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Thread: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

  1. #41
    Member coolhirako's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kklee View Post

    Fatigue is very individual.

    So your are saying that this cyclist under fatigue but managed to "siam"(evade) 1st lane n 2nd lane car ? He been hit by the taxi cause he is tired to make road judgement ?
    He shld stay in gym to do cyclist exercise not on the road
    Last edited by coolhirako; 9th May 2015 at 04:43 PM.

  2. #42

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by coolhirako View Post
    So your are saying that this cyclist under fatigue but managed to "siam"(evade) 1st lane n 2nd lane car ? He been hit by the taxi cause he is tired to make road judgement ?
    He shld stay in gym to do cyclist exercise not on the road
    Please re-read my posts.

    Actually you might as well say that I am saying that fatigue has cause the blue taxi driver to hit the cyclist because the drivers of the other cars including the yellow taxi are not fatigued because they managed not to hit anything.

  3. #43

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    What is your definition of "a safe opportunity" to make a turn? To me, it's clear. Use the pedestrian crossing when there is one. It's stated in the guide.
    If I may just chime in... since the question was directed at the quote I posted.

    Wish we could ask whoever drafted the text for the Road Traffic Act. My definition, as both a driver and cyclist, is when the flow of traffic eases up sufficiently, or stops completely, and gives me enough time to make the turn safely without causing a collision or obstruction to other road users.

    I think the contents of this page (http://driving-in-singapore.spf.gov..../cyclists.html), as the introduction mentions, covers "some of the safe cycling behaviours and habits". It appears that there are some points in there which are reflected in law, while others are safety tips which aren't reflected in law.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but these two tips under "On Safe Cycling Behaviours (DOs)" seem to be recommended 'safe cycling behaviour' but not law? I say this because you don't find them mentioned under the Road Traffic (Bicycles) Rules, Road Traffic Act? It seems like if cyclists are prohibited from performing a right turn without using a pedestrian crossing, it will be mentioned here?

    • Give pedestrians advance warning as you approach them by ringing your bell.
    • Always dismount from your bicycle and ensure that it is safe to cross before crossing at traffic light junctions. Cyclists should practice the kerb drill too! Look right. Look Left. Look Right again!
    Personally, I think it's good advice for cyclists. When I cycle, this is what I do for right turns. Perhaps for lack of guts/skill, but often I find the traffic flow way too challenging for me to filter to the right lane, and then make a right turn. Still possible in quiet small roads in hdb estates, but almost impossible for me at major junctions.

    tl;dr: Since bicycles are classified as vehicles under the Road Traffic Act, my understanding then is that cyclists do have the option of performing a right turn as described, and they are not required by law to dismount and cross using the pedestrian crossing.

    Using the pedestrian crossing is a good safety tip, but not required by law. Just my layman's reading, I could be wrong. If anyone else knows better, please help us clarify the discussion above.

    Vehicle making right turn at road intersection or junction
    8.—(1) The driver or rider of a vehicle stationary at or approaching a controlled intersection or junction of roads and wishing to turn to the right shall, as soon as the intersection or junction is open to the vehicle, move forward as near as possible to the centre of the intersection or junction and await a safe opportunity to complete the turn to the right.
    (2) When turning the driver or rider of the vehicle shall proceed with due regard for the safety of pedestrians crossing the road.

    ROAD TRAFFIC ACT (CHAPTER 276, SECTION 140)
    Last edited by kandinsky; 9th May 2015 at 08:30 PM.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Clause 8 says.....

    Bicycle to be ridden on left side of road
    8. Every bicycle shall be ridden close to the left hand edge of the roadway and in such a manner as not to obstruct vehicles moving at a faster speed.


    Unless there is another clause somewhere which suggests this can be waived in certain conditions, I take it that cyclists will have to use the pedestrian crossings(where available) to make right turns. To me, the guide supplements the act, a step further to prevent violation.
    Last edited by Kit; 9th May 2015 at 09:31 PM.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    and bringing back my original question......

    what's that imbecile doing in the middle of the road?

  6. #46

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    Unless there is another clause somewhere which suggests this can be waived in certain conditions, I take it that cyclists will have to use the pedestrian crossings(where available) to make right turns. To me, the guide supplements the act, a step further to prevent violation.
    You're right, that part does imply that.

    To me, it's one thing to say the guide supplements the act, it's another to say the guide = law (even if issued by relevant authorities). For example, all of these safety tips are also in the guide, but you can't be cited for breaking any laws if you happen to be riding a bicycle too small/big for you, while wearing slippers & dark clothes, without a helmet.

