How to shoot birds with FZ series camera?

[genegoh]

Hi, need some advise for shooting birds with FZ series camera.
I was at Ubin and saw a bunch of Lumixers with FZ30 with teleconverters (not definite, but pretty sure) bird watching and shooting.
I saw a bird and tried to take a photo of it, taking at iso 100 with flash. The bird came out looking very flat. Should flash be used when taking birds?
When taking them in the trees, the lighting is quite dark, and I'm afraid to increase the ISO to 200 or worse still 400 cos of the noise problem.

Anyone can advise on this?

[Garion]

Do a search for the posts of a CS member called Newguy69. He uses a Panasonic FZ10 with Raynox tele-adapter lens with very impressive results.

[genegoh]

Originally Posted by Garion Do a search for the posts of a CS member called Newguy69. He uses a Panasonic FZ10 with Raynox tele-adapter lens with very impressive results.

Yeah, saw them... nice.
But he has switched to a D50...

[ExplorerZ]

might wan to try a high quality teleconverter and shoot with a tripod.

[metallilan]

i got a couple of birds shots before the gah-men tore down the tree in front of my house : http://metallilan.multiply.com/photos/album/2

and a few more here : http://metallilan.multiply.com/photos/album/20

Usually if its FZ + tcon, set it to A mode, f/5.6, a tripod/monopod would be handy for added stability. For FZ alone, depends really. I wouldn't recommend f/2.8 as its not sharp enough.

[genegoh]

Originally Posted by metallilan i got a couple of birds shots before the gah-men tore down the tree in front of my house : http://metallilan.multiply.com/photos/album/2 and a few more here : http://metallilan.multiply.com/photos/album/20 Usually if its FZ + tcon, set it to A mode, f/5.6, a tripod/monopod would be handy for added stability. For FZ alone, depends really. I wouldn't recommend f/2.8 as its not sharp enough.

what abt the ISO setting? I'm afraid of increasing it too much cos of the noise problem.

[metallilan]

Originally Posted by genegoh what abt the ISO setting? I'm afraid of increasing it too much cos of the noise problem.

Hmm. I've never really tried increasing ISO..most of the time is at 100...

[Reno]

shooting birds with FZ cam is not so simply.... because of FZ long zoom (12X = 35mm - 432mm) therefore your shutter must set to around 1/300 or faster. Using of external flash is advisable. Watch your iso, never pump it too high as it will be noisy... also... best use a tripod to shoot.
Hope this helps

[metallilan]

Originally Posted by Reno shooting birds with FZ cam is not so simply.... because of FZ long zoom (12X = 35mm - 432mm) therefore your shutter must set to around 1/300 or faster. Using of external flash is advisable. Watch your iso, never pump it too high as it will be noisy... also... best use a tripod to shoot. Hope this helps

yeah but depends on how far the bird is, the flash might no be so useful. don't take my word for it since i haven't been shooting birds in a long time

[genegoh]

I see... I guess what has been missing is the tripod... that's the main thing. Been trying to take them handheld.

[ExplorerZ]

Originally Posted by genegoh I see... I guess what has been missing is the tripod... that's the main thing. Been trying to take them handheld.

actually for bird shooting, a monopod will be better than a tripod. (sry for my 1st post )
bird are quite active and before you setup a tripod, they would have already moved. monopod are not as stable as tripod but should be good enough to let you obtain sharp shot if you know how to use with some optimization of camera setting, like bumpin up ISO slightly or using wider aperture

[AncientMariner]

Originally Posted by genegoh I see... I guess what has been missing is the tripod... that's the main thing. Been trying to take them handheld.

