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Thread: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

  1. #21
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    lets go out and shoot instead

  2. #22

    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    Quote Originally Posted by zaren View Post
    Just to add on to Nitewalk's post.

    kei1309, we can see that you are very passionate about Sony, and feel that Frankyang's remarks against Sony are too "personal". I would suggest that you remain objective and refrain from making unwarranted and off-topic remarks against Frank, such as the composition of his photos, or his honesty.

    It's way too early in the year to be embroiled in brand wars. Let's all stay polite and objective in our posts, and keep newbies' corner a useful resource for newbies.
    i get what you mean, but even so, i feel that i need to correct the incorrect, sweeping statements about Sony and some technicalities on photography. and critique on the photos was just a "by the way thing". i felt that if the photos were composed in a better way (from Frankyang's page), it would bring out the X-T1's qualities better.

    and no, i did not call Frankyang any names and made it personal in any way. if i wanted to make it personal i would have called Fuji cameras poor in handling, JPEG rendering, and the rest which i know aren't true about Fuji. in fact, i've used Fuji for years and i know the quality.

    and if i offended someone by using the phrase "be honest about it", it's a lingo for admitting that you didn't know in the first place. i'm not calling anyone dishonest. and basing the full usage of the A7II on the usage of the RX100 is just weird.

    now i know how hard the Mods are working but really, but in my defence looking at my posts i hardly would call it a personal attack like what Frankyang alleged. if any one wanted to start a brand war, it certainly wasn't me.

    if Frankyang wants to be very sensitive about this and wants to continue being offended, i really have nothing to say, since he is a new member and is protected here.

    moving along now...
    Last edited by kei1309; 11th January 2015 at 11:49 PM.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    when i started looking for a camera recently....a few options came to mind....OMD EM1, the sony, and Fuji, even Canon 5D 3. I went with the Fuji without much thoughts because I simply love the "manual" controls. Maybe because my first love was a manual camera more than 20 years ago.

    I also bought the x100T for it's retro looks.....i had considered the panasonic LX100 and Ricoh GR but somehow i just have more chemistry with the x100T
    Last edited by Ralf Winston; 12th January 2015 at 07:11 PM.

  4. #24
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    I have used many systems and currently using an XT1 as my 2nd system. While it is a great camera, I find it lacking in many areas. Same goes to the sony a7ii. In fact, if you look closely enough, you can find fault with every camera system.

    In the end, it is our eye and skill that we need to focus on. What you use does not matter. In the end, only the image matters.

  5. #25

    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    No camera is perfect. although the camera is just a tool to create images , you have to use something that you like (to use and handle) and appeal to you. People stick to certain camera designs and brands for a reason. If what you use does not matter, camera shops will just stock one brand of camera only.

    on the other hand if you are a photography student and the teacher give you 2 camera to choose to complete your assignment, then i would say , yes. it doesn't matter.
    Last edited by Ralf Winston; 12th January 2015 at 12:31 PM.

  6. #26

    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    Quote Originally Posted by frankyang View Post
    Hello! I was facing the same dilemma as you a while back, trying to choose between the Fujifilm XT-1 or Sony Alpha 7. I actually deliberated for many, many months (close to one year) until the XT-1 silver graphite edition came out! The 7ii wasn't out at that time. I eventually went with the XT-1 and am extremely happy with my purchase. These are my reasons and hopefully they can be useful to you:

    1) As a hobbyist, I shoot in JPEG and don't have time to process RAW files. The Alpha 7's colour processing for JPEGs straight out of the camera does not seem to be as good as Fujifilm's according to reviews I read online. In fact, one of the cons listed for the A7 by dpreview.com was that it is not for predominantly JPEG shooters. That worried me somewhat as I shoot JPEGs. Can't be happier with the XT-1 with it's colours for JPEGs straight out of the camera. Very little adjustments needed from me. Saves me a lot of time so I can focus on shooting. You can take a look at some of my shots here with the XT-1: http://www.500px.com/fengtography