    Ride a bicycle that fits you
    Always check that your bicycle is in good working condition and is properly maintained.
    Wear a suitable protective bicycle helmet to safeguard yourself against head injuries should you fall.
    Wear proper shoes and ensure they are tied properly.
    Wear light-coloured clothing to enhance your visibility to other road users.
    Interesting discussion. I've dropped the TP an email with a query about this. Will update this thread if/when they respond.

  7. #47

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    just ignore kit, he trolling . cyclists can filter to the right if he/she needs to turn right. period. don't feed the troll.
    Last edited by ninelives; 10th May 2015 at 11:08 AM.
    Objection !!!

  8. #48
    Moderator nitewalk's Avatar
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    Okay ladies and gentlemen (i think no ladies in this thread so far) don't be angry. Relax, have a cup of tea. There is no prize for winning in kopitiam. Since kandinsky has emailed TP, we wait for the official word from the authorities okay?

  9. #49

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by ninelives View Post
    just ignore kit, he trolling . cyclists can filter to the right if he/she needs to turn right. period. don't feed the troll.
    As a driver & cyclist myself, feeding my personal curiosity

  10. #50
    Senior Member sammy888's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    Nope, cyclists are supposed to take the pedestrian crossings.
    Let me just add to that.

    When a cyclist use the pedestrian crossings he/she is by law supposed to get off their bike and push it across not weave and bop trying to ride through walking pedestrians using same road crossing. There actually is a fine for not doing so in case people here are ignorant about it. But because it's only $20 iirc thus nobody cares to take action including polices. When was the last time you saw a police or URA stop a cyclist riding across a pedestrian to write them up?

    I think not enough has been done to show or educate the public at housing estate on what constitute an illegal riding act for bicycles and that there are REALLY offenses for such irresponsibly riding.

    http://ifonlysingaporeans.blogspot.s...hen-using.html
    A good photo's 45% you, 45% practice & 10% equipment. A bad photo share the same ratio.

  11. #51

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by sammy888 View Post
    Let me just add to that.

    When a cyclist use the pedestrian crossings he/she is by law supposed to get off their bike and push it across not weave and bop trying to ride through walking pedestrians using same road crossing. There actually is a fine for not doing so in case people here are ignorant about it. But because it's only $20 iirc thus nobody cares to take action including polices. When was the last time you saw a police or URA stop a cyclist riding across a pedestrian to write them up?

    I think not enough has been done to show or educate the public at housing estate on what constitute an illegal riding act for bicycles and that there are REALLY offenses for such irresponsibly riding.

    http://ifonlysingaporeans.blogspot.s...hen-using.html
    It's been reported before that people have been fined after cycling across pedestrian crossings, that logically led people to conclude that the act was the offence. I thought the same for the longest time.

    But if you take a look at a response to a query in parliament in 2009, then Minster of Home Affairs WKS clarified that "cyclists are not prohibited from riding across pedestrian crossings but must do so in a safe and orderly manner". He also referred to the blanket rule that gives the TP the flexibility to issue a summon for anyone that they deem is not riding "in an orderly manner and with due regard for the safety of others".

    So, unless the legislation has changed since then, isn't it accurate to say that the law is not against the act of riding across pedestrian crossings, but against unsafe riding that endangers others?

    When a cyclist use the pedestrian crossings he/she is by law supposed to get off their bike and push it across not weave and bop trying to ride through walking pedestrians using same road crossing.
    That said, your comment is also accurate as long as the cyclist is being unsafe. Weaving through walking pedestrians is clearly unsafe. Have seen cyclists ride through crowds, little kids, family with baby stroller etc.

    For reference:

    WRITTEN ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS
    TRAFFIC OFFENCES AMONG CYCLISTS

    1. Dr Lim Wee Kiak asked the Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Home Affairs (a) how many cyclists have been booked for traffic offences over the past 12 months; (b) what are the common offences; and (c) what is the rule for vehicular traffic when cyclists ride their bicycles across pedestrian crossings.

    Mr Wong Kan Seng:

    One thousand, three hundread and twelve summonses were issued to errant cyclists for cycling offences between July 2008 and June 2009. Of these, the largest number of 615 summonses were issued to cyclists for cycling on the footways of roads. Other common infringements include failing to ride in an orderly manner such as not keeping a proper lookout and not giving way to traffic with the right of way, riding on expressways and riding against the flow of traffic.

