Which super-telephoto (400-500mm) lens?

[windraider]

Hope to get some advice on which telephoto lens to get for use on F80 and a D200 bodies in taking birding & small wildlife shots (ie lizards, butterfly etc.). Plan is to carry a super telephoto (with max reach of 400-500mm) & a macro lens for photo romps in nature reserves, reservoirs & outlying islands trips.
I already have a Nikon 80-200/2.8 & a Tamron 70-300/4.5-5.6 lens, but find them limiting in their usage. Would not like to go down the route of using teleconverters, unless the picture quality is going to be the same for a significant lower cost.

While I suppose I’ll be using the lenses at their max range 95% of the time, I’m open to suggestions to both zooms or primes. The way I figured primes offer better pic quality at lower costs (am I wrong?), whereas zooms offer flexibility. I’m also amendable to manual focus options as I suppose most subjects, especially birds in flight, are focused at infinity (no?), but the downside is no split focusing screen on D200 or F80.

Key considerations in descending priority are:
1) good picture quality at max range (ie at 400-500mm) – especially wide open to f8, as most subjects are hiding in trees & other dark areas, such lenses usually require high shutter speed to reduce motion blur. I’m also not inclined towards soft & “muddy”quality pics, or time spent digitally enhancing/cleaning up images.

2) price – betw $400-2000 for 2nd hand lenses. Not a professional nature photographer (no ambition to be one), hence perceive that I will only use this focal length occasionally (unless I’m hooked on nature hikes). The lower the better but I’m not willing to get a cheap lens with poor handling/output which I would cringe to use.

3) portability – to take along on hikes and for rapid reaction to photo opportunities, hence good if can fit into a sling camera bag or Tarmac’s XL lens case (ie 86mm diameter restriction). I suppose having image stabilization (ie VR, OIS etc) would do away with the need to carry around tripod support (by the way I’ve already got a tripod system hence I’m not adverse to using it) and improve handling/rapid response.

4) good AF – accurate, fast & quiet focusing and usable in low light. For rapid response without frightening off skittish subjects.

For size & price range, my preliminary search have led to the following options, hence would like to hear users reviews or other recommendations:
a) Nikon 80-400mm f4.5-5.6 AF VR
b) Tokina ATX 80-400mm f4.5-5.6
c) Tamron LD 200-400mm f5.6
d) Tamron 100-500mm f4.5-6.3
e) Tokina SP 400mm f5.6

Would also like to hear from seasoned nature photographers on photo their set up and opinions.

[lsisaxon]

Originally Posted by windraider Hope to get some advice on which telephoto lens to get for use on F80 and a D200 bodies in taking birding & small wildlife shots (ie lizards, butterfly etc.). Plan is to carry a super telephoto (with max reach of 400-500mm) & a macro lens for photo romps in nature reserves, reservoirs & outlying islands trips. I already have a Nikon 80-200/2.8 & a Tamron 70-300/4.5-5.6 lens, but find them limiting in their usage. Would not like to go down the route of using teleconverters, unless the picture quality is going to be the same for a significant lower cost. ... ... ... For size & price range, my preliminary search have led to the following options, hence would like to hear users reviews or other recommendations: a) Nikon 80-400mm f4.5-5.6 AF VR b) Tokina ATX 80-400mm f4.5-5.6 c) Tamron LD 200-400mm f5.6 d) Tamron 100-500mm f4.5-6.3 e) Tokina SP 400mm f5.6 Would also like to hear from seasoned nature photographers on photo their set up and opinions.

Get a 2x TC for your 80-200/2.8. The quality should still be ok. The lens becomes 160-400/5.6, which is in the range you are considering to purchase.

As much as I wish also, birds in flight are not focused at infinity. Because of the long focal length and shallow DOF, you will still need to focus for objects even 20-30m away.

[ortega]

Sigma 50-500
Sigma 170-500

[glennyong]

sigma 50-500 would be a safe bet.

other wise... u may wish to consider a 120-300mm f/2.8 sigma, and with 2X, u can get a 240 - 600mm f/5.6...

but with sigmas, always remember, they are light hungry to get accurate AF.

[longkangman]

I can only think of the follow if price is not a problem.
- 180mm Tamron
- 200-400mm Nikon.

The 200-400mm nikon I last try having some minor image issue but recently tested another copy don't seems to have that.