Most bird photographers pan handheld when shooting birds in flight.
Here's a couple of mine with the FZ10 coupled with LTZ10 teleconverter handheld:



The slow autofocusing speed and shutter lag of digicams makes it difficult but not impossible with lots of practice. However, I always bring a sturdy tripod when I go birding.
The LTZ10 teleconverter is a potent accessory for my FZ10 and makes it great for static bird shots. The following are taken mounted on a tripod



More:
http://gallery.clubsnap.com/data/508/145823.jpg

http://gallery.clubsnap.com/data/508/082811.jpg

However, now my FZ10 has been relegated to backup use since I got my dSLR.
Some of my wildlife shots can bee seen here:

http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y151/JkChan/Nature/

[AncientMariner]

Originally Posted by ExplorerZ actually for bird shooting, a monopod will be better than a tripod. (sry for my 1st post ) bird are quite active and before you setup a tripod, they would have already moved. monopod are not as stable as tripod but should be good enough to let you obtain sharp shot if you know how to use with some optimization of camera setting, like bumpin up ISO slightly or using wider aperture

I have used both monopods and tripods and whilst a monopod is better than handheld for static shots, it is not suitable for static long range shots. Actually, the monopod is a hindrance for in-flight shots since birds flight paths are usually erratic. I no longer use a monopod for bird shots and either do handheld for in-flight or tripod mounted for static.
However, I agree that we have our aperture opened wide so as to be able to use faster shutter speeds.

[genegoh]

Originally Posted by ExplorerZ actually for bird shooting, a monopod will be better than a tripod. (sry for my 1st post ) bird are quite active and before you setup a tripod, they would have already moved. monopod are not as stable as tripod but should be good enough to let you obtain sharp shot if you know how to use with some optimization of camera setting, like bumpin up ISO slightly or using wider aperture

But doesn't bumping up the ISO mean more noise? The very max I will go would be iso200, but would try to keep it to 100.

On my FZ30, the shutter speed will be fixed at 1/30s when I mount the flash. So if I zoom in to the max at 420mm equivalent, the shutter speed would definitely be insufficient. Do I use manual in this case? In manual mode, the camera gives a prediction of the final output but without flash, which is usually very dark, meaning I can't see anything through the EVF. Any way to overcome this?

[ExplorerZ]

Originally Posted by genegoh But doesn't bumping up the ISO mean more noise? The very max I will go would be iso200, but would try to keep it to 100. On my FZ30, the shutter speed will be fixed at 1/30s when I mount the flash. So if I zoom in to the max at 420mm equivalent, the shutter speed would definitely be insufficient. Do I use manual in this case? In manual mode, the camera gives a prediction of the final output but without flash, which is usually very dark, meaning I can't see anything through the EVF. Any way to overcome this?

1/30" is more than enuff to get sharp pic with flash (without using tri/mono-pod)

[genegoh]

Originally Posted by ExplorerZ 1/30" is more than enuff to get sharp pic with flash (without using tri/mono-pod)

is it? what happened to the 1/focal length rule?

[AncientMariner]

Originally Posted by metallilan yeah but depends on how far the bird is, the flash might no be so useful. don't take my word for it since i haven't been shooting birds in a long time

You can extend the range of your flash with tele-extenders such as the "Better Beamer". With that on my Vivitar 285HV, there is sufficient fill-flash even at the full range of my FZ10/LTZ10 combo

[AncientMariner]

Originally Posted by genegoh is it? what happened to the 1/focal length rule?

Firstly, that is only a guideline for *handholding without camera shake* and varies from person to person. It will not prevent blur from *subject movement*. What shutter speed is needed depends on the speed of the said movement.
Secondly,when you use flash, it is the flash synch speed that determines if it can "freeze movement".

[ExplorerZ]

Originally Posted by genegoh is it? what happened to the 1/focal length rule?

yes like what AncientMariner said, it is only a guideline and shouldn't be taken too seriously... sometimes i can handheld at 1/60" for my 200mm shoot(without IS). and that guideline will not apply on flash photography

[Reno]

1/focal length only a guideline... it is up to yourself. if you have a very steady hand, you can play around with the shutter settings and see what is the minimum settings.