something new.
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  10. #10

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    well...but is this the situation here now? maybe one of the regulars can enlighten me on this

  11. #11
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    the person(s) who want the shoot to be conducted most pays; if involved parties see value in splitting any costs incurred, then let that be done. no ten year series answer for this i believe.

  12. #12

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Even if the tfcd session is totally without fees charged. Unfairness will always occur. Can there be a situation where model, photographer and mua came in with the same level of expertise, experience and commitment to the shoot? Can the three of them always think with one mind on how the concept is formed?

    Scenario 1:

    Pro Photographer, Pro MUA matched with amature model: Pro photographer came in with over 10K worth of photographic equipments + 5 years of experience + concept. Pro MUA came in with over 1k worth of make-up kit and 10 years of experience. Model had no idea what to do except having a pretty face and take instructions strictly from photographer and MUA.

    Result: Pictures turn out great! Photographer and MUA get to keep the photos, hoping that someone will give them jobs based on the pictures. Model gets to keep the photos too for her own portfolio and saved herself $1000+. At the end of the day, be it the pictures turn out good or bad, photographer and MUA have already invested into the shoot with no expected gains in return, while model have saved herself a sum of money from spending on pictures.

    Scenario 2:

    Amateur photographer, amateur MUA matched with Pro model: Don't think any pro model in her right frame of mind would want to waste time with this kind of arrangement.

    Scenario 3:

    Amateur photographer, amateur MUA matched with amateur model: This is probably the best arrangement for practise. However, it is still going to be very time consuming and resource draining over a period of time of making mistakes and trying to meet the industry standards. There is no telling how long this arrangement can last before a shot is produced to meet the industry standard. There is always a difference between a highly invested shot and a mug shot.

    Scenario 4:

    Pro photographer, pro MUA and pro model: This is definitely the best arrangement to build portfolio. They will make a great team to produce good pictures. But at the end of the day, since they are already pro, why are they so free to shoot for free? Shooting for free can never justify the costs of their equipments, props, rental, time and efforts. If justification is given for building portfolio and to realise their creativity, that is definitely very costly justification.

    Hence, relationship between these three groups of people is hardly equal. I can't see it as a win-win situation. When relationship is equal and everybody contributes a fair share so as to allow no fees charged, it is still a risk where there are no expected returns.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesecake View Post
    the models-to-be gets their shots and practise, the MUA gets their shots and practise and the fotographer gets his/her shots and practise.

    win-for-all situation. everyone gets together and discuss abt the looks, the dressing and location. no monetary issue.




    test shoot should always be what it is, jus a chance for everyone to try out something new.
    Last edited by Yezrah; 24th October 2006 at 06:17 PM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Cheesecake's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yezrah View Post
    Even if the tfcd session is totally without fees charged. Unfairness will always occur. Can there be a situation where model, photographer and mua came in with the same level of expertise, experience and commitment to the shoot? Can the three of them always think with one mind on how the concept is formed?

    Scenario 1:

    Pro Photographer, Pro MUA matched with amature model: Pro photographer came in with over 10K worth of photographic equipments + 5 years of experience + concept. Pro MUA came in with over 1k worth of make-up kit and 10 years of experience. Model had no idea what to do except having a pretty face and take instructions strictly from photographer and MUA.

    Result: Pictures turn out great! Photographer and MUA get to keep the photos, hoping that someone will give them jobs based on the pictures. Model gets to keep the photos too for her own portfolio and saved herself $1000+. At the end of the day, be it the pictures turn out good or bad, photographer and MUA have already invested into the shoot with no expected gains in return, while model have saved herself a sum of money from spending on pictures.

    Scenario 2:

    Amateur photographer, amateur MUA matched with Pro model: Don't think any pro model in her right frame of mind would want to waste time with this kind of arrangement.

    Scenario 3:

    Amateur photographer, amateur MUA matched with amateur model: This is probably the best arrangement for practise. However, it is still going to be very time consuming and resource draining over a period of time of making mistakes and trying to meet the industry standards. There is no telling how long this arrangement can last before a shot is produced to meet the industry standard. There is always a difference between a highly invested shot and a mug shot.

    Scenario 4:

    Pro photographer, pro MUA and pro model: This is definitely the best arrangement to build portfolio. They will make a great team to produce good pictures. But at the end of the day, since they are already pro, why are they so free to shoot for free? Shooting for free can never justify the costs of their equipments, props, rental, time and efforts. If justification is given for building portfolio and to realise their creativity, that is definitely very costly justification.

    Hence, relationship between these three groups of people is hardly equal. I can't see it as a win-win situation. When relationship is equal and everybody contributes a fair share so as to allow no fees charged, it is still a risk where there are no expected returns.
    erm, still, tfcd for all. yeah
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  14. #14

    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Of course its the best when one pays a single cent. Best if the models know how to make up then MUA won't be needed cause most likely tfcd have to pay for the MUA. But then again, if the photographers don't mind paying then no problem, if they think they shouldn't pay for the MUA cost then don't shoot.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Cheesecake's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Quote Originally Posted by Venom81 View Post
    Of course its the best when one pays a single cent. Best if the models know how to make up then MUA won't be needed cause most likely tfcd have to pay for the MUA. But then again, if the photographers don't mind paying then no problem, if they think they shouldn't pay for the MUA cost then don't shoot.
    well said. yeah!
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Quote Originally Posted by Witness View Post
    Well, i remember hosting one of the first few TFCDs here in CS when Selena and Nadia brot the term in (metinks)..... anyways....just like to hear some views from you guys regarding the topic....

    Who do you think should be at the paying end? Since most TFCDs i suppose have to employ makeup artists etc....
    haha, i still remember... think that was last yr april...? or last last yr april...?

    think nowadays seems like mostly photogs are paying for the MUA, of course the ideal situation is like what many have mentioned, no one pays at all. but i also not too sure.. haven shoot any tfcd for dunno how long liaoz.. haha..

  17. #17
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Quote Originally Posted by Witness View Post
    Well, i remember hosting one of the first few TFCDs here in CS when Selena and Nadia brot the term in (metinks)..... anyways....just like to hear some views from you guys regarding the topic....

    Who do you think should be at the paying end? Since most TFCDs i suppose have to employ makeup artists etc....
    It's really clear that for a TFCD, nobody pays for anything or expense have to be shared in equals parts (transportation, equipment renting ...).

    However, it's good politeness and quite accepted that photographers share the expense (mostly because most photographers are men and models are beautiful women )

  18. #18
    Senior Member Virgo's Avatar
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    Default Re: TFCD - Who should be at the paying end?

    Well, for transportation, I'll usually provide. However, if a MUA is engaged, I would appreciate very much if model and photographer can split the cost. It's overall a TFCD. Everyone has to contribute a bit to work towards a common goal, ie to create a good portfolio for everyone.

    Of course, if there's a MAU who wanted to chip in for a free makeup in return for his/her portfolio, that will be perfect.
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