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Thread: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

  1. #121

    Default Re: Here's what I think

    Quote Originally Posted by Parchiao
    "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" - St Ambrose, 387A.D.
    In Sg, P@P rulz.
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  2. #122

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by wildstallion
    Sure, may get a bit cosey havnt really got room for 22 people, maybe they could bring tents and sleep out on the garden?

    Also I dont think the IMF and WB would hear them from my house, could someone arrange some media coverage?
    there will be media coverage if you are prepared to host them ... Invite them now lar ...

  3. #123
    Senior Member azul123's Avatar
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised
    The MOU is that the host must recognised all those accredited ...
    Question to the legal eagles in CS, is MOU contractually binding? I don't think it is but I dunno.

    ../azul123

  4. #124

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised
    I am wondering how many ringleaders are you referring to? and how many protesters will be joining or are allowed to join these "ringleaders" at Suntec?
    Suntec remains open for business, ie ppl can still gather there

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised
    In this case, it is not your set of rules or our set of rules .... it is a set of things we agreed upon before they appointed us to be the host (read ... host). The MOU is that the host must recognised all those accredited ... simply, during the official meetings, at the offical place and time, they should be allowed to do what the organisers accredit them to do. As such, these activists ARE supposed to respect OUR laws when they are not at the "official" place and time. For eg, if they are in Orchard Road anytime, they are to respect all our local laws.
    I hv not read the MOU and I got no comments whether the organisers failed to see that the IMF/WB would accredit protesters or IMF/WB are twisting words ...

    well, between "supposed to" and "actually do" may hv difference ... we ourselves dun do wat we are supposed to do sometimes too like "No jay-walking" etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Canonised
    You are not been realistic .... what crowd are you referring to? It is a ghost town .... The only way is for these 27 to stir up the men in blue, plain cloth mata, security personnels, SAF soldiers, the part-time students, service staff, etc to a violent protest.
    hmmm, Suntec is still pretty open for peopole to gather ...

  5. #125
    Moderator John Teoh's Avatar
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Actually I remember reading the reply from Singapore S2006 Committee to IMF in Today. Manage to find news.


    After remarks made on Wednesday by a World Bank official and again yesterday morning by the bank's president, Mr Paul Wolfowitz, that Singapore has gone back on the MOU signed three years ago, the Singapore 2006 (S2006) organising committee has issued a firm rebuttal.
    .
    Referring to the "alleged" breach, the committee said the Republic is aware of its obligations under the MOU and will continue to honour them. The committee singled out its undertaking to keep the International Monetary Fund and World Bank meetings secure.
    .
    "The MOU also obliges Singapore to take all necessary measures for the safe passage of all persons in and out of Singapore and for their personal security and safety of their property and the property of the organisations and delegations," said the committee in a press statement.
    The rest can be found here.

  6. #126

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by paradigm
    27 activist can stir up a crowd of thousands ... its not the 27 we are worried abt ... more of how their actions, when started will lead on to others ... riots dun just happen amongst 27 ppl ...
    You have said it, "its not the 27 we are worried abt". Then why are we banning these highly wanted personnel by the Chiefs of IMF and World Bank? Are not we providing political ammunition to our critics for shooting at us?

    If the "Thousands" you thought to be present in Singapore, are a bunch of willing and determine protesters, will banning 27 of them stop the rest from taking to the streets?

    I personally think that it will be politically correct to import the 27 and bar the "Thousands" from our shore.

  7. #127
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by azul123
    Question to the legal eagles in CS, is MOU contractually binding? I don't think it is but I dunno.

    ../azul123

    it doesn't matter what you call the document, it is what is written in the clauses that makes the terms binding, or rather how binding.

  8. #128

    Default Re: Here's what I think

    Has anyone considered why the government, knowing that the IMF would bring about problems, would agree to host it in the first place?

    Isn't this just asking for trouble?

    For something which affects Singaporeans strongly enough to raise this much discussion, one would think that this issue should have been debated long ago before we actually signed to take on this project.
    It's abit late now.
    Last edited by mattlock; 16th September 2006 at 04:07 AM.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Here's what I think

    Quote Originally Posted by mattlock
    Has anyone considered why the government, knowing that the IMF would bring about problems, would agree to host it in the first place?