    2) Coming from a Canon EOS system, I know how important lenses are to complement these camera bodies. The only lenses that interested me for the Sony Alpha 7 were the Carl Zeiss 35 and 50mm. Again, if you read some online reviews, the Sony kit lens (like the 24-70) do not bring out the full capabilities of the full-frame A7, which to me is quite a waste. You need good lens to really bring out the capabilities of a good full-frame camera. I tried the 50mm at the Sony Store, and it was not wide enough for me, so I hesitated buying it there and then. My personal preference is to use 35mm for street photography. The 35mm Carl Zeiss is f2.8, compared to the Fujinon XF23mm (35mm equivalent) which is f1.4! That's like FOUR TIMES more light which makes a whole lot of difference in street photography, especially in low light conditions! If you want to do street photography at night, being able to open the aperture up to f/1.4 versus 2.8 makes a world of difference! The XF23mm is tack sharp wide open at f/1.4.

    3) Lens line-up: Fujifilm has come up with a really nice line-up of X-mount lenses that are really high quality, comparable with Canon L-lenses WITHOUT the price tag. Coming from Canon, I know again that unless you pay thousands of dollars for L-lenses, there is nothing for the mid-range hobbyist. They have low end, basic cheap lens that are quite dismal, nothing in between, and L-lens at the top end costing thousands and more each. All of the Fuji lenses are going to give you Made In Japan, L-lens quality without the price tag. The Fujinon XF23mm f/1.4 retails for around $1000+, give you top quality shots that I can't tell apart from any of those I made with my Canon L lenses. No distortion, tack sharp even wide open, terrific colours. Fujinon has been making lenses for TV film cameras for years, and their experience shows! On top of that, all the Fuji lens are priced very decently for what you get. Sony does not have a complete line-up of lens at this moment with comparable quality. As I mentioned, the Sony branded lens do not bring out the full capabilities of the full-frame camera. Even the XT-1 kit lens (18-55mm) is excellent quality for a kit lens.

    4) The Fujifilm XT-1 and almost all of the XF lenses are made in Japan. The quality and handling is terrific. You get a lot of camera for the money.

    5) The Fujifilm XT-1 is the only camera on the market right now with separate control dials for shutter speed, ISO, aperture (on lens) and exposure compensation. No other camera has separate dials for doing these manual exposure. If you want to do streets or weddings, I think you need to be able to adjust camera settings on-the-fly, or see what settings you're on at a glance. The XT-1 allows me to do that by just glancing down at the buttons but the Alpha 7 cannot. I used a Sony RX100iii for a while and all the settings were buried within the camera.

    6) Frequent firmware updates - Fujifilm is the the only camera manufacturer that releases firmware upgrades that add / improve upon features of their existing cameras. From what I've observed they really listen to their users. Having used a Sony RX100iii for a while (it was an excellent point and shoot camera), I do not agree with the direction Sony is going in. Maybe they are too big a company to care. Sony forces you to buy accessories which should have been included right in the box. If I'm not mistaken, the A7 is the same case as the RX100iii. After paying so much for the camera, they expect you to pay EXTRA for an external charger so you can charge the battery OUTSIDE of the camera!?!? Another case in point: The $4000 Sony RX1 expects you to pay over $500 to get a separate EVF!?!? I cannot put my faith and trust in a company that fleeces its consumers for more money. Needless to say, a company that does this will not release firmware upgrades to improve the functionality of their existing cameras. When you buy a camera, you're really making an investment into a camera system. If the company changes the system you're effectively stranded, thousands of dollars down the drain. Sony has so far not demonstrated any commitment to assure photographers about this.

    I always thought my next camera would be a full-frame... but as I mentioned, I would trade full-frame for all of the pros listed above. I haven't been disappointed so far, and in the short time I've been with the Fuji system I've bought 4 lenses (18-55, 23, 35, XC50-230), all excellent in quality... even the so-called more budget XC lens is amazing.

