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Thread: It's a wrap 2

  1. #21

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by student View Post
    BUT PHOTOGRAPHY ITSELF, does it require team work?

    Some of my photography friends, with images (OK, let me confine the imagery to people images) collected by museums, work totally alone. In fact they abhor working in teams. Too much noise. Maybe they might not be as successful financially as some of the professionals here. But hey, their images are collected by museums. And I can name a lot of photographers like them.
    If your photographs are meant for personal, non-commercial direction, then probably you are half right. But if for any reasons these images venture into commercial consumption, you still need some form of teamwork. Even though your talented friends took those images individually they still need a team in the museum to portray these images in the best light for the owners and viewers.... and I believe your talented friends would need some contacts to work as a team to sell those images to the museum.
    Also, every photographers know, to get that "perfect" image, most of the times we need Him to give us that "perfect" moment! That's teamwork ...
    always the Light, .... always.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    If your photographs are meant for personal, non-commercial direction, then probably you are half right. But if for any reasons these images venture into commercial consumption, you still need some form of teamwork. Even though your talented friends took those images individually they still need a team in the museum to portray these images in the best light for the owners and viewers.... and I believe your talented friends would need some contacts to work as a team to sell those images to the museum.
    That's not photography. That's called business.

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    Also, every photographers know, to get that "perfect" image, most of the times we need Him to give us that "perfect" moment! That's teamwork ...
    That's the illogical statement I've ever heard. I might just as well hang my camera and let it take photographs.

  3. #23

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    If your photographs are meant for personal, non-commercial direction, then probably you are half right. But if for any reasons these images venture into commercial consumption, you still need some form of teamwork. Even though your talented friends took those images individually they still need a team in the museum to portray these images in the best light for the owners and viewers.... and I believe your talented friends would need some contacts to work as a team to sell those images to the museum.
    You have confused photography with marketing.

    [/quote]Also, every photographers know, to get that "perfect" image, most of the times we need Him to give us that "perfect" moment! That's teamwork ...[/QUOTE]

    If one "stretches" the idea of "teamwork" like you, then Ced is right.

  4. #24

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisp View Post
    That's the illogical statement I've ever heard. I might just as well hang my camera and let it take photographs.
    Sorry, probably you took this comment too literally or seriously ....
    and probably you don't understand at all!
    always the Light, .... always.

  5. #25

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by student View Post
    You have confused photography with marketing.

    .
    Doc, no confusion at all.... i know what you are getting into, and also you have acepted the definations of "photography with marketing" and "photography for oneself".
    always the Light, .... always.

  6. #26
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    Sorry, probably you took this comment too literally or seriously ....
    and probably you don't understand at all!
    If you take making your own photographs seriously, you'd probably know my position.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Dammit..where's the edit button.

    I realised my statement maybe open to mis intepretation. The way you constructed your statement is a point noted in an arguement you're putting towards doc. Hence, that's why I took it as a serious contention.

  8. #28

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Why dun you guys stop OTing and let PBS conduct his class in whichever ways he likes and keeping this thread clean for people who are interest to register ????...

    Whatever BS .. let it be lor ..
    AMPA * WPPI * J team

  9. #29

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT ONG View Post
    Why dun you guys stop OTing and let PBS conduct his class in whichever ways he likes and keeping this thread clean for people who are interest to register ????...
    KO, my response was at his open invitation to give some thoughts about it. And is it not appropriate to share those thoughts?

    Quote Originally Posted by knight ong
    Whatever BS .. let it be lor ..
    You are entitled to your freedom to let BS be. Don't tell others what they wish to do with BS.

  10. #30

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised View Post
    Doc, no confusion at all.... i know what you are getting into, and also you have acepted the definations of "photography with marketing" and "photography for oneself".
    I am talking about PHOTOGRAPHY - the process of making a photograph. I hope you can understand that.

    I did NOT and do NOT accept the definition of "photography with marketing" and "photography for oneself". Those are your inventions.

