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Thread: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

  1. #101
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by creampuff
    Aiyoh! Make peace everybody.
    Late to this thread but die lah my nickname is, is er... CREAMPUFF...
    Got any negative connotations or not?
    you're alright. I happen to love durian flavoured cream puffs, porn laced or otherwise =).

    It's alright la, every forum needs its *******s and bigots to make life interesting.

  2. #102
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by pokiemon
    or you can sleep on it.
    lol...so damn anti climatic.

  3. #103

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123
    First, you have subtly changed your ground from the word not being in existence, to whether there are sufficient people who know about it in order for it to be understood.

    Second, by your stand, if 100% of people don't know a particular word, no one can use that word.

    See anything wrong there?
    Hi vince123123, in fact i have not changed my ground. Everything is still in there in post #1 since Day 1 and they are still there. I did not edit them in.

    For the last time, please people, if you want to argue, at least READ what i wrote.

    Now i feel a little silly having to quote myself:
    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon

    To conclude, why am I even doing this? Because I advocate freedom. You are entitled to your opinion, I am entitled to mine. I donít impose mine on you; you donít impose yours on me. When you jump on the bandwagon to crucify others for your belief that you cannot even validate and lacking the commonsense to question yourself, I jump on my bandwagon to crucify you. If you learn tolerance, no one is jumping on any bandwagons. Someone has already kindly pointed out that ďcreampieĒ can potentially offend; by beating on a dead horse is purely an act of adding more fuel to the fire.

    If all of you enjoy standing by watching others being strong armed into submitting to other people demands Ė demands based on false truth Ė through means of stirring up emotions among the general public, then go ahead and burn them on the stake. The only thing I can do is pray that the same fate does not befall upon you.

    If you continue to find a need to perpetuate your idea of what creampie is, I canít stop you, but donít overstep your line.
    2) I pick option (b). In fact, i read that thread even before anyone has pointed it out, and i noticed the word but i left it be, thinking it must be an error or a tongue in cheek kind of marketing. There are mods to police the forum, and i very well trust their judgement.

    However, it seems to be starting like wildfire, with people jumping in to condemn and demand that the title be removed, as if they are desperate to find someone to be crucified on the cross. People behaving like vigilantes, fixated on their cause, trying to strong-arm people into submitting to what they think is right.

    If you can be a vigilante, so can i.

    If you can come out valiantly and insist that others are wrong and demand that they must change to suit you, so can i. I will come out to challenge your belief which you hold so dear, repaying the same "kindness" you have bestowed on others by demanding that you change to suit me!

    In fact, I am You.

    Where am i coming from you say? I will tell you honestly, i dont give a rat's ass what you think "Creampie" means. It is the mob mentality here that disgusts me, with big bullies with big post count lynching new junior members, behaviors you see displayed by 15 yr old on gaming forums.

    You brought a gun to a fist-fight, and you are calling me foul when i pull out mine?
    As to your second question.... errrmm, i cant believe i am going to answer this. If you read what i have quoted above and yet you still do not understand where i am coming from, i dunno how else i can offer to make you understand.

    If 100% of the people dont know the word, people are not allowed to use the word? In fact, no where in my argument did i advocate this. I merely just said keep it to yourself and dont impose it on others.

    A better way to show my argument along your line of reasoning is: If 50% of the people know the word, i dont expect the other 50% to know. By taking down a title with Creampie on it, it is advocating that those who do not know must know the word and strong arming them into what the other 50% believe.

    The only thing i can offer to help you understand my argument is, dont be too fixated with the argument on the word Creampie, but rather, try to see the subtle undercurrent of the debate.

  4. #104
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    The feeling is mutual, you apparently also do not understand what I'm writing thats why you keep going around in circles - you should take some of your own advice to at least read what I wrote and try to understand it

    And, if you wish to make a point, make it, not having to hide it as subtle undercurrent. If you are advocating the point that people shouldn't strongarm others to their point of view, then why did you talk about the existence of words in the first place?