    If the above reasons resonate with you, I think you wouldn't be disappointed! Again, full-frame vs. non full-frame becomes a moot point if you really look at the photographs the XT-1 is able to take: http://500px.com/fengtography

    My opinions on other people's opinions above.


    1) On the flip side of it, raw processing can be a problem with the XT-1 as some popular raw precessing software is just bad with xtrans files. Search about plasticky skin and mushy leaves on some Fuji cameras.

    2) There may be caveats where lenses with larger aperture values is concerned. First is that one don't need the shallow DOF and may pay more for nothing. Second is that lenses when stopped down do not always have a circular like aperture, so the background blur can look odd. Something to think about when comparing Fuji and Sony lenses. Third is that one need lenses with larger apertures on smaller sensors to get the same degree of bokeh on cameras of larger sensors with lenses of smaller apertures. One needs to think about the above and not just assume larger aperture values is better. There is simply way to conclude which is better or worse here.

    3) Just to clarify, most TV camera lenses are never of as high quality compared to film or digital still camera lenses due to the far lower resolution, so the example is invalid. There is also some sweeping statements that Sony branded lenses are inferior and cannot cater to FF sensors. I also don't buy into the idea that Fuji lenses is good, the corners are weak and not worth the premium paid for some lenses in the lineup. Just search for comparisons between Zeiss Touit 32 and Fujinon 35. This is not to say Sony lenses are good as well, just a clarification that there is some bias in those opinions. While it is true that the lens line for Sony up is currently weak, another strength in the Sony system is that one gets bodies with 36MP for high resolution, 24MP with and without IBIS for general use and 12MP for super low light use. Another body is on the way with a new sensor. A variety of the latest sensors to choose from is not such a bad thing.

    4) No idea what this was meant to mean. If it was meant to project the idea things made in Japan is better than made elsewhere, I think some quantitative evidence is required. I am 100% sure than made in Japan does not mean no problems.

    5) Separate dials with visible values for each function is nice, but is it necessary? The answer is a resounding no. Aperture, shutter speed, ISO and exposure compensation can be controlled by dedicated dials, wheels and buttons and viewed on the viewfinder and LCD screen on the A7 series. In practice, accessing these values and changing them on either camera is just as fast and easy.

    6) Firmware updates is part and parcel of most digital cameras where faults exists, so this is equal for most brands. Upgrades is something else, and there are dependancies on hardware as well. Fuji gets more points over Sony where upgrades is concerned, this is my opinion. It does not mean that Sony does not roll out upgrades, just less frequent. Where RX1 and RX1R is concerned, it currently costs only $27XX all in and the recent promotion in December included the EVF, thumb grip and hood FREE! Sony actually gives away free stuff!


    7) Go get a Nikon or Canon DLSR for weddings. Get an smaller PnS like the Ricoh GR for street shooting.

  7. #27

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    Recently shot an AD wedding with A7ii and A7 as 2nd body. Performance and handling was a breeze with modern features that's rarely found on pro level dslrs like flip screen and good live view focusing etc. Focusing was adequate with my 2 zeiss lenses (24-70, 55) and I could run around 50 tables all day and don't feel tired. My videography partner panted like a dog 30 mins into the wedding. And in terms of pure image quality, it is as good if not better than current FF canikon DSLRs. So if anyone has any doubts about the A7's capabilities for wedding photography, I can safely say it's as gd as any dslr.

    Fuji has good jpeg processing and renders skin tones for portraits quite uniquely and uniquely well, thanks to its xtrans sensor. But that's not something that can't be reproduced with post production, especially with the awesome 24mp raw files from the FF sony sensor. If u like the images straight out of a fuji camera, I'd suggest u get the xm1 instead. If u want FF goodness in a small package (and great price point), Sony is really hard to beat.

