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Thread: Incident at the Esplanade

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by redstone
    Anyone tried taking photos inside Parkview Square?
    Inside the perimeter or indoors?Former , lots of times..
    We live in an age when unnecessary things are our only necessities. - Oscar Wilde

  2. #42
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by LazerLordz
    Inside the perimeter or indoors?Former , lots of times..
    Inside the lobby?

  3. #43
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Just call tell him you call 999 to check. Ask for his name, rank and number.


    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex
    same thing happened a long time ago at national stadium in a photo club shoot
    non-uniformed man appeared claimed to be security guard
    insist we cannot take photos

    mostly they "kwa lang"
    if the group looks like it has "powerful" people, then they dare not
    if ordinary joes, they bully

    some are actually guards who make up their own rules
    some are impostors

    mostly they are scared to death if you take their photo for identification
    or ask for their service number if they are in uniform for complaining to the press and other big powerful people later
    they will start threatening to detain you and so on....
    some may snatch your camera
    can be a fistfight

    a good learning point is to observe your own group of people in the photoshoot
    there will be vociferous people who protest loudly say they will complain, blah,,, blah...
    these are paper tigers, usually the useless people
    a lot of noise
    zero guts mostly the more noise, the more useless the person

    watch for the quiet ones in the group
    the ones who do not bark
    these are the ones who bite these are the silent killers

    the security guard did the same to a lady who breast fed at esplanade
    but she was a medical doctor who wrote to the press
    so he bullied wrong person

    he got a lot of sh*t thrown at him after that

    seriously if you want to take up matter, see to it that the guilty one suffers, insist he loses his job or get a disciplinary scolding.
    see it all the way to the end. then you will send a message.
    make the charge stick. but first of all make sure you are in the right.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Similar thing as Phil happened to me at the Esplanade

    I was setting tripod and camera FACING SHENTONWAY and the corporal told me no
    photography of Esplande..........what the hell, my camera was facing opposite direction

    A lot of bullshiting and threats back and forth, i can dish out just as good as i receive, he relented,,,,,,,,all the while japanese and korean tourist snapping pictures all aournd
    Later seargant police came by and apologized

    That was last year, i thought bynow they would have been more relaxed
    seeing that the area is a tourist area....................

  5. #45

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Moral of the story, use a rangefinder? :P

  6. #46
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by EOS10D
    Similar thing as Phil happened to me at the Esplanade

    I was setting tripod and camera FACING SHENTONWAY and the corporal told me no
    photography of Esplande..........what the hell, my camera was facing opposite direction

    A lot of bullshiting and threats back and forth, i can dish out just as good as i receive, he relented,,,,,,,,all the while japanese and korean tourist snapping pictures all aournd
    Later seargant police came by and apologized

    That was last year, i thought bynow they would have been more relaxed
    seeing that the area is a tourist area....................
    Say "why those tourists can shoot and I cannot"?

    Or, like me. Pretend act blur and walk away. I learnt that tactic from someone.

  7. #47

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    bullshit! i would feel pissed if im there....nvm, ill ask the CEO of esplanade during my ICT later...since he's my Bn Commdr.

  8. #48
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by edrizal
    bullshit! i would feel pissed if im there....nvm, ill ask the CEO of esplanade during my ICT later...since he's my Bn Commdr.
    Wah!!!

    Oh.... then next time any of us were stopped by the jaga or police, we say "we asked the CEO". And see their response...

  9. #49

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    As far as I know, Esplanade will impose a charge for commercial filming or photography within its premises, unless prior notification / arrangement was made with the management. Personal use shld be fine, since there're always so many tourists & point-&-shoot users taking souvenir photos there. Esp's security guards r oso known 2b quite "on" type. I guess some of the more hardworking ones really can't differentiate between hobbyists & professionals, who tend to hold similar looking dSLR & tripods. If it's a model shoot, it'll almost always mislead them into thinking that it's a magazine shoot, so u can't really blame them for doing their job...

    Correct me if I'm wrong, I guess most of those who were stopped by their guards tend to be "adult male photographers using dSLR with or without tripods" (guards' typical stereotyped image of pro photographers)?? I was snapping there at various spots with my dSLR juz last Fri nite, Sat afternn & Sun noon time, both alone & with some fellow photographers... Wasn't stopped by anyone. Guess I was way too lucky??
    Last edited by limkopi; 24th October 2005 at 01:21 AM.
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  10. #50

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by EOS10D
    Similar thing as Phil happened to me at the Esplanade

    I was setting tripod and camera FACING SHENTONWAY and the corporal told me no
    photography of Esplande..........what the hell, my camera was facing opposite direction

    A lot of bullshiting and threats back and forth, i can dish out just as good as i receive, he relented,,,,,,,,all the while japanese and korean tourist snapping pictures all aournd
    Later seargant police came by and apologized

    That was last year, i thought bynow they would have been more relaxed
    seeing that the area is a tourist area....................

    same thing happen to me too this yr jan..it was a malay corporal(skinny about 1.6m).but i was not that luck to have a seargant come to my help...so what happen was that i LL back up and leave..

  11. #51

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    These kind of things happen every where...No thanks to terrorism and such. So I dun tink the blame shld be put on a particular incident like this Esplanade episode or the "Singapore singapore singapore..." mentality.

    It's hard for the security to draw the line on what is permitted and what is not. Sometimes this constitutes being inconsistent with their "rules". Moreover, these people are very likely not photographers themselves so appreciation of the craft may not be there. The tripod is seen as something that pros usually use. And psychologically, it gives the layman the false impression that u are doing something big time, for commercial purposes or something secretive in general, maybe even dangerous? All I can say is, security people are just covering their backsides...They have their jobs to defend. The rule they seem to use is: When in doubt, just chase the people away!

