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Thread: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

  1. #21

    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by nitewalk View Post
    Giving people the benefit of doubt, I thought i'd come in to specifically tell the subsequent interested parties to copy and paste the sign up list and adding their own name. I was shocked to see another person doing the same.

    I'm not sure if its exactly taking things for granted, but i do believe even in the absence of clear specific instruction, most people will take the trouble to put their names there just because they would not want to miss out on it or it is simply just something we should be doing ourselves than to trouble someone else to do something we can perfectly do ourselves.
    Fair enough.
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  2. #22
    Moderator ed9119's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Kit, TOTALLY feel for you man. Next time just turn them away on actual day and stick to those that do it in orderly manner

    u dont even know the half of it .....

    I have had a few please-add-my-name jackaxxses types before too .... and we do them the favor and cut and paste for them...... actual day rolls around ..... and they fly aeroplane... sigh

    Most people are very nice and actually show up (attendance rates normally high), and there are a few top-shelf kind souls help to sort out the mee siam registration

    Thats why if you notice in some of the larger gatherings, CS now uses a registration system that sorts out registrations

    Remember that time at SAM ? Free event and damn good speaker plus lots of hardwork by volunteers putting together the AV and arranging chairs and logistics ...... one guy came up and asked...... "How come no food or refreshments ?"

    So next time Canon free talk rolls around and Canon so kindly catered for simple fried noodles and finger food with syrup water ..... kenna again from a different fella .... "Why is the catering so simple one?"

    and the classic one " Aiyah.... still the same door-gift...." (an 8g flash drive)

    Thanks for startig this thread.... and allowing me to vent.... got a load off my chest

    Just THANK GOD that these nit-pickers are a very tiny group and that the no-questions-asked kind volunteers that help out and new friends make it all worth while
    Last edited by ed9119; 21st August 2014 at 09:50 PM.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member richiemccaw1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    There seems to be a stronger than expected sense of entitlement from some of the CSers around here. I am very appreciative of the efforts put in by the other CSers, whether experienced or inexperienced, to make this a better place. Hope things start to turn around before long.

  4. #24
    Moderator nitewalk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by richiemccaw1 View Post
    There seems to be a stronger than expected sense of entitlement from some of the CSers around here. I am very appreciative of the efforts put in by the other CSers, whether experienced or inexperienced, to make this a better place. Hope things start to turn around before long.
    Well, I refrained from using that term, but yeah in my PM correspondence with Kit, I was expressing my disbelief at how self-entitled it appeared to me.
    Last edited by nitewalk; 21st August 2014 at 10:39 PM.

  5. #25
    Senior Member richiemccaw1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    It is true. There's no defending such behaviour to be honest. There are many ways to sugarcoat and reason it in a more positive manner but it is what it is.

    Anyway it's good that someone's doing something about it. I've seen many outings where it's stated extremely clearly to copy/paste the list with one's nick as a new post and yet some dude just waltzes in and say 'Can I join? Sign me up!!!' LOL seriously?! I accept some people just plainly missed the instructions about copying/pasting but to see so many people do it just stinks as a whole.

  6. #26
    Senior Member sunnycamera's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    I am not sure how it happens,

    maybe the student feel that they need to get TO's permission be able to confirm their attendance,

    it is like the new recruits don't dare to sit down in front of the big boss, unless boss say sit down twice.

    another possible case would be they dont check forum often, dont know how the forums usually works.

    of course, people already joined this kind of outing before may kindly copy and paste the list.


    -------------------------

    but you may notice the 2nd and following did exactly 1st person did, and post showing interest,

    if the 1st person did the listing copy paste way, I think the following will do the same,

    as the followings may think the 1st person's post is a standard way to say interest,

    new members observe and do what others do, if the case is really like that.
    K-01: S8FE, DA35 Flickr

  7. #27
    Moderator keithwee's Avatar
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    Feeling weird reading the whole conversation ...

    Firstly kudos to Kit for willing to do the sharing for free , we need more good people like him. If I didn't already have an event on this day I would have wanted to join too.

    Secondly . My gut feel is these newbies (since most of them are) were kinda afraid of putting their names down as prob they felt they needed permission from kit to do so and thus expressed their interest in separate comments instead.

    If course , this may be my biased view after so many years in teaching after when I realised how scared of making mistakes people can be nowadays. I'm not talking only about students but also adult teachers reporting to me too.

    But yeah, one thing I totally agree is people need to spend more time and effort to read instructions. Somehow we are all getting so arrogant in that feel we are all so busy that reading instructions proper isn't done nowadays.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Howdy folks!

    Thanks Ed for notifying me about this thread. I was deciding if I should respond or to let it go away. I thought it wasn't necessary for me to explain my position. Before I go on, I would like you folks to have a look at the thread I started for #01 back in April 2010. Then compare it to the thread I started for #13.

    architectural + cityscapes photography #01
    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showt...+cityscapes+01

    While the write-up given may not be foolproof(I wish I knew how to and had), I've tried to add bits of information along the way. I took the time to do my research and collate information which I think would be useful to participants based on feedback I received. To me, "registering" for a spot in ACPs was never an issue. It wasn't something I had to address or worry myself over. Perhaps I have taken folks for granted. Interested + vacancy + leave your name = see you there. Perhaps my expectation was unrealistic. I believe in taking interest in whatever I do. If there's no interest, I'd rather not do it if I can help it. Photography is a hobby to most people and without a doubt, most will claim to have interest in it. What constitutes interest? To me, it's more than proclaiming "I like photography". Interest is also about taking responsibility, initiative and ownership towards the things you participate in.

