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Thread: SQ standards dropped?

  1. #21
    Member Bukitimah's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    It is about trying to sell the premium class that brings down the economy class which affects rating. Depending very much also on who you xurvey.

    Focus is always on the biz class so what happen to the majority? 20-80 game?

  2. #22
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bukitimah View Post
    It is about trying to sell the premium class that brings down the economy class which affects rating. Depending very much also on who you xurvey. Focus is always on the biz class so what happen to the majority? 20-80 game?
    I posted the link on my FB and this is what a high flying friend (yes, every trip biz class) said:

    "I take SQ almost every other week for the last 6 years. I noticed a visible drop in service standards in the cabin in the last few years. The stewardess seems less well trained and less motivated these days. In changi airport, baggage handling speed also is reducing."

  3. #23
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    I posted the link on my FB and this is what a high flying friend (yes, every trip biz class) said:

    "I take SQ almost every other week for the last 6 years. I noticed a visible drop in service standards in the cabin in the last few years. The stewardess seems less well trained and less motivated these days. In changi airport, baggage handling speed also is reducing."
    Can blame it to budget airlines??? it is eating majority of the Airlines bookings only gainers with Budget Airlines are "us the passengers or aka tourist" and the country who accept Budget Airline in their airports in terms of tourism" Now majority of my friend who fly regional non business trip would fly budget than use MAS/SQ even Silk Airways etc unless the main carrier offers better deals... Only perks people get from premium airlines vs budget airlines are onboard meals, entertainment and the check-in luggage as part of the air ticket you paid.

    From the POV of the premium carriers the advent of budget airlines means less profit if less profit means less benefit to the employees less benefit means service will be affected for sure....
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  4. #24
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    "I take SQ almost every other week for the last 6 years. I noticed a visible drop in service standards in the cabin in the last few years. The stewardess seems less well trained and less motivated these days. In changi airport, baggage handling speed also is reducing."
    That sounds to me like "Crying at high levels". Again, no facts. Just subjective impressions.
    EOS

  5. #25
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    That sounds to me like "Crying at high levels". Again, no facts. Just subjective impressions.
    How do you quantify "service standards"?

  6. #26
    Senior Member Dfive's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/...GoNsk.facebook

    I tend to agree based on my personal experience. What do you think?
    You can always fly Malaysian Airlines......
    See my WTS items.. :) Any sales is by meet up face to face, payment is cash only.

  7. #27
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    That sounds to me like "Crying at high levels". Again, no facts. Just subjective impressions.
    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    How do you quantify "service standards"?
    I must agree with UncleFai.. unless you've done two standard measureable test between two carriers... then maybe you can establish a standard for service we could all use to measure ones against it... so all we can share here is based on our experience past and present and based on our perceptions.... Also your perception of a service may change if you had one bad experience.... Some are satisfied with current SQ service level some may not and same goes to other airline I may say UA, BA and Delta are crap some may argue it's not...

    So all statement made here are only based on experience there are no wrong and right here, but to quantify and give facts its hard I have given one bad experience but that doesn't mean it's always like that. Its also like this; some like iPhone and swear to God it's the best smartphone ever made and some are just disgusted with iPhone but loves Samsung so who's right and wrong there? how to quantify their experience coz each has it's own expectations and like and dislike.

    So as for UncleFai he's a regular SQ customer and traveler he may have seen and felt something may have changed from his past and present experience this is his own opinion we can argue with him but in the end others may say SQ is great and service is top notch... So my question now how would you quantify UncleFai's experience to yours or others? Do you have a common criteria of a good service? or a metric to measure a good service?
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  8. #28
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dfive View Post
    You can always fly Malaysian Airlines......
    Actually to be frank those who suffers from worst incidents like MAS I bet you they will clean up their acts, and this would be best time to try them actually... of course that's a different story if they have a history of slacking around even after an incident. The 1st MAS incident was a flap from MAS and Malaysian Gov't 2nd incident was just at pure bad luck they are at a wrong time and wrong place.. even heard SQ also flew by the same route just mins apart with the downed MAS if the schedule was switch it will be SQ was shot down not MAS...

