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Thread: Question on Shooting wide open

  1. #21

    Default Re: Question on Shooting wide open

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    I know for sure nikon cam bodies are capable of tracking stationary subjects and so does canon cameras. You just have to figure out how it is done. And I know for sure auto af point selection is not something you should use in this situation.

    cam tech has come a long way. In the end, the hardware is quite capable. It is more on the user to understand how his/her equipmemt work. Don't blame the equipment.
    The way to do it on Canon bodies is to use AF point expansion, similar to Nikon's dynamic area AF, a feature which is available only in the "pro" bodies like the 7D and 5D3. The 60D doesn't have it, and neither does the 6D (TS's camera).

    Your argument against using automatic AF point selection does not apply for entry level Canon cameras, as it works differently from other cameras. Canon entry level bodies (and 6D) have only 2 AF area modes: single point and automatic point selection. In AI servo mode, automatic point selection will use the centre AF point as a starting position. You focus on the subject using the centre point, and when the subject moves, the camera will use the other AF points to continue tracking the subject. At least this is what it is supposed to do. From my experience it doesn't work particularly well if the subject isn't moving and you move the camera.

    The only way to have something similar to dynamic area AF mode on entry level Canon bodies is to install Magic Lantern firmware to get a zone AF area mode, which also helps you change AF points quicker. It does not directly replace dynamic area AF though, it just works like automatic AF point selection, except you specify a zone where it will pick up contrast and focus on it.

    I'm blaming my equipment not because I don't know how it works. I'm blaming it because focus tracking really doesn't work for focus-recomposition on my camera. There just isn't an AF combination for Canon entry level bodies that does it.

    Focus mdoes: One Shot, AI Servo, AI Focus
    Focus area modes: Single point, Automatic point selection

    Now, tell me, with those combinations, is AI Servo and automatic point selection not the best combination possible for tracking subjects that move across the frame in a focus recomposing scenario?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by brapodam View Post
    The way to do it on Canon bodies is to use AF point expansion, similar to Nikon's dynamic area AF, a feature which is available only in the "pro" bodies like the 7D and 5D3. The 60D doesn't have it, and neither does the 6D (TS's camera).

    Your argument against using automatic AF point selection does not apply for entry level Canon cameras, as it works differently from other cameras. Canon entry level bodies (and 6D) have only 2 AF area modes: single point and automatic point selection. In AI servo mode, automatic point selection will use the centre AF point as a starting position. You focus on the subject using the centre point, and when the subject moves, the camera will use the other AF points to continue tracking the subject. At least this is what it is supposed to do. From my experience it doesn't work particularly well if the subject isn't moving and you move the camera.

    The only way to have something similar to dynamic area AF mode on entry level Canon bodies is to install Magic Lantern firmware to get a zone AF area mode, which also helps you change AF points quicker. It does not directly replace dynamic area AF though, it just works like automatic AF point selection, except you specify a zone where it will pick up contrast and focus on it.

    I'm blaming my equipment not because I don't know how it works. I'm blaming it because focus tracking really doesn't work for focus-recomposition on my camera. There just isn't an AF combination for Canon entry level bodies that does it.

    Focus mdoes: One Shot, AI Servo, AI Focus
    Focus area modes: Single point, Automatic point selection

    Now, tell me, with those combinations, is AI Servo and automatic point selection not the best combination possible for tracking subjects that move across the frame in a focus recomposing scenario?
    All I can say is I feel sorry for Canon users for the company's decision to cripple their lower end cameras. This and spot metering at af point.

    Thank God I am a nikon user.

    according to what you mentioned, only way to do it right in canon low end models is to use continuous single point selection. There is always a way to get around. That is our job as a photographer, knowing the limitations and find a way to accomplish the job at hand.
    Last edited by daredevil123; 12th September 2014 at 07:50 PM.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Question on Shooting wide open

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    All I can say is I feel sorry for Canon users for the company's decision to cripple their lower end cameras. This and spot metering at af point.

    Thank God I am a nikon user.

    according to what you mentioned, only way to do it right in canon low end models is to use continuous single point selection. There is always a way to get around. That is our job as a photographer, knowing the limitations and find a way to accomplish the job at hand.
    Every brand cripples their entry level models, just that most of them are not as serious as Canon. Nikon removes CLS system and AF motor from entry level bodies, but there are workarounds.

    Canon seems to remove more and more features from their lower level bodies, which is very upsetting. Even the 60D line isn't spared. They took away the build quality, AF microadjustment, and joystick (for changing AF points) and replaced it with a crappy d-pad thingy which has bad feedback, and made it even worse (smaller) on the 70D.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Question on Shooting wide open

    Quote Originally Posted by brapodam View Post
    Depends on what camera you're using. My 60D will re-focus on whatever is at the AF point immediately, it will not track. 60D does not have an option to set the delay before AI servo picks another focus target, so it happens immediately. I believe 70D can, but it is still unreliable from my experience. Swinging the camera will make the camera switch the AF point to something nearby, but not exactly what you initially focused on.
    you can read your manual again
    宁愿遇见丢失幼崽的母熊,也不愿碰上做蠢事的愚人

  5. #25

    Default Re: Question on Shooting wide open

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    All I can say is I feel sorry for Canon users for the company's decision to cripple their lower end cameras. This and spot metering at af point.

    Thank God I am a nikon user.

    according to what you mentioned, only way to do it right in canon low end models is to use continuous single point selection. There is always a way to get around. That is our job as a photographer, knowing the limitations and find a way to accomplish the job at hand.
    I must agree it's true that Nikon is very reliable with tracking stationary subjects when you move the camera, as well as using AF-C as a "single shot" mode (af-on activation). Infact AF-C is generally more precise than AF-S, especially so in the D3/D700 era, so this was the accepted work-around for the newer big f-stop lenses... e.g. 24 or 35 f/1.4G. The trick is to program your Nikon D-SLR to your preferred AF "stickiness" by adjusting the a3 "Focus Tracking with Lock-on" custom function. I also agree that canon cameras only track moving subjects well, and will be confused if you use Ai Servo for stationary subjects (often front-focusing).
    Last edited by surrephoto; 13th September 2014 at 07:56 PM.

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