    Some people are going to say that FF is not important blah blah blah. True to an extent, but you will have to ask urself if you want to be able to take heldheld lowlight shots at high ISO, great dynamic range out of camera, shallow depth of field control, and lower noise when recovering shadow details in postprocessing... If u do, get a FF. If not, crop is fine.
    hi

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Which one should i get? Fujifilm XT1 or sony a7ii?

    Quote Originally Posted by obfuscate View Post
    My opinions on other people's opinions above.


    1) On the flip side of it, raw processing can be a problem with the XT-1 as some popular raw precessing software is just bad with xtrans files. Search about plasticky skin and mushy leaves on some Fuji cameras.

    2) There may be caveats where lenses with larger aperture values is concerned. First is that one don't need the shallow DOF and may pay more for nothing. Second is that lenses when stopped down do not always have a circular like aperture, so the background blur can look odd. Something to think about when comparing Fuji and Sony lenses. Third is that one need lenses with larger apertures on smaller sensors to get the same degree of bokeh on cameras of larger sensors with lenses of smaller apertures. One needs to think about the above and not just assume larger aperture values is better. There is simply way to conclude which is better or worse here.

    3) Just to clarify, most TV camera lenses are never of as high quality compared to film or digital still camera lenses due to the far lower resolution, so the example is invalid. There is also some sweeping statements that Sony branded lenses are inferior and cannot cater to FF sensors. I also don't buy into the idea that Fuji lenses is good, the corners are weak and not worth the premium paid for some lenses in the lineup. Just search for comparisons between Zeiss Touit 32 and Fujinon 35. This is not to say Sony lenses are good as well, just a clarification that there is some bias in those opinions. While it is true that the lens line for Sony up is currently weak, another strength in the Sony system is that one gets bodies with 36MP for high resolution, 24MP with and without IBIS for general use and 12MP for super low light use. Another body is on the way with a new sensor. A variety of the latest sensors to choose from is not such a bad thing.

    4) No idea what this was meant to mean. If it was meant to project the idea things made in Japan is better than made elsewhere, I think some quantitative evidence is required. I am 100% sure than made in Japan does not mean no problems.

    5) Separate dials with visible values for each function is nice, but is it necessary? The answer is a resounding no. Aperture, shutter speed, ISO and exposure compensation can be controlled by dedicated dials, wheels and buttons and viewed on the viewfinder and LCD screen on the A7 series. In practice, accessing these values and changing them on either camera is just as fast and easy.

    6) Firmware updates is part and parcel of most digital cameras where faults exists, so this is equal for most brands. Upgrades is something else, and there are dependancies on hardware as well. Fuji gets more points over Sony where upgrades is concerned, this is my opinion. It does not mean that Sony does not roll out upgrades, just less frequent. Where RX1 and RX1R is concerned, it currently costs only $27XX all in and the recent promotion in December included the EVF, thumb grip and hood FREE! Sony actually gives away free stuff!


    7) Go get a Nikon or Canon DLSR for weddings. Get an smaller PnS like the Ricoh GR for street shooting.
    Hi thank you and I appreciate your reply which pointed out several things I did not know about Sony cameras I have always thought that the Sony RX and Alpha series are spectacular cameras. Still hope to own them one day when my budget allows for it and when they have good promotions / new models Just that my budget and weekend shooting schedule only allows me to choose one camera, and I went with the one that most suited me.

    It was not an easy choice to make and as several have pointed out, both are excellent cameras with their own pros and cons. I myself benefitted greatly from reading anecdotal and ad-hoc reviews like this from both camps (highly UN-objective ones if I may add) that greatly helped in my decision making.

    One reason why I enjoyed reading those lively debates was because while each camp was highly passionate about their equipment, they were always respectful and never once did they try to impose their own standards of artistic merit or objectivity on others. I think that's what makes photography so fun for all of us - the ability to use whatever we want, to make whatever we want, without having to be accountable to others!

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