    Its human nature every time we make a mistake and we get caught by it and we get punished what we normally do next? we are being good and abide by the law or rules right? same goes for companies also... I bet those who fly MAS now could attest service is now better some get free upgrades and discounts etc... I even heard ppl are scared to fly MAS and those who do fly some of them get upgraded to 1st class
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  9. #29
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by albertri View Post
    So my question now how would you quantify UncleFai's experience to yours or others? Do you have a common criteria of a good service? or a metric to measure a good service?
    Scroll up and you will see that this objective approach is exactly what I am looking for and that's why I don't buy any of these emotional responses of 'SQ standards have dropped'. There are plenty of methods / questionnaires to capture customer satisfaction. The tricky part is to eliminate or mitigate the emotional aspect. That's where the psychological component starts and where the surveys lose a bit of transparency, in my opinion.
    Let's use SKYTRAX as reference, they do the customer satisfaction surveys on a repeated basis. Any real measurable slip in service quality should be reflected there. But what is the result? SQ as well as Changi airport remain among the top 5 of the world in a consistent manner. But we can also see that certain airlines made their way up the ranking. And that's what we have suspected already here: it's not SQ getting bad, it's about others getting better, the gap is getting narrower.
    With regards to the experience: at first I would stop judging and jumping to conclusions. What exactly is this 'visible drop'? Could it be a change in their service approach, based on feedback or some general internal guidelines? Could it be a clash between service approach and expectations? again: more details are necessary instead of sweeping statements.
    Example: if I board the plain I know my way to the seat, I don't need help to stow my hand luggage and I certainly don't need a flight attendant waiting behind me. I don't welcome too much attention. Others have a different idea and expect the flight attendant jumping to help immediately. Obvious how two different persons will perceive it if the crew is taking a more 'step back' approach.
    Waiting for luggage is another topic reeking of subjective perception. In the past years Changi Airport has introduced the automatic clearance. It really reduces the time to get from landing gate to the luggage claim belts. So if the luggage unloading time remains unchanged then obviously a shorter time from gate to luggage belt will give the impression that the luggage takes more time to arrive - when in fact there is no change here. So did anyone take the time of luggage unloading in the past years to make a sound statement?
    EOS

  10. #30
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dfive View Post
    You can always fly Malaysian Airlines......
    Until recently, the "fact" is that it was a 5-star airlines like SQ...

    http://www.airlinequality.com/StarRanking/5star.htm

  11. #31
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Bro this is kopitiam forum why so technical about it. Let me put it this way how would you say if a photo is very good? Is it only based on technical merits? Like correct exposure, composition, framing rule of thirds etc etc? If thats the case then why there are ugly photos that hardly follow these rules etc but become famous? It got to do also with feeling how the photo speaks to you right? Service is also the same there folks who we can say easy to please and some hard. So even we quantify it with measurable or with metrics there are things that we human goes buy how it feels to us or majority if us. Another example why most Singaporean or Malaysian loves Durian and others dont? Can you make sense of those? I dont know that survey youve mentioned but i bet its not all how fast how clean how it smell etc they will also have questions to be more personal that requires you to write something based on your experience

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    Scroll up and you will see that this objective approach is exactly what I am looking for and that's why I don't buy any of these emotional responses of 'SQ standards have dropped'. There are plenty of methods / questionnaires to capture customer satisfaction. The tricky part is to eliminate or mitigate the emotional aspect. That's where the psychological component starts and where the surveys lose a bit of transparency, in my opinion. Let's use SKYTRAX as reference, they do the customer satisfaction surveys on a repeated basis. Any real measurable slip in service quality should be reflected there. But what is the result? SQ as well as Changi airport remain among the top 5 of the world in a consistent manner. But we can also see that certain airlines made their way up the ranking. And that's what we have suspected already here: it's not SQ getting bad, it's about others getting better, the gap is getting narrower. With regards to the experience: at first I would stop judging and jumping to conclusions. What exactly is this 'visible drop'? Could it be a change in their service approach, based on feedback or some general internal guidelines? Could it be a clash between service approach and expectations? again: more details are necessary instead of sweeping statements. Example: if I board the plain I know my way to the seat, I don't need help to stow my hand luggage and I certainly don't need a flight attendant waiting behind me. I don't welcome too much attention. Others have a different idea and expect the flight attendant jumping to help immediately. Obvious how two different persons will perceive it if the crew is taking a more 'step back' approach. Waiting for luggage is another topic reeking of subjective perception. In the past years Changi Airport has introduced the automatic clearance. It really reduces the time to get from landing gate to the luggage claim belts. So if the luggage unloading time remains unchanged then obviously a shorter time from gate to luggage belt will give the impression that the luggage takes more time to arrive - when in fact there is no change here. So did anyone take the time of luggage unloading in the past years to make a sound statement?
    Last edited by albertri; 5th June 2015 at 03:51 PM.
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  12. #32
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    ..The stewardess seems less well trained and less motivated these days.
    How "motivated" you want the stewardess to be?