    Isn't this just asking for trouble?

    For something which affects Singaporeans strongly enough to raise this much discussion, one would think that this issue should have been debated long ago before we actually signed to take on this project.
    It's abit late now.

    someone probably thinks that the;

    4 millions :-),
    big plastic banners,
    potted flowers,
    local hotel curry,
    IMF drinks,
    baba culture tours,
    discounted botox treatment,
    local social escort,
    new coat of paint,
    re-surfacing of roads,
    security fence,
    fireworks,
    bmw,
    welcome ads,
    8 by 8,
    renovated night safari,
    fountain of wealth, etc.... etc.... etc....

    would provides a totally different brand new sensation (from previous meeting) so nice and appreciative that they'll ease all the troubles....
    Last edited by DT_; 16th September 2006 at 07:55 AM.

  10. #130

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapc...ion=cnn_latest



    the entire article really makes me..... esp something like this;

    Garry Rodan, of Murdoch University, Australia, said the World Bank and IMF had been naive about Singapore.

    "Singapore has always made a virtue out of the fact it is different, and sticks to its guns, no matter how controversial, examples being the caning and execution of foreign nationals."
    and this.....

    Analysts said the meeting is turning out to be a public relations disaster for Singapore, which has spent about S$135 million ($85 million) on the event, hoping to showcase its financial industry and tourism appeal.

    Instead, the world press has focused on Singapore's restrictions on free speech and right of assembly.

  11. #131

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by DT_
    http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapc...ion=cnn_latest



    the entire article really makes me..... esp something like this;



    and this.....
    was wondering whether to goad or feel sad ..with all the public money spent...Dun thnk the garment will like this kind of report...
    头可断,血可流,倩女不可不追求 carpe diem,when in doubt, hoot first,apologise later:p GALLERY

  12. #132

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwitan
    Thursday i took a bus down to Suntec intending to walk across the bridge connecting the conventional centre to Marina Sq. Bus was diverted to drop outside Millenia Walk.

    While walking towards Suntec from within Marina Sq shopping centre, overheard 3 Cacausians IMF delegated commenting on how artificial Singapore is : the planting of flowers, the 4 million smile campaign all contrasting with the total ban on protests, barbed wires surrounding the convention centre and armed police and Gurkhas patrolling every where.

    It put me to shame to be a Singaporean.
    It is natural to behave this way. we sprue up our house when we are expecting guests.. do you do it?
    They just said for the sake of saying. I would have stop them and tell them off!
    Please! Please! It is Singapore we live in. I am proud to me one. No shame! I rather be safe then got my arm blown! Shops burnt!, Glass shattered.
    We are a small country and we cannot have that happening here!
    We have a record number of delegates attending. Do you know why?
    I once had a German boss and he commented.."Singapore is one country where I can take a walk in the middle of the night(he was referring to Orchard Road) and don't worry.....!" He came to Sigapore and he was impressed.
    Can you imagine walking in the middle of the night in...?
    Please be proud of Singapore. I will vote for any political party that can govern our country well.
    You are here today enjoying the fruit of a good government. You have a job, you have good education, you have a safe place to stay and what else do you want?
    Obviously there are always rooms for improvement and we should suggest and give solution. Just like we do improvement at home!

    Just to divert, what do you think the S2006 committee should do?
    Allow undesire elements to enter Singapore and blow up your house? Maybe not your house but Suntec City so that the whole world know that it is unsafe to hold event like this in Singapore?
    Please do not take it personnally when I said you, I actually meant we and me too!
    We are Singaporean. This may not be the best place in the world to stay but she is surely one of the bests in the world!
    Cheers!!!!!

  13. #133
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Do you think the PeeSai givernment give a hoot and sh1t about feedback from the people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yappy
    Obviously there are always rooms for improvement and we should suggest and give solution. Just like we do improvement at home!

  14. #134

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    latest news today...

    S'pore agrees to admit 22 of 27 blacklisted activists

    SINGAPORE will allow 22 of the 27 civil society activists it had objected to previously to enter the country after all.
    In an unexpected statement last night, the Singapore organising committee for the International Monetary Fund-World Bank meetings said:

    'Based on input provided by the IMF and World Bank this morning, the S2006 Organising Committee has reviewed the list of 27 CSO representatives whose entry was subject to interview by Singapore. The S2006 Organising Committee has decided to allow the entry of 22 of the 27 CSO representatives.'