    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    Hi vince123123, in fact i have not changed my ground. Everything is still in there in post #1 since Day 1 and they are still there. I did not edit them in.

    For the last time, please people, if you want to argue, at least READ what i wrote.

    Now i feel a little silly having to quote myself:




    As to your second question.... errrmm, i cant believe i am going to answer this. If you read what i have quoted above and yet you still do not understand where i am coming from, i dunno how else i can offer to make you understand.

    If 100% of the people dont know the word, people are not allowed to use the word? In fact, no where in my argument did i advocate this. I merely just said keep it to yourself and dont impose it on others.

    A better way to show my argument along your line of reasoning is: If 50% of the people know the word, i dont expect the other 50% to know. By taking down a title with Creampie on it, it is advocating that those who do not know must know the word and strong arming them into what the other 50% believe.

    The only thing i can offer to help you understand my argument is, dont be too fixated with the argument on the word Creampie, but rather, try to see the subtle undercurrent of the debate.

  5. #105

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by shinken
    Dude, embracing negative connotation is miles and worlds different from being sensitive to others from being associated with one.

    I rest my case. Happy warring.
    Ah, is that true? So they are mutually exclusive?

    However, the person you are supporting display no such behavior.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisp

    And yes, I did think you were abit of a congenital half wit. However after this thread you changed my mind! You convinced me you're a fully fledged one at that!

    Alright, I'd be more realistic. You're not a congenital halfwit. I simply think you have a big ego that you see a need to patch up.

    However I believe idiots won't become idiots for long. Some of them even became smarter than me =/. So I'm willing to take my words back if you decide to go along that path.
    Not only does he embraced the negative connotations of the words he used, he was totally insensitive to force them onto me.

    Now, he acted in the interest of those who maybe sensitive to the word "Creampie"

    BUT

    Yet he chose to be insensitive to someone like me, who has treated him with respect throughout this debate.

    Why the double standard? Why this selective sensitivity? Is it a mentality of "If it works for me, i will choose to be, if it is not in my favor, i wont? "

    Or as you going to say for someone like me who is an idiot as suggested by Wisp, dont deserve it? So then i am right to assume you subscribe to Hitler's elitist and fascist ideas that retards and idiots have no rights and they deserve to be in the gas chamber?

  6. #106

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisp
    (incredulous look)

    Hey, are you really sure you're involved in science and engineering? I thought ppl in science really have better things to do, or at least the people that I know of.

    Honestly, you could use the effort to argue to either cultivate your new hobby or invest it in more productive past times.

    To put it straight:

    1) I don't think all of us are interested nor have the time to interact in an 'intelligent debate' where each post last up to a 1000 words. Neither am I, and it was never an 'intelligent debate', because there is nothing worthwile to argue about. Period.

    2) Duh, of course a portion of ppl will ask the thread to be taken down. The world has its fair share of tight asses....fact of life. You can't please everybody.The shoot is still going to go on isn't it?

    3)Honestly, you're use of finesse and flowery words to weave your subtle verbal dodging in and out is getting everybody on their nerves. It gives the impression that you're a hoity toity 'finger in the air' intellectual who just wants to get his way.
    Science is a pretty broad discipline, and other factors can come into play here. So dont be too fast to jump to conclusion. E.g: Work with really fix hours, days off etc.

    1) Your action prove otherwise. You are in here posting and arguing with me, which means you are interested. Personally cant agree with your tactics though, but it is your choice. You dont like a parcticular bar, you are always welcome not to come in.

    2) Haha, yes you are pretty uptight about it. So i chose to be uptight too.

    3) Intellectual? I definitely am not, for reasons i have quoted earlier.

  7. #107

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by AReality
    boonboon, retreat while u still can.
    else u may really suffer the same fate as quite a few others before you.


    .
    Thanks for your kind advice. Appreciate it.

    I plan to stop after i am done with my lunch. Jeeesssh, my lunch is taking 1 hour and the food is getting cold. (I am not mocking you, i am serious.)