    Cyclists are not prohibited from riding across pedestrian crossings but must do so in a safe and orderly manner. Those who do not and cause danger to others commit an offence under Rule 10 of the Road Traffic (Bicycles) Rules and are liable to pay a composition fine. If they ride in a rash or negligent manner that endangers life, or in a manner that is likely to cause hurt or injury to others, they can be prosecuted under Section 279 of the Penal Code. If convicted, they can be fined up to $5,000 or imprisoned up to one year, or both.

    When approaching pedestrian crossings, a driver is required to keep a proper lookout for other road users, slow down and proceed at such a speed which will enable him to stop his vehicle before reaching the crossing. Failure to do so may result in the driver being liable for a fine of up to $1,000, or imprisonment for a term of up to three months under Section 131 of the Road Traffic Act.

    via: PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES, ELEVENTH PARLIAMENT
    Monday, 19th October, 2009
    http://sprs.parl.gov.sg/search/repor...ID=00004793-WA
    Bicycle to be ridden in an orderly manner
    10. No bicycle shall be ridden or propelled otherwise than in an orderly manner and with due regard for the safety of others.

    http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/aol/searc...rec=0#pr10-he-.
    Last edited by kandinsky; 10th May 2015 at 03:00 AM.

  12. #52
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by nitewalk View Post
    Okay ladies and gentlemen (i think no ladies in this thread so far) don't be angry. Relax, have a cup of tea. There is no prize for winning in kopitiam. Since kandinsky has emailed TP, we wait for the official word from the authorities okay?
    Apologies if I've crossed the line but this issue struck a chord. I've seen my fair share of irresponsible cyclists who think everyone on the road should see them coming and give way to them. The law seems to favour them to the extend of being bias just because they appear to be vulnerable. It's high time they put those people in their places. I have zero sympathy for them.

  13. #53
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by kandinsky View Post
    You're right, that part does imply that.

    To me, it's one thing to say the guide supplements the act, it's another to say the guide = law (even if issued by relevant authorities). For example, all of these safety tips are also in the guide, but you can't be cited for breaking any laws if you happen to be riding a bicycle too small/big for you, while wearing slippers & dark clothes, without a helmet.



    Interesting discussion. I've dropped the TP an email with a query about this. Will update this thread if/when they respond.
    or it could be they are not strictly enforced.....

  14. #54
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by ninelives View Post
    just ignore kit, he trolling . cyclists can filter to the right if he/she needs to turn right. period. don't feed the troll.

    I'd like to see you come back and tell us that the day they scoop up your brain from the kerbside and ship you off in very small boxes.

    Wait a minute...... you can't.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Kahuna View Post
    Call me bias...when it's involving a Taxi....its gonna be..50-50......it's bull to say we can't have cyclist on the road...many other countries have no problem for them to co-exist....we seriously need to look into driving behaviour and graciousness
    Just curious Kahuna,

    How do you decide it was a 50-50 case?

    EisMann

  16. #56
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Quote Originally Posted by housewife forever View Post
    I pity the poor cyclist .. now everyone comment on his action.

    Sometime it maybe just a poor judgement at a point of time, a lost of concentration etc ... I think let just give him a break and move on .. hopefully the taxi drive is not penalized in any way ...
    HouseWife,

    I was sure Ma Chi, (some speculated both heads were) having poor judgement, a lost concentration when he rammed his $1.8 million Ferrari 599 GTO at 178kmh into the taxi while beating the red light at the traffic junction.

    EisMann

  17. #57

    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    I'd like to see you come back and tell us that the day they scoop up your brain from the kerbside and ship you off in very small boxes.

    Wait a minute...... you can't.
    see? told u he trolling. add to block list.

    not worth spending 1 sec replying to an idiot.
    Last edited by ninelives; 10th May 2015 at 11:12 AM.
    Objection !!!

  18. #58
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Accident involving taxi and bicyclist

    Good riddance.

    Do yourself a favour and find out the definition of troll before you use it again.

  19. #59
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post

    You originally tole me to read the quote by Catchlights. Now you changed it to kandinsky. Shouldn't you make a clarification about that error to avoid misunderstanding?
    It seems your response and my editing happened at the same time. No need to get uptight. Please stick to the question raised.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    What is your definition of "a safe opportunity" to make a turn? To me, it's clear. Use the pedestrian crossing when there is one. It's stated in the guide.
    All opportunities that are permitted by the Road Traffic Act. Period.
    Your own interpretation is just yours, nothing else. Feel free to follow your own opinion (within the limits of the laws), but don't make it a rule for others to follow.
    EOS

  20. #60
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    So can you single out the clause in the act which allows cyclists to filter to the outer lanes for right turns when a crossing is available?

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