    CSO refers to civil society organisations.

    The remaining five activists will be 'subject to interview and may not be allowed in', if they try to enter Singapore.

    As in previous statements, the 27 were not named.

    Singapore had earlier objected to their accreditation to attend the meetings, citing security and law and order concerns.

    Hours before the about-turn, World Bank president Paul Wolfowitz said that Singapore had inflicted 'enormous damage' to its reputation. Describing its actions as 'unacceptable', he told a meeting with the CSOs that he had raised the matter with President SR Nathan and Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong.

    In the afternoon, 164 CSOs announced a boycott of all official IMF-World Bank events.

    Mr Wolfowitz said that Singapore would have to decide whether to show it was 'authoritarian' or 'at the stage of success they have reached, they would do much better for themselves with a more visionary approach to the process'.

    His comments, the harshest yet, came after a week of wrangling between the IMF, the World Bank and Singapore over the issue.

    It began on Monday, when Singapore police announced that the activists could be barred, igniting widespread criticism from CSOs and the two institutions.

    On Wednesday, the World Bank accused Singapore of breaking the Memorandum of Understanding signed in 2003, when it was made the host of this year's meetings. It invited a response from Singapore that it would honour the pact, but that it also had to weigh security concerns seriously.

    The decision last night was met with a muted response from activists - both in Singapore and among the blacklisted activists, many of whom are in Batam for a CSO forum. Some said it came too late.

    Said Ms Shalmali Guttal of Focus on the Global South, from Batam: 'I think the Government really owes us an explanation for why there was even a blacklist in the first place... we will come to claim our space.''

  15. #135

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by DT_
    http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapc...ion=cnn_latest



    the entire article really makes me..... esp something like this;



    and this.....

    WHAT PUBLIC RELATIONS DISASTER??? Please lah - NO PROTESTORS, SO VERY VERY SAFE! Such a PERFECT place for the BIG BIZ BOYS - come on! This is extremely extremely good news for future BIG BIZ CONFERENCES man! If I were all these BIG BIG WIGS and RICH RICH RICH exclusive-old-boys-club / dictatorial-govt-linked organisations - I WILL CHOOSE SINGAPORE ANYTIME - I mean - no bloody protestors, disturbance, I have got FANTASTIC SECURITY, heck - we are all locked in a fortress to REALLY get down to business - and for fun - we get escorted safely to all these WONDERFUL cultural events put on for us by the FANTASTIC AND EFFICIENT Singapore Government / we get such a CLEAN AND GREEN CITY / and best of all we get greeted with 4 MILLION AUTOMATIC SMILES - THEY ALL MUST SMILE WITHIN SECONDS - even before we say anything - LIKE WOW!! WOW! WOW!

    Our meetings run smoothly, we get to enjoy the culture and food, in future we can go gamble and watch topless women dancing! ABSOLUTELY, SMASHING MARVELLOUS!!

    Who CARES about all those liberal-mongers who just want to disrupt BIG BUSINESS? And the press? All BS idiotic liberals who don't know about THE MONEY, man! You want the THINGS TO BE DONE - YOU WANT THE MONEY - COME TO SINGAPORE!!!

    The above statements DO NOT REFLECT THE WRITER'S PERSONAL VIEWS. The writer is a very very very small fry/fly in Singapore - so her views DO NOT MATTER - she can probably only be one of the BIG BOYS in another life time, but she is hoping that she will not be re-incarnated as a human - so she might NEVER be a BIG BOY at all.

  16. #136

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwitan
    Do you think the PeeSai givernment give a hoot and sh1t about feedback from the people?
    Exactly! I have got copies of letters I have written to the PM's office and VARIOUS other feedback channels - NO REPLY - not even - a computer-generated - 'we have received your feedback / thank you for your feed back' - well, maybe they got lost or something - or I am just a small fry and the matters I raise up are not important, money-generating or utilitarian matters - so no need to 'chap' - just ignore all small fries ...after awhile, they will shut up - esp when they realise they are small fries.