    I travel fairly widely and these happened to me when I was in Europe, New York, Canada, etc. I was even told once "U can't use the tripod but u may take the picture handheld!" How abt that guys?! How do u interpret it?! I thot what the heck... What diff does it make? It's just something to do with your presence with the tripod....
    Last edited by kiwi2; 24th October 2005 at 01:39 AM.

  12. #52
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi2
    These kind of things happen every where...No thanks to terrorism and such. So I dun tink the blame shld be put on a particular incident like this Esplanade episode or the "Singapore singapore singapore..." mentality.

    It's hard for the security to draw the line on what is permitted and what is not. Sometimes this constitutes being inconsistent with their "rules". Moreover, these people are very likely not photographers themselves so appreciation of the craft may not be there. The tripod is seen as something that pros usually use. And psychologically, it gives the layman the false impression that u are doing something big time, for commercial purposes or something secretive in general, maybe even dangerous? All I can say is, security people are just covering their backsides...They have their jobs to defend. The rule they seem to use is: When in doubt, just chase the people away!

    I travel fairly widely and these happened to me when I was in Europe, New York, Canada, etc. I was even told once "U can't use the tripod but u may take the picture handheld!" How abt that guys?! How do u interpret it?! I thot what the heck... What diff does it make? It's just something to do with your presence with the tripod....
    I knew it..it's always been those militants ' fault.
    We live in an age when unnecessary things are our only necessities. - Oscar Wilde

  13. #53
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    If it's in war time, it'd be a shoot wrongly or my life gets endangered, would you prefer to shoot wrongly or risk getting urself killed?

    Every man for himself.

  14. #54
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by limkopi
    Correct me if I'm wrong, I guess most of those who were stopped by their guards tend to be "adult male photographers using dSLR with or without tripods" (guards' typical stereotyped image of pro photographers)?? I was snapping there at various spots with my dSLR juz last Fri nite, Sat afternn & Sun noon time, both alone & with some fellow photographers... Wasn't stopped by anyone. Guess I was way too lucky??
    One of the way to overcome this pro photographers image is to dress and behave like a tourist. Works for me so far.

  15. #55

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by chris wong
    may be someone need to call up the police force PR dept to ask if we can take photo of building..if we are allow to,why are there policeman asking us to go away?

    just because your holding a warrant card and a gun, don't mean you can make up the law to scare us.

    someone with law background from CS should write to the straits time and make a big fizz about it..
    You all pretty damn sure they were cops? Please do note that the Esplanade is taken care of by general security guards as well as armed cisco officers. As far as I know, not many can distinguish between Cisco and cops, even when the former has changed their uniform recently.

    Anyway, I used my DSLR and consumer at the Esplanade on plenty of occasions, and was never stopped. Out of courtesy, I even occastionally signal to the guard if I can take the artworks on display in the Esplanade, and so far, it has always been a positive answer. In fact, sometimes I even feel as thou they are encouraging me to take those shots!
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  16. #56
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Well, just to point out actually the designs of buildings being copyrighted isn't really exactly new. Protection of copyrights isn't restricted to commercial uses either. 'Personal use' can also be an infringement of copyrights as long as you don't have the permission of the owner to use it. And I think property management do have a right to stop you from photography inside a building since it's private property (even though it might have public access).

    Of course,a lot of management don't care since they don't want a fuss about it. It also doesn't help when security and policemen who are blurred about the situation become overzealous about it.

  17. #57
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    However, taking of a photograph of a building doesn't infringe the copyright in the building.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prismatic
    Well, just to point out actually the designs of buildings being copyrighted isn't really exactly new. Protection of copyrights isn't restricted to commercial uses either. 'Personal use' can also be an infringement of copyrights as long as you don't have the permission of the owner to use it. And I think property management do have a right to stop you from photography inside a building since it's private property (even though it might have public access).

    Of course,a lot of management don't care since they don't want a fuss about it. It also doesn't help when security and policemen who are blurred about the situation become overzealous about it.

  18. #58
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by huaiwei
    You all pretty damn sure they were cops? Please do note that the Esplanade is taken care of by general security guards as well as armed cisco officers. As far as I know, not many can distinguish between Cisco and cops, even when the former has changed their uniform recently.

    Anyway, I used my DSLR and consumer at the Esplanade on plenty of occasions, and was never stopped. Out of courtesy, I even occastionally signal to the guard if I can take the artworks on display in the Esplanade, and so far, it has always been a positive answer. In fact, sometimes I even feel as thou they are encouraging me to take those shots!
    The artwork on display at the Esplanade are allowed to be shot, and the security officers will not stop you from shooting.
    eat. drink. shoot

  19. #59

    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123
    However, taking of a photograph of a building doesn't infringe the copyright in the building.
    You sure? So if I use a binoculous and peer from my window right into your flat and peep on you, it is not an invasion of privacy?

    Try looking at things from the other perspective. It arent that simple.
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  20. #60
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Incident at the Esplanade

    Yes I'm sure, you can check up the Copyright Act if you have doubts.

    Invasion of privacy (even if there's a cause of action) and copyright infringement are two separate matters - I think your analogy may be misplaced.

    Quote Originally Posted by huaiwei
    You sure? So if I use a binoculous and peer from my window right into your flat and peep on you, it is not an invasion of privacy?

    Try looking at things from the other perspective. It arent that simple.

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