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Thread: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

  1. #41
    vince123123
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    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Can I ask who your lecturer is?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lim
    This is a two part case. In which the legal advisor is the guarantor that the contracts is valid. And he/she is willing to bear the consequences if anything were to go wrong. Its under the defenses used by lawyers practising contract laws. (as taught by my lecturer who is a lawyer)

    In the case of molestation, I do agree that anyone can point their finger and said.. "HE MOLESTED ME" but in the case that there is a group of PGs, that one group is consindered one body against the victim's word. In which a neutral party must be around to prove the innocence of the accused.

    so i guess the best option is as what Mintae has said.

    simple:
    1) dont use 16 and below for photoshoot lor (unless you taking those cute pics)
    2) have 2 witness (1 is her guardian, the other another photographer/friend/independent.)
    3) dont use studio or enclosed place.
    4) sign contract have 2 witnesses, one her guardian, the other independent.


    This alone should safe guard the PGs from any issues that may arise from the "call of molestation. Hope i am not offending anyone. BUt just trying to put what i learn into sth gd. =) sorry for the bad feelings.. =)

    Cheers

  2. #42
    Senior Member sammy888's Avatar
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    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by mintae
    but anyway, you all make teens sound live devils here.
    abit too extreme bah.
    similar to how some adults can really b*stard you.
    just have to be careful bah.

    simple:
    1) dont use 16 and below for photoshoot lor (unless you taking those cute pics)
    2) have 2 witness (1 is her guardian, the other another photographer/friend/independent.)
    3) dont use studio or enclosed place.
    4) sign contract have 2 witnesses, one her guardian, the other independent.

    wahhhhhhhh. make life easier, just dont use lorrrr.

    im cuter.
    and i still look like kid.
    If I may throw in a bit more. What is spoken here is not to say that all 15 yrs or any teens in general are like that. Or in anyway can anyone here proof what percentage are like that. We are going from one extreme to the next I guess and it is hard to avoid the fact from refcent report like Micheal Jackson trials to local ones like the case of the youth footballers who were caught having sex with minors.

    I am not going to go into the 80 yr old woman who can accuse you of rape..etc. older women..that is a "given" No doubt even a male can claim to be molested by a guy or even a woman. But it is only natural when it comes to kids, some emotional ties comes into play more acutely then compareto hearing of a man molesting an adult woman. Even in the prison, among thieves,cheaters..etc..there's a code of conduct or line they will not even cross when it comes to doing bad stuff to kids...you would be surprise how badly it will be for child molesters to be in prison and if it is found out.

    Some kind of practice must be maintain that is all we are saying I guess. Ask any professional phototgrapher who shoots kids. It is about being professional not kiasu, ensuring everyone is comfortable and well informed about what will take place. Some safety practice ( if you want to call it that) is more to prevent misunderstanding. "Hiow" teens ( cn be both boys or girls) who are vain enough and daring to decide they want to get their own pictures taken in whatever manner they think is cool..etc. And then there are those who takes picture ..well maybe they have some ambition to be child models and looking to start a porfolio, there are also those that fall in between.

    I have no doubt that if someone were to prey on you and frame you...no consent form or other form of permission will save it from being accused of it. But that does not mean no amount of precaution should not be taken when dealing with a minor. The consent form for example, why do school practice this that? Or at least I hope they still do since I am out of the school for sometime. But at least with a consent form, the parent are aware of the activitie or trip they school will take the kids to and if they do not consent, they will indicate that their kid will not. True too that the corm could be forged. But we should still find some way to ensure the parents know. Okay this is just one of many small stuff one can do. This is to not just protect the kids but the photographer as well.

    If you are shooting your own daughter, you hardly would be looked upon as some pervert if you are doing her portraits. But if you are seen dressing her up in scanty cladded clothings and making lewd poses....that is a difference situation all together...does not matter if you are the father, mother or an outsider photographer. When it come to kids, things are just abit more sensitive. But even as a father they will come a time and day that even you are not allow to do certain things you normally would do with your daughter or even son for that matter. If you tell me still bathing your 15 yr old daughter or son as those they were 7 yrs.. eg. is the right thing to do that..something is really wrong.

    I think in the Spirit of the thread's theme which is about teen...I like to think we are exploring all aspect of the situation. But when we do get involve in such a shoot....you can never know which way the card would fall. I like to think that apart from the younger teens reading this who feel we might be mis-labelling them all as wild and of course there are the older adults like myself and other,...we have to also send other signals to possible perverted folk that might be lurking here and would prey on kids in the "good name" of photography. We might need to also talk about safety and signs to look out for to help kids be aware of such fiends. No use talking cork about law and all that BS ...once the deed is done...everything is too late!.
    Last edited by sammy888; 11th January 2006 at 10:13 PM.

  3. #43

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by sammy888
    Gee ORD coming har? heheh

    Well if you like policing....you will look forward to doing it for 14 days per year like I did when called in for reservist. It is a great "holiday" each year for me. Well....hope you have had a great NS stint.