    I want to feel 'belonged' to this country - I don't think one can ever 'love' a country in this day and age, because I think you are insulting the concept of love - but this country does not encourage me to feel 'belonged' - I can't seem to sink any roots here - maybe I can survive only if I am like those plastic flowers they put on Orchard Road ... be fake and hardy and plastic .... and SMILE WITHIN SECONDS ...

  17. #137
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    How ironic .......Singapore Govt get blasted by the people they were trying to protect ...... talk about gratitude ......... ................

  18. #138
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    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Zenten
    How ironic .......Singapore Govt get blasted by the people they were trying to protect ...... talk about gratitude .........................

    And why are you guys here adding salt to the wound .............



    ....................................>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> IMF Roxxx!!!

  19. #139

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    If you are free, read up on the history of IMF/World Bank. Starts to make you wonder who the real terrorists are. Which terrorists are they "protecting" us from?

  20. #140

    Default Re: BBC: Singapore 'breaks protest deal'

    Quote Originally Posted by user12343
    latest news today...

    S'pore agrees to admit 22 of 27 blacklisted activists

    SINGAPORE will allow 22 of the 27 civil society activists it had objected to previously to enter the country after all.
    In an unexpected statement last night, the Singapore organising committee for the International Monetary Fund-World Bank meetings said:

    'Based on input provided by the IMF and World Bank this morning, the S2006 Organising Committee has reviewed the list of 27 CSO representatives whose entry was subject to interview by Singapore. The S2006 Organising Committee has decided to allow the entry of 22 of the 27 CSO representatives.'

    CSO refers to civil society organisations.

    The remaining five activists will be 'subject to interview and may not be allowed in', if they try to enter Singapore.

    As in previous statements, the 27 were not named.

    Singapore had earlier objected to their accreditation to attend the meetings, citing security and law and order concerns.

    Hours before the about-turn, World Bank president Paul Wolfowitz said that Singapore had inflicted 'enormous damage' to its reputation. Describing its actions as 'unacceptable', he told a meeting with the CSOs that he had raised the matter with President SR Nathan and Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong.

    In the afternoon, 164 CSOs announced a boycott of all official IMF-World Bank events.

    Mr Wolfowitz said that Singapore would have to decide whether to show it was 'authoritarian' or 'at the stage of success they have reached, they would do much better for themselves with a more visionary approach to the process'.

    His comments, the harshest yet, came after a week of wrangling between the IMF, the World Bank and Singapore over the issue.

    It began on Monday, when Singapore police announced that the activists could be barred, igniting widespread criticism from CSOs and the two institutions.

    On Wednesday, the World Bank accused Singapore of breaking the Memorandum of Understanding signed in 2003, when it was made the host of this year's meetings. It invited a response from Singapore that it would honour the pact, but that it also had to weigh security concerns seriously.

    The decision last night was met with a muted response from activists - both in Singapore and among the blacklisted activists, many of whom are in Batam for a CSO forum. Some said it came too late.

    Said Ms Shalmali Guttal of Focus on the Global South, from Batam: 'I think the Government really owes us an explanation for why there was even a blacklist in the first place... we will come to claim our space.''
    I think the PW and the World Bank and IMF are all doing a WAYANG (putting on a show) - they CHOSE Singapore for SPECIFIC reasons - one of them being - there would be no pesky protesters or disruptions. If I were them - I would choose Singapore too - then I wayang a bit to appease all the pesky protestors - but by then, all the huffing and puffing of the protesters will be of no use - coz it would be too late - the damaging blow has already been inflicted. As much as I disagree with some of our anti - demonstration (NOTE - I wrote DEMONSTRATIONS - NOT RIOTOUS PROTESTS) - laws in Singapore, I think the Singapore government has LAID THE CARDS DOWN on the table RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING - and the WB / IMF Big Boys are NOT SO NAIVE - Come on! For all you know, the WB / IMF already warned the Govt that they are going to put on a wayang - protest a bit, 'raise the matter with the President and the PM', just SHOW the whole world in general that they do 'care' about what the protesters have to say ("The CSOs have always been a part of the World Bank agenda - YEAH ... RIGHT ...) - etc etc.

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