  13. #33
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    How "motivated" you want the stewardess to be?
    Meeeoow!!!
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  14. #34
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by albertri View Post
    Bro this is kopitiam forum why so technical about it.
    Because this was your question. Although this is Kopitiam I don't see the point of not having a proper discussion about a topic raised. The (sweeping) statement was about the service standards that have (supposedly) dropped. I tried to question this, using facts and common sense. So far, very little has been brought up to support this claim. Shall we conclude that certain people here are just good in complaining? One sweeping statement answering the previous one?
    Quote Originally Posted by albertri View Post
    I dont know that survey youve mentioned but i bet its not all how fast how clean how it smell etc they will also have questions to be more personal that requires you to write something based on your experience
    For your reading:
    SKYTRAX website: http://www.airlinequality.com/StarRanking/ranking.htm
    Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skytrax
    Ok, back to Sion and his 'cats'...
    EOS

  15. #35
    Senior Member albertri's Avatar
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    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    Because this was your question. Although this is Kopitiam I don't see the point of not having a proper discussion about a topic raised. The (sweeping) statement was about the service standards that have (supposedly) dropped. I tried to question this, using facts and common sense. So far, very little has been brought up to support this claim. Shall we conclude that certain people here are just good in complaining? One sweeping statement answering the previous one?

    For your reading:
    SKYTRAX website: http://www.airlinequality.com/StarRanking/ranking.htm
    Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skytrax
    Ok, back to Sion and his 'cats'...
    I give up on you bro you're too square... ^_^ I rest my case if you still don't get what we mean here cheers!


    PS. Based on the so called SkyTrax criteria can you quantify SQ services? from your opinion do you think SQ services drops or still best?
    Last edited by albertri; 5th June 2015 at 07:26 PM.
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  16. #36

    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    Because this was your question. Although this is Kopitiam I don't see the point of not having a proper discussion about a topic raised. The (sweeping) statement was about the service standards that have (supposedly) dropped. I tried to question this, using facts and common sense. So far, very little has been brought up to support this claim. Shall we conclude that certain people here are just good in complaining? One sweeping statement answering the previous one?

    For your reading:
    SKYTRAX website: http://www.airlinequality.com/StarRanking/ranking.htm
    Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skytrax
    Ok, back to Sion and his 'cats'...
    Octarine, I'm not exactly sure what you're hoping to read. Excerpts of poor service or some form of analysis on why SQ's service seem to be observed as falling?

    I originally wrote a lengthy reply to this with about 20 points on bad service standards or practices I encountered that I've forwarded to their Feedback department through the years but then, re-reading through your replies, I thought:
    - Why is Octarine so insistent on wanting to hear "actual examples of bad service"?
    - Why is Octarine not willing to accept general views from travellers who felt that they had experienced falling standards of service?

    Maybe you're genuinely wanting to hear objective experiences (which are actually subjective anyway...), or you're working in the service industry or looking at examples to improve the service delivery in your workplace through third-party experiences, or you're actually working in SIA and wanting to gather concrete examples on flagging levels of service.

    Well, whatever the reason, I guess you're going to have to either accept that there are travellers out there who have felt let-down by the falling standards of service in SIA, or continue to believe that service standards in SIA continue to true to it's slogan of "A Great Way To Fly".

  17. #37

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    When some commented that standard had drop what does it refer to? SQ Vs SQ or SQ Vs Others? Hardware or the human touch? Hardware in SQ had improve a lot since air travel began. Food had became better, baggage allowance had increase, on time arrival almost 90% of the time, thank god to the in flight entertainment which is a vast improvement to the past. Of course we loss out to the Middle eastern countries as they fly on free fuel and have a bottomless budget. With money you can have the best and give the best ! Best Hardware, best staff, best food, best Aircraft.... Best comes with money, no money then don't talk about wanting to be the best, it's not going to happen. Look at the best team in Football league around the world, the top teams are the one with rich owners.