  8. #108

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by dkw
    Go ahead, run and hide......
    Run and hide? Hardly. Imagine if you are in my shoes, writing 1 post generates 10 posts i have to reply to, and after responding to that 10 posts i have 100 more.

    Get the math?

    I am not running or hiding anywhere, if for whatever reason i miss your post and you want to hear my views on it, you are welcome to PM me and i will respond to it.

  9. #109

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisp
    *shrug* that's all right if you disagree with me. I stand by what I said. However, I would suggest there's often more than one aspect of intepreting somebody's words, like what I'm saying to you now .
    as per your suggestion, can you at least assist me to interpret what you are saying to me now so that at least I dont misunderstand your deeper meaning ....
    always the Light, .... always.

  10. #110
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    My brother has a car, its a Honda Edix. However, as I search the dictionary, the word Edix does not exist. Therefore, he's driving to work daily in a non-existent car. How he wishes his road tax were non-existent too.

    Quite simply, you have got it on backwards. I refer you back to your first post in this thread;

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    My stand is: the word does not exist, and since it does not exist, logically it cannot possibly mean anything.
    For a stated opponent of urban legends, you seem to be pretty indulgent of leaps of logic yourself.

    In your text following that statement above, you proceed to make a case that a word cannot exist and possesses no meaning until it is found in a dictionary. Am I right in this interpretation, or do you agree that a 'word' CAN EXIST and have meaning OUTSIDE the auspices of an official English language dictionary? If the former, then read on, if the latter, then stop here, we are done.......


    Reading on? Ok. Ask yourself, how does a new word get incorporated into an official dictionary? Here is an excerpt;

    How does a word get into a Merriam-Webster dictionary?

    This is one of the questions Merriam-Webster editors are most often asked.

    The answer is simple: usage.

    Tracking word usage
    To decide which words to include in the dictionary and to determine what they mean, Merriam-Webster editors study the language as it's used. They carefully monitor which words people use most often and how they use them.

    Each day most Merriam-Webster editors devote an hour or two to reading a cross section of published material, including books, newspapers, magazines, and electronic publications; in our office this activity is called "reading and marking." The editors scour the texts in search of new words, new usages of existing words, variant spellings, and inflected forms—in short, anything that might help in deciding if a word belongs in the dictionary, understanding what it means, and determining typical usage. Any word of interest is marked, along with surrounding context that offers insight into its form and use.

    Citations
    The marked passages are then input into a computer system and stored both in machine-readable form and on 3" x 5" slips of paper to create citations.

    Each citation has the following elements:

    the word itself
    an example of the word used in context
    bibliographic information about the source from which the word and example were taken



    The link itself is easily searchable so help yourself. In other words (no pun intended), a word has to be USED (i.e. exists and has meaning) BEFORE it can get into a dictionary, NOT VICE-VERSA. The meaning of the word is created PRIOR to entering a dictionary, NOT AFTER. The editors will help finesse the definition of course, before it is included. How can it ever be otherwise? Has a word ever been created out of nowhere by edict from a committee of dictionary editors and imposed upon an unsuspecting populace along with its artificially created meaning? Absurdity at its height, no?

    Speaking of definitions, let me bring you back to your first post;

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    My stand is: the word does not exist, and since it does not exist, logically it cannot possibly mean anything.
    One wonders how on earth you made such a determination. Did an English language professor tell you so? Or did you long experience in learning the language and your steepness in the scientific method cause you to have such confidence that you could bandy around illogic without so much as blinking?

    What exactly is the definition of 'word'? A quick search reveals;


    1. a unit of language, consisting of one or more spoken sounds or their written representation, that functions as a principal carrier of meaning. Words are composed of one or more morphemes and are either the smallest units susceptible of independent use or consist of two or three such units combined under certain linking conditions, as with the loss of primary accent that distinguishes blackʹbirdʹ from blackʹ birdʹ. Words are usually separated by spaces in writing, and are distinguished phonologically, as by accent, in many languages.
    2. words, a. speech or talk: to express one's emotion in words; Words mean little when action is called for.
    b. the text or lyrics of a song as distinguished from the music.
    c. contentious or angry speech; a quarrel: We had words and she walked out on me.