[glennyong]

yeah !! 200-400 is one great lens !!!!!!

i have tested 2 sets before at 2 different times of the year.... i must say.. incredible power and results.. even with 1.7xTC... wonderful...

MTL....

[windraider]

Thanks for the responses.

Would definitely like the 200-400 nikon, if one can be found below $2k.
Otherwise for my casual/hobbists needs, doesn't seem to justify its costs.

Regarding the 50-500mm Sigma:
- how much does it cost?
- how does it compare to 80-400 nikon & tokina in terms of handling & image quality?
- heard that it is a beast to carry, is the weight & dimension difference between 80-400 nikon & tokina significant?
- does it also require a tripod or does it have OIS?

For those recommending TCs:
- how does the image quality of 80-200/2.8 with 2xTC compare with Tokina's 80-400 or Tamron's 200-400?
- which TCs allows 80-200 AFD to retain AF & metering on D200 & F80?

[ortega]

google is your friend,
lots of reviews by ppl who do reviews for a living
and their reviews come with images and are explained better
than any of us can.

Sigma web site will give you more detail about their lens
Tokina and nikon website as well.

[ipin]

Originally Posted by windraider Thanks for the responses. Would definitely like the 200-400 nikon, if one can be found below $2k. Otherwise for my casual/hobbists needs, doesn't seem to justify its costs. Regarding the 50-500mm Sigma: - how much does it cost? - how does it compare to 80-400 nikon & tokina in terms of handling & image quality? - heard that it is a beast to carry, is the weight & dimension difference between 80-400 nikon & tokina significant? - does it also require a tripod or does it have OIS? For those recommending TCs: - how does the image quality of 80-200/2.8 with 2xTC compare with Tokina's 80-400 or Tamron's 200-400? - which TCs allows 80-200 AFD to retain AF & metering on D200 & F80?

A tripod is required for any tack sharp shots you plan to shoot at those kind of ranges and hand holding them for any period of time would be a killer on yourself.

Regarding the prices of the lenses, let your fingers do the walking :

AP - Alan Photo, #01-38 Sim Lim Square, Tel: 6336 0922, e-mail: alanfoto@singnet.com.sg
AP-F - Alan Photo, #05-20 Funan Digitalife Mall, Tel: 6883 0922, e-mail: alanfoto@singnet.com.sg
CP - Cathay Photo, #01-11/14 Peninsula Plaza, Tel: 6337 4274, e-mail: email@cathayphoto.com.sg
CP-M - Cathay Photo, #02-215/216 Marina Square, 6 Raffles Boulevard, Tel: 6339 6188, e-mail: email@cathayphoto.com.sg
John - John 3:16, #05-46 Funan Digitalife Mall, Tel: 6337 2877 / 6337 1897, e-mail: richardgan@pacific.net.sg
Lord's - Lord's Camera, 304 Orchard Road #01-79 Lucky Plaza, Tel: 6235 4605, e-mail: lordscom@singnet.com.sg
MS - MS Colour, Block 711 Ang Mo Kio Avenue 8, #01-3501C, Tel: 6457 6380, e-mail: sales@mscolor.com.sg, web e-quote
TCW - The Camera Workshop, 3 Coleman Street, #01-31, Tel: 6336 1956 / 6336 7808, e-mail: tcwkshop@singnet.com.sg
TK - T K Foto Technic, 100 Beach Rd, #02-45 Shaw Towers, Tel: 6292 4533, e-mail: sales@tkfoto.com.sg

Taken from Nikon Price Guide (Singapore) 2005~2006

And.....use Nikon TCs with Nikkors.

[deadpixel]

Originally Posted by ortega google is your friend,

So is PBase. Their camera/lens database allows you to search for sample images taken by a specific camera or lens. Was just admiring some photos taken with a Sigma 300-800mm f/5.6 EX DG IF HSM APO. It's $9,900 price tag is of course out of the budget and I don't believe there are any 2nd ones.

_

[ipin]

Originally Posted by deadpixel So is PBase. Their camera/lens database allows you to search for sample images taken by a specific camera or lens. Was just admiring some photos taken with a Sigma 300-800mm f/5.6 EX DG IF HSM APO. It's $9,900 price tag is of course out of the budget and I don't believe there are any 2nd ones. _

Thanks for the lead!
Here is the link.