    If you get "lucky" maybe you get to join the "kins men"? If you are fit you might get sent to join the special task force reservist unit. If you are into that kind of adventure that is heheh.
    haha too bad~ i'm posted back to Training Command~ they need a photographer like me there for their major events

  4. #44
    Senior Member sammy888's Avatar
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    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by zhang3feng
    haha too bad~ i'm posted back to Training Command~ they need a photographer like me there for their major events
    Well that is a cooooool posting too man!! heheh..Enjoy it while you can man!

  5. #45

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by sammy888
    If I may throw .... (msg too long need to censored)
    No use talking cork about law and all that BS ...once the deed is done...everything is too late!.
    in simple terms... it means

    "SHI*T HAPPENS"

  6. #46

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by sammy888
    Well that is a cooooool posting too man!! heheh..Enjoy it while you can man!
    i thanked God already for sending me there... i'm gonna die in KINS sia...

  7. #47

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Hmmmm alright, point taken. Hmmmm would it be fair to say that perhaps the best defense is to just be cautious when dealing with minors? Or for the matter, anyone who have the ability to cry wolf?

    Hai.... guys, sorry huh, i'm just getting a lil carried away with the stuff i'm learning now. pretty exciting. don't mind me if i kinda stepped on anyone's tail.

    Cheers yeah.

  8. #48

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lim
    Hmmmm alright, point taken. Hmmmm would it be fair to say that perhaps the best defense is to just be cautious when dealing with minors? Or for the matter, anyone who have the ability to cry wolf?

    Hai.... guys, sorry huh, i'm just getting a lil carried away with the stuff i'm learning now. pretty exciting. don't mind me if i kinda stepped on anyone's tail.

    Cheers yeah.
    nah~ it's alrite man! it's to share!

  9. #49

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Please check out :

    http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=173111

    On the issue of model releases, age of sexual consent, types of consent pertaining to various age groups and matters of the like.

    Posted my 2-cents worth there.

    Cheers

  10. #50

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    if you want to know more about capacity of minors in law of contract, u can refer to

    http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/

    under Section 12 of Employment law(Chapter 91)
    n under English Law; MINORS’ CONTRACTS ACT(CHAPTER 389)

    Case of contract of necessaries; Nash v Inman
    [1908]2 KB 1

    Case of Beneficial Contracts of Service; De Francesco v Barnum
    (1890)45 ChD 430

  11. #51
    vince123123
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    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Good effort, but you might want to add a caveat on the scope of the Employment Act just in case there's some misunderstandings (employees vs independent contractor)

    Quote Originally Posted by dreamerz
    if you want to know more about capacity of minors in law of contract, u can refer to

    http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/

    under Section 12 of Employment law(Chapter 91)
    n under English Law; MINORS’ CONTRACTS ACT(CHAPTER 389)

    Case of contract of necessaries; Nash v Inman
    [1908]2 KB 1

    Case of Beneficial Contracts of Service; De Francesco v Barnum
    (1890)45 ChD 430

  12. #52

    Default Re: 15 yo gals n wanna b shot here?

    Quote Originally Posted by waileong
    Do share which laws you are so worried about.

    Which strict laws are you referring to? Laws against chewing gum? Public gathering? Molest? Statutory rape?

    Wai Leong
    ===
    I am happy that the original intention of this thread was kind of misinterpreted by some here and resulted in much discussion on a subject which is quite important in nature.
    For brudder Wai Leong, Laws are not meant to be worried but to be understood and respected. Those people who fear laws are those who do not understand or do not respect the laws. Like I said, PERSONALLY i think it is OK and in fact good/advantages to shoot anyone, even for those below 15, or 10 , or anything but because the shooter has to take some common sense precautions to PREVENT any unnecessary problems arising - it may be just 1 case in 100 or 1,000 shoots but to the one who is so unlucky to be in that 1 case, try listening to his frustration.
    When one shoots a, say, 15 yo gals, one is dealing with not only that gal, but her family, relatives, friends, legal, moral issues, and even oneself - temptation, etc. So even if you are extra careful, etc... you still have many other things coming at you. But if one takes some of my suggestions, at least less things are going against you. For eg, get those 15 yo to bring her friends along and you get a few photographers along, preferably some female, then the risk is definately to be more lower.
    Actually there is nothing to worry about these 15 yo if your intentions are uprights and you are clear with your objective. But again, remember in the real life, things sometime turn out to be not what you expect. For eg, you may think that you are 100% prepared and you thought that you can go fight for the president post, then see what happen if you really do ... Or if you are so powerful that you fear no one and you start suing even a more powerful person, then you will never believe that you may end up eating peanuts!

    Anyway most people can read that my thread is meant to be a one-off humour piece
    Quote Originally Posted by waileong
    The qn I want to make to the original poster is to explain what is it about 15 year olds that we should be so worried about.

    Is there any more that Canonised wants to add to the list?

    so please don't discriminate against 15 year olds.

    Wai Leong
    ===
    Also please DO NOT put words into my mouth - it's so wrong to assume that I discriminate against these 15 yo friends.... I DID mention that "shooting these 15yo has many advantages" and in fact i am proud of these young gals who advertise themselves here and I am so sure they will go places in future ..... For young photographers, you should take advantage of these opportunities but for me, nay, i rather stick to my Charby's models .... He is my insurance!
    always the Light, .... always.

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