    I am talking PHOTOGRAPHY. Period.

    There are some genres of photography which requires teamwork, such as fashion photography and the type of photography Ced is doing.

    But there are many genres of photography which do not require teamwork.

    Promoting and marketing oneself and one's images is not PHOTOGRAPHY. It is as what wisp wrote: BUSINESS. Business may be required to bring bread on the table for the photographer. But it is the business of photography. It is not photography.

  11. #31

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    let's leave the debate for another thread...

  12. #32
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Yeah I guess we could debate this in another thread. The brazilian creampie saga is still fresh on my mind...

  13. #33
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Alright, let this thread resume to organizing ppl to attend the workshops.

  14. #34
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots View Post
    11 Oct - Theory from 2000hrs - 2200 hrs
    18 Oct - Theory from 2000hrs - 2200 hrs
    25 Oct - Theory from 2000hrs - 2200 hrs
    11 Nov - Shoot from 1830hrs - 2200 hrs
    18 Nov - Shoot from 0800hrs - 1500 hrs
    22 Nov - Debrief from 2000hrs - 2200hrs
    09 Dec - Shoot from 0800hrs - 1500 hrs
    16 Dec - Shoot from 0800hrs - 1500 hrs
    How's the going Ced?

    Seems like you've chosen a rather busy period of the year to do this. You wanna think about it?

    Just my 2 cts worth, give me 5 cts and I'll remove it
    I get paid more shooting part time ...... damn, I should find more time to shoot part time

  15. #35

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Wow, really amazed how a few simple sentence sparked off a huge debate here...

    Photography is teamwork, I never said it applies to all forms of it... Through my thread, you see images of people that shot, made up, styled by and post produced, and I thought you would assumed that I was refering to myself. I should rephrase: Photography in my world, is teamwork. That's what I meant by teamwork...yup, the work I do is teamwork, and I never never said anything else ain't it? Really simple meaning... Maybe you took it too far in this instance...

    Good for you that teamwork didn't work for you and you've chosen to go relatively solo, and maybe that's why our images produced are different. I do enjoy sharp, crispy pictures, unlike the total mood feel you're sending out each and every time a see a post from you... I like your work and it's things I can't produce even if I try, simply because it's not my feel and emotions. Your work does not warrant a need for anybody creative to be next to you, however it's teamwork for me back here. And I'm also saying that through the eyes of many in the people I have taught, they've learn to see why in my world teamwork is important...

    I see many beautiful pictures in other threads, things that are done without the crew that I swear I'm proud of... Images that spoke a thousand words... Those images came out more superior than mine, but then again, I'm not bothered by it because it's a different field and genre all together...

    yeah, photography was never cheap to start, and perhaps your status as a surgeon/ doctor has provided for you a life many would be envy of at times when financial status is in check, not many will be able to really buy the things they need, and perhaps even save up to months to be able to buy something, perhaps you never had to, and perhaps photography was never something you had to hang onto for your dear life because it provides what life needs for me... Without a reasonable doubt I would say that we live for different things, photography this time...

    Student, I understand your rule in photography but I beg to differ from it.. simply because commercial photography respects one rule: We shoot what our clients want. We equipped ourselves with all skills to deliver the deliverables. Ask around and I think many photographers would have many other preset rules for themselves. You have yours, which is to shoot images you wish to convey, and take people's opinion at secondary level. However, your rule is my luxury, it's something I do not have... Just like you do not have an option when a life is in danger and your responsibility as a doctor is to save him/ her at every possibility, and I do not have an option then to deliver what clients may need, my only dignity is that I ensure I read through copy text, understand the visual, selling point, target audience etc etc before I commence...

    It's a luxury to be able to travel on a holiday and lurk a camera around shooting things and subjects you enjoy, because if I get a holiday, the only thing I lurk is my clothes and essentials and, my camera is not one of them...

    The way I look at it Student, you're an artist, and I encourage you to continue this form of art you indulged and it's something you stand so strong by, but I never claim to be an artist, I'm a commercial photographer. I hope you get this one right...