    3. a short talk or conversation: Marston, I'd like a word with you.
    4. an expression or utterance: a word of warning.
    5. warrant, assurance, or promise: I give you my word I'll be there.
    6. news; tidings; information: We received word of his death.
    7. a verbal signal, as a password, watchword, or countersign



    This is just a sample. No where have I found a definition for 'word' that requires it to be part of an official dictionary before it can be accepted as a word. Once again, you've got it 'backwords'. Once again, I say, a word and its associated meaning exists before it gets into the dictionaries, not after.

    You do not accept the 'c' word? Well, I don't accept your definition of 'Word', and here it is very clear, you are wrong!


    What have we established so far;

    1) The 'c' word can not be found in official dictionaries --- TRUE
    2) The 'c' word can easily be found being used in a certain industry --- TRUE
    3) The first bone of contention: A word cannot exist and cannot have meaning unless it can be found in an official dictionary --- As other posters and I have amply demonstrated, this is TOTALLY FALSE
    4) The next bone of contention: The use of the 'c' word has not transcended beyond that certain industry --- Read on

    Well, the word was used as a title in a post, in a 'non-industry' forum, and yet many forumers, presumably mostly who have nothing to do with the industry, reacted. So, there goes your theory.

    So beyond showing that the word is not in a dictionary, you have done absolutely nothing else to support your case. The flaws in logic are all yours. The funny thing is, by reacting and debating this, you yourself give legitimacy to its meaning. As I had outlined in my previous post, you already have a reaction to this word, i.e. you recognise its negative connotations.

    Truth be said, it is totally irrelevant whether or not you publicly accept it or not. Its there, its being used, and its being recognised, and beyond the limited industry for which you claim it belongs to. Give it a rest already.
    Last edited by dkw; 22nd September 2006 at 02:45 PM.

  11. #111
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    Run and hide? Hardly. Imagine if you are in my shoes, writing 1 post generates 10 posts i have to reply to, and after responding to that 10 posts i have 100 more.

    Get the math?

    I am not running or hiding anywhere, if for whatever reason i miss your post and you want to hear my views on it, you are welcome to PM me and i will respond to it.
    Yawn.....you disappoint me. For all your eloquence, you're not really interested in going anywhere with this, are you? My posts are public, do as you see fit.

  12. #112

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    I think i am done with lunch.

    To finish this off, i have great love for Philosophy. And my classes for Philosophy are usually conducted during autumn in a very majestic hall which resembles a church. The class is pretty much free-styling, we sat around a circle and debate over even the most miniscure point. The debate can sometimes get heated and a lot of tension was built in that mere 2 hours.

    When class was dismissed, some of us would walk out cursing and swearing, wondering why the others just cant see our point(which to us then, is the absolute truth that everyone must bow down to). We opened the main door and stepped out, and suddenly the marvel of the world hit us.

    The beautiful red autumn leaves continued to fall, the world continued to spin, leaving us behind in that 2 hours.

    Ever quarreled with your boyfriend or girlfriend, when you try to make her change and accept your view and he/she refuses to? As you go into a cold war for the next 5 days, exchanging nasty emails and SMSes, ever wonder why you just cant keep your view to yourself and let him/her keep his/hers? These 5 days could be spent walking along the beach, enjoying a movie with your special person.

    Ever quarreled with your son (or daughter) when you try to teach him what you think is right? As he fumed for the next 5 days, locking himself in the room, you cant help but ask yourself: Why do i try to force it onto him? When we can be having dinner together and talking about what we did for the day?

    This debate is a friendly one. Whoever joined in, read it, i hope you enjoyed it. I had good fun, and debate to me is like a very elegant game of chess, which is why i prefer a good, on the table discusson and no underhanded behavior.