    Contrary to what was said earlier, I did not cancel #13 out of anger. I made an announcement asking people to fill in the vacancies themselves after the second person expressed his/her interest to participate. I made the same announcement again after the third person expressed his/her interest. So did nitewalk and I thanked him for that. At this point, I would like to ask if I was not clear with this request, however simple it was? I began to have doubts about the people who wanted to participate in #13. If I couldn't get such a simple request through to them, can I expect them to wake up at 5am in the morning for the session?

    Putting their names down in the list ensures that they get a place. It's on a first come first serve basis. If you dig through the older ACP threads, you will realise that not putting your names down will cause confusion which takes time to sort out. I hold a day job and I have a family to go home to, I cannot be spending time performing "administrative" tasks for work I do voluntarily. Call me self-entitled if you will but I think I'm entitled to be free from that.

    I don't owe anyone anything. That's my stand.

  9. #29

    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by nitewalk View Post
    Giving people the benefit of doubt, I thought i'd come in to specifically tell the subsequent interested parties to copy and paste the sign up list and adding their own name. I was shocked to see another person doing the same.

    I'm not sure if its exactly taking things for granted, but i do believe even in the absence of clear specific instruction, most people will take the trouble to put their names there just because they would not want to miss out on it or it is simply just something we should be doing ourselves than to trouble someone else to do something we can perfectly do ourselves.

    probably they just read the first few posts and replied "I would like to join,pls add me in." rather than reading the whole thread that had caused the "miss" reading?
    but then there are many people who don't read instructions but monkey see monkey do attitude.
    Last edited by Turbonetics; 22nd August 2014 at 10:05 AM.

  10. #30

    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Attention spans are decreasing these days. People might just read the first post, scan through the remaining, then reply. I'm not supporting this type of action, but it is what is going on now. It might be a better idea to update the first post (which is the one that people are most likely to actually read thoroughly), than to simply post a reply in the thread asking people to update the list.

  11. #31
    Senior Member G-man's Avatar
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    Ah yes this fear of failure. I think it's an Asian thing to fear failure. Afraid of making mistakes for fear of being ridiculed. Seems more prevalent here in SE Asia though

  12. #32

    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Maybe next time no need crowd control. Or registration for informal event in open space. Just put time, see you there. If nobody after 15mins, then shoot at own leisure, go drink coffee eat breakfast .
    宁愿遇见丢失幼崽的母熊,也不愿碰上做蠢事的愚人

  13. #33
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    If their names are not on the list, then they won't get to participate even if they turn up...kind of no brainer....no names, no lesson.
    Sure, you have your right to cancel any lessons you so kindly initiated but it seemed a little childish for me, to cancel a good cause because some cannot/would not/did not follow a cut and paste instruction.

    Im sure many will do the right thing. U just need patience.
    Last edited by christeo; 22nd August 2014 at 11:30 AM.

  14. #34
    Member voice123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    any system camera can join those outing right?

  15. #35
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by voice123 View Post
    any system camera can join those outing right?
    Be careful, you are treading on thin ice here.

    Kit mentioned:

    1) Camera. This can be a compact, rangefinder, SLR, DSLR, medium format, large format, etc. Preferably with Bulb mode for longer exposures.

  16. #36
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by edutilos- View Post
    Be careful, you are treading on thin ice here.

    Kit mentioned:

    1) Camera. This can be a compact, rangefinder, SLR, DSLR, medium format, large format, etc. Preferably with Bulb mode for longer exposures.
    Didn't someone suggested that updates should be posted in the first post of the thread so people are less likely to miss it? What a brilliant idea! That was actually found in the first post. I thank him for turning himself into a textbook example to prove a point. If people decided not to read, they won't read. Where information is found is irrelevant.

  17. #37
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    Didn't someone suggested that updates should be posted in the first post of the thread so people are less likely to miss it? What a brilliant idea! That was actually found in the first post. I thank him for turning himself into a textbook example to prove a point. If people decided not to read, they won't read. Where information is found is irrelevant.
    Hrm, don't think it was voice123, thought it was kiwi2..

  18. #38
    Senior Member richiemccaw1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Lesson of the day: make the effort to read properly and think first before posting anything.

  19. #39
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richiemccaw1 View Post
    Lesson of the day: make the effort to read properly and think first before posting anything.
    I not only just read, I also do background check before posting anything.
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  20. #40
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are Singaporeans really that lazy? (Cancelled photoshoot)

    Quote Originally Posted by brapodam View Post
    Attention spans are decreasing these days. People might just read the first post, scan through the remaining, then reply. I'm not supporting this type of action, but it is what is going on now. It might be a better idea to update the first post (which is the one that people are most likely to actually read thoroughly), than to simply post a reply in the thread asking people to update the list.
    Quote Originally Posted by edutilos- View Post
    Hrm, don't think it was voice123, thought it was kiwi2..
    I was referring to this.

    See! I read!

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