    Cheers,

    PBS

  16. #36

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by KNIGHT ONG View Post
    Why dun you guys stop OTing and let PBS conduct his class in whichever ways he likes and keeping this thread clean for people who are interest to register ????...

    Whatever BS .. let it be lor ..
    yup yup, gimme my thread back

  17. #37

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    01. simon80
    02. Nessie??
    03. WAINISM (for a friend)
    04.
    05.
    06.
    07.
    08.
    09.
    10.

    Anymore?

    PBS

  18. #38
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    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    update.

    01. simon80
    02. Nessie??
    03. Jon Ong - 9815 - 4145
    04.
    05.
    06.
    07.
    08.
    09.
    10.

    If there's anything unclear, do PM me..

    Many Thanks,

    PBS

  19. #39

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by yqt View Post
    How's the going Ced?

    Seems like you've chosen a rather busy period of the year to do this. You wanna think about it?

    Just my 2 cts worth, give me 5 cts and I'll remove it
    yeah, but will start anyway...would still go ahead, thanks YQT... How's money making?

  20. #40

    Default Re: It's a wrap 2

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots View Post
    Photography is teamwork, I never said it applies to all forms of it... Through my thread, you see images of people that shot, made up, styled by and post produced, and I thought you would assumed that I was refering to myself. I should rephrase: Photography in my world, is teamwork. That's what I meant by teamwork...yup, the work I do is teamwork, and I never never said anything else ain't it? Really simple meaning... Maybe you took it too far in this instance...
    Ced, I have absolutely no problem with working in a team, if I were to make photos like you! In fact, I think it is mandatory to have a team to make images like yours.

    No, I did not take it too far. I was only responding to a simple phrase. Perhaps it is the pecularity of what I do. To me, words carry meanings. Maybe I should change my mentality to assume that people here do not mean exactly what their words are supposed to mean.

    Yes, your re-phrasing would be much clearer!

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots
    why in my world teamwork is important...
    I agree 100% with that!


    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots
    yeah, photography was never cheap to start, and perhaps your status as a surgeon/ doctor has provided for you a life many would be envy of at times when financial status is in check, not many will be able to really buy the things they need, and perhaps even save up to months to be able to buy something, perhaps you never had to, and perhaps photography was never something you had to hang onto for your dear life because it provides what life needs for me... Without a reasonable doubt I would say that we live for different things, photography this time...
    Yes, I am grateful that I do not have to depend on photography for a living.

    But you are deviating from the issue at hand. And that was "that phrase" which seems so dogmatic and all-encompassing.

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots
    Student, I understand your rule in photography but I beg to differ from it.. simply because commercial photography respects one rule: We shoot what our clients want. We equipped ourselves with all skills to deliver the deliverables. Ask around and I think many photographers would have many other preset rules for themselves. You have yours, which is to shoot images you wish to convey, and take people's opinion at secondary level. However, your rule is my luxury, it's something I do not have... Just like you do not have an option when a life is in danger and your responsibility as a doctor is to save him/ her at every possibility, and I do not have an option then to deliver what clients may need, my only dignity is that I ensure I read through copy text, understand the visual, selling point, target audience etc etc before I commence...
    You are now not talking about photography rules and bending these rules.

    You are now talking about not breaking rules so as not to displease your clients.

    Quite different, isn't it?

    Quote Originally Posted by pointblankshots
    The way I look at it Student, you're an artist, and I encourage you to continue this form of art you indulged and it's something you stand so strong by, but I never claim to be an artist, I'm a commercial photographer. I hope you get this one right...
    Yes, I do understand that you are a commercial photographer. Your images as posted here made that very clear.

    Actually, this is the first time someone called me an "artist". I have never felt it that way about myself. I am frankly not interested in what people called me. Just wanted to make pictures that I like.

    I am not trying to have the last words.

    I agree with mattlock and Wisp. We have clarified what you meant.

    Let this thread continue to in its primary purpose.

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