    When you fly budget you had a mindset that you paid lesser and get the same over all services therefore SQ standard had drop. If you paid the same amount as SQ you would have said, I might as well fly SQ... When the flight delay or get grounded you will start to appreciated what SQ will do for you compared to the budget airline which most of the time will leave you alone finding your own way out.

    I have heard so many Caucasian praising the Cabin Crew after a flight on how much they had enjoy their flight but never once from an Asian Pax. I am not sure of the reason. Is it because Asian have high level of expectation or they are more reserve and don't express their satisfaction regarding the flight.

    Everyone like to compare last time and now but they are various factor that you have to take into consideration before making a fair comparison. Many airline modelled their service procedure and Hardware according to SQ in the past. Now that everyone is providing at the same level of standard, it gives an impression that SQ standard has drop.

    What I can say is the young generation now no loner stays long as a Cabin Crew, the situation and environment now also does not encourage them to do so. As a result the Airline losses experience crew to maintain the high level of standard or service delivery. You cannot compare a Crew with less then 2 years of experience to a crew with 5 years of experience. Moral of the senior staff is also a critical factor to provide consistent high level of standard without them slacking.

    Management in the past work towards customer satisfaction and profit. Management now are more interested in their own KPI as its a big factor to determine their bonuses which goes into the Million dollars. They also stay shorter in each department and appointment. This created a mind set in them to make as much as they can before they move on leaving their baby to the next nanny. They have no interest in the staff as they are only a part time nanny of 5 years, they do not genuinely care for them resulting in low morale therefore low productivity or so call standards.

    Anyway the article mention Brand value had drop and not service standard had drop. Brand value drop as the profit dropped compared to the past. As mention above, competition is fierce when you are fighting with Airline that have no budget or airline that's on full budget and don't mind making a small profit.

    End of the day you have a choice, fly budget if you are happy or go for better all round coverage with Full service Airlines. Why many complain so much and still fly with the same Airline? Is it deep down inside they know that it still has the better price, service, food or connecting time etc etc... If there is really a better one I will move on and if I complain it's because I wish they can change to suit me so that I can go back fly with them or maybe when I am a share holder of the company and don't wish to give up my investment in the company. Remember, you don't need to fly in an Airline that you don't like.
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  18. #38

    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Well said airfins
    I fly sq 90% of the time unless there are no direct flights.
    Sometimes the planes are less tidy, older and some crew less friendly. Even the food quality has dropped - no more ice cream for some flights, peanuts etc
    Yet they are still far better than most airlines.

    For the complaining ones try UA.. It's even worse than Tiger.

  19. #39

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    Some ppl here just wan to complain without substance. Just like some stupid online media against SG. just wan to say things with the intention to discredit.

    I wonder whether they really fly SQ or not. I can also say whatever I want online without having to show evidence. And also whether they fly other airlines to give fair comparison.

    I fly SQ most of the time and I never find any problem, and I not ANG MO, just a regular SG Chinese. And I took Turkish, French, Korean, EVA, Emirates, Qantas, Swiss etc. And I can tell everyone here that SQ is still top one. The closest to SQ would be Emirates. They are as good as SQ. the rest, can throw in the bin.

    And yeah, try american airlines like UA and u will know what is bad service.

    What do u expect from cabin service? Special massage, kneel in front of you while serving yr drinks?!

    Be more reasonable in yr expectations. And don't be like Real Singapore and discredit with ill intention.

    Yes, I know abt SQ cutting costs and cabin crew not happy with work. I have cabin crew friends. But their service is still good when comes to work.

  20. #40

    Default Re: SQ standards dropped?

    Like I said earlier, it's subjective.

    If you feel that SQ service is still up to your standards, that's perfectly fine. It fits your expectations.

    But if others feel that SQ service is not up to their standards, that's perfectly fine too. It didn't meet their expectations.

    Just because it's different from yours doesn't make them wrong nor does it make them overly demanding. Just different.

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