    Much like my philosophy class, all ill will stay in the class. When we walk out of that hall, we are friends once again. So no hard feelings anyone. I hold no grudge whoever posted here, in fact, i am really glad you contributed.

    So, friends and opponenents alike, please accept my sincere thanks, and my apologies to anyone whom i may have potentially offended. Particularly Wisp, i am definitely not out to wipe your existence away(although you be inclined to think this way ), just friendly exchanges, so please dont take it to heart.

    Some of you are new friends, some i even know in real life. So I will appreciate it if everyone can leave their diferences within this thread. And outside of this thread, we are still friends.

    I will no longer contribute significantly to this thread, because true to Wisp's kind words, i really do have better things to do. Spending 2 hours day on internet forum, and totalling to 6 hours these few days is the max of what i can contribute. Others are free to continue, but please keep it polite and civilised. As for those who think i intentionally ignore you, i am not, and like i suggested, you are welcome to PM me and we can continue.

    I personally find the most interesting article that struck a parcticular chord in me is written by Wobby:

    Quote Originally Posted by wobbly
    while some prefer to think in black and white, i like to think the grey inbetween counts as well..

    you can have your purity, your innocence, but is to have knowledge to simply be corrupted?
    to not have knowledge, is that to be blissfuly unaware? or ignorant?
    [otoh, knowledge is power, and power corrupts absolutely...]

    as far as i'm concerned, you can have the knowledge, but you can also be 'pure' in your thoughts and intentions - you just are 'more aware' - it depends on what you do with your knowledge, and perhaps, how mature you are as a person in yourself.

    while i do freely admit to having a fair amount of knowledge of pornography [both on a personal and on a professional level, and hey, its the modern world, why deny a possibly interesting aspect?], i am also aware of context, as i'm sure anyone else here is.
    so, while i saw 'cream pie' - two things came to mind: yes, the porn, but also - 'common sense' - which is a little used feature in todays society - acted as well - where am i? whats the likely level of audience? am i really about to see a truly hardcore pornographic post? so...
    i'm also left thinking 'oh, this poster has used this phrase in such and such context'.
    fine.
    and i would have left it at that.

    sometimes, you can add a little joke, and as the OP has already stated, he is fine with the jokes.
    Its just a little 'nudge nudge wink wink', and everyone can safely indulge in that without giving the game away.

    so, i think, great, have the knowledge, have the awareness, and have the laugh, but know when and where to use it and indulge in it, and when, perhaps, not to [within reason - who wants to be serious all their life?].

    hth
    Grey. Why didnt i think of that. To arm yourself with knowledge need not mean that you have to impose that knowledge on others.

    Thank you brothers, let's step back into the world.

  13. #113

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    why did u choose the name creampuff?

  14. #114
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    To the 1,506 viewers who read this post and want to know what does creampie mean, I suggest you go to the local pastry shop, get a creampie and sink your teeth into it.

  15. #115

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    Ah, is that true? So they are mutually exclusive?

    However, the person you are supporting display no such behavior.
    Dude, get a grip. I can't believe you're talking about support here. So there're camps now? I support no one.

    Creampie was used as a adjective on a lady. That could be perceived negatively. Someone thought so, I thought so. Somemone pointed it out, and you start a war. That's all.

    Is it what all these is about to you? Just some silly flame war? It's reputation for some people ya know.

  16. #116

    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Drumma, errr.. I mean Drama ended?
    I just woke up.


    .

  17. #117
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by AReality
    Drumma, errr.. I mean Drama ended?
    I just woke up.


    .
    wait for the next blockbuster lor

  18. #118

    Default Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    I do not wish to engage in the argument for personal reasons.

    This will be my last post in this thread.

    thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    Dear Reliance,
    I understand that you are busy. most people are. So please take your time to read them.

    I do not understand the relevance of your statement: What has studying English or getting A2 has anything to do with this argument? Please refrain from devolving this debate into "I know better cause i got better grades".

    Of course, since you are honest with me, i will be honest with you in return. Infact, regrettably of course, i failed my English in A levels, a pretty critical stage in my life. While in University, English continued to be my weakest subject, while much of my love is in Bio/Chem with a minor in Philosophy. There, my life in 1 or 2 sentences.

    Where am i coming from? Infact, you can potentially skip all the things i have typed at the start, and go straight to the last few paragraphs. In fact, i extend these suggestion to everyone in this thread. You will then realize, that the word "creampie" is just a mere springboard for me.

    To know whether you are on my side or somewhere else, do this checklist:

    1) Have you even been forced to do something against your will because people enforced it upon you, while declaring only they can be right? If Yes, do you like that feeling? Why?

    2) If the other thread title still holds and it still says "Brazilian Creampie Anyone?" now, are you

    (a) one of those who will jump on and post a message to demand that the OP takes it down, insisting that creampie is exactly what you think it is?

    (b) receptive, and that the OP has made an honest mistake. Since a gentleman has already pointed it out to the OP, we shall move on.

    My answers:
    1) Yes, this has happened in my life. I detest the feeling of constantly being put down without ever a chance for me to challenge their authority.

    2) I pick option (b). In fact, i read that thread even before anyone has pointed it out, and i noticed the word but i left it be, thinking it must be an error or a tongue in cheek kind of marketing. There are mods to police the forum, and i very well trust their judgement.

    However, it seems to be starting like wildfire, with people jumping in to condemn and demand that the title be removed, as if they are desperate to find someone to be crucified on the cross. People behaving like vigilantes, fixated on their cause, trying to strong-arm people into submitting to what they think is right.

    If you can be a vigilante, so can i.

    If you can come out valiantly and insist that others are wrong and demand that they must change to suit you, so can i. I will come out to challenge your belief which you hold so dear, repaying the same "kindness" you have bestowed on others by demanding that you change to suit me!

    In fact, I am You.

    Where am i coming from you say? I will tell you honestly, i dont give a rat's ass what you think "Creampie" means. It is the mob mentality here that disgusts me, with big bullies with big post count lynching new junior members, behaviors you see displayed by 15 yr old on gaming forums.

    You brought a gun to a fist-fight, and you are calling me foul when i pull out mine?

  19. #119
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by AReality
    Drumma, errr.. I mean Drama ended?
    I just woke up.


    .

    hahaa..

  20. #120
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    Default Re: Dear Wisp and Reliance: The Word "Creampie"

    Quote Originally Posted by fattyboonboon
    Science is a pretty broad discipline, and other factors can come into play here. So dont be too fast to jump to conclusion. E.g: Work with really fix hours, days off etc.

    1) Your action prove otherwise. You are in here posting and arguing with me, which means you are interested. Personally cant agree with your tactics though, but it is your choice. You dont like a parcticular bar, you are always welcome not to come in.

    2) Haha, yes you are pretty uptight about it. So i chose to be uptight too.

    3) Intellectual? I definitely am not, for reasons i have quoted earlier.
    Hwrm, just back from uni and a birthday party. Let's see here...

    *chuckle* I am interested, but I have kept my word so far. I have not engaged in a '1000' word long essay to justify my reasons.

    Me uptight? Hell yeah I am. I'm pretty disgusted by when I just happen to pop a little simple warning that such a word could be misintepreted , and before I know itsomebody had to come in and plonk his own philosphy textbook. AND before I knew it, somebody was accusing me of playing the finer crux of dictatorship.

    If you love philosophy so much, go read and argue ppl who care . Do not try to engage in an 'intellectual' debate with me or people who had no idea what you're talking about. I have simply no time and patience to engage in such unproductive excursions of over analysis.

    Intellectual? Come on, like I give a sh*t whether you failed your A levels. I have used my credentials as sarcasm on your 'proper' ways means of assasinating another's character.

    Oh I forgot! it's compeletely intepretable in many context, like how you used yours to weave and turn to protect your reputation.

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