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  1. #21
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by Octarine View Post
    ... If this contractor is not delivering (yes, pun intended) then just get them by the balls.
    What happens if they are delivery ladies?

  2. #22
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion View Post
    What happens if they are delivery ladies?
    Depending on his preferences he would be either deeply disappointed or switch the punishment approach.
    And ladies does not necessarily mean no balls
    EOS

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by edutilos- View Post
    On - why IKEA can't order online and deliver: Maybe you can keep in mind IKEA's tagline of "providing a range of home furnishing products that are affordable to the many people, not just the few". While overseas there are delivery options you'll find out from the text in the link below that it's horribly expensive (IKEA Singapore's delivery isn't by any means cheap either). There's also the philosophy of course, which is also applicable to a large extent (I think) to Singapore's context. As to whether cutting out all these frills keep their cost cheap, it's up to you to accept...

    http://www.ikeafans.com/home/ikea-ho...ill-never-pay/

    To be blunt, if you really want an online shopping experience, IKEA is not the place to go. I can name a number of stores that also do not have any online shopping options.. If your idea is to sit at home and click away, then you can look at sites like Forty Two. There's loads of reasons NOT to do so, e.g. seeing the piece in person is quite different from just looking at pictures. My question to you is: if you detest the concept so much, why be rigid and insist that a company must change itself to suit every customer's needs - when you can easily take your business elsewhere? Do keep in mind that there are a lot of photography shops like Cathay, TK Foto, MS Colour, Orient Photo who also don't have online shops. They definitely have their reasons for doing so.. Loads of people lug stuff from IKEA home - it's not easy but they still do it without complaint (I didn't even take their delivery service btw, which was a PITA). Why should they change to suit your whims, if that is the case?

    As for the poor service given by the delivery person, if I'm not wrong these are outsourced and not handled by IKEA staff, you can definitely give your feedback here: http://www.ikea.com/ms/en_SG/custome...s/contact.html

    If the goods are damaged you can also mention it, though I'm also wondering why you accepted the item (if you did anyways) if it has been damaged during delivery process. It's a bit hard to argue later on whether the deliveryman did it or you did it yourself after he left.
    I still don't get the explanation.

    How will an online shopping increase cost of business?

    Besides setting up an e comnerce site with payment options, there is little extra cost incurred. In fact, in long term, it will reduce cost and increase buying traffic to ikea.

    In an online system, ikea can offer online purchase for purchase items as a package. They can offer more points for ikea members.

    The physical store only has so much space for max number of walk in. Any more walk in customers, its not benefiting ikea.

    So having an additional online shopping, ikea can have more revenue generated than just walk in customers purchases.

    The delivery contractor are out sourced. No additional cost to ikea. in fact, it's more profit to the contractor due to online shopping purchases.

  4. #24
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by donut88 View Post
    I still don't get the explanation.

    How will an online shopping increase cost of business?

    Besides setting up an e comnerce site with payment options, there is little extra cost incurred. In fact, in long term, it will reduce cost and increase buying traffic to ikea.

    In an online system, ikea can offer online purchase for purchase items as a package. They can offer more points for ikea members.

    The physical store only has so much space for max number of walk in. Any more walk in customers, its not benefiting ikea.

    So having an additional online shopping, ikea can have more revenue generated than just walk in customers purchases.

    The delivery contractor are out sourced. No additional cost to ikea. in fact, it's more profit to the contractor due to online shopping purchases.
    For first sight perhaps, but don't forget that consumer expectations are not the same today and from an outsider's perspective I would think that customer service would be the largest source of costs. I can't remember if I mentioned this earlier but viewing things at a physical shop is very different from looking at it online. I would probably agree with you that it is a clear choice for a certain sort of item - small, light things for which postage is simple and there are no worries of delivery damage issues (e.g. makeup or even handphones). For furniture it's not exactly the same cup of tea. You can look at Forty Two since that's an example that has been mentioned - they offer a 7 day money back guarantee if the customer is unsatisfied with what they received. Of course it's optional for a company to practice such but who would venture to purchase with as much confidence if there was no such policy? There's all kinds of new problems that open up (especially for a furniture shop) - you will have people claiming that the item was not as described/photographed, it is not what they want, etc. And this is after they may have assembled it.

    What's IKEA's return policy now? 90 days and only if the package is unassembled. Having a physical store ensures that customers cannot say that they didn't know what the item would be like assembled. I can see why an online shop really doesn't fit in with their philosophy of selling unassembled furniture and producing packages that are easy to self-assemble. They would probably have to rope in a lot more manpower to entertain an increased volume of customer complaints, either absorb the costs of returns via delivery contractor OR incur the wrath of unhappy customers who will proceed to declare that they will never buy from IKEA again, and if they give in to customers' demands of being unhappy with the half-assembled item, either choose to discard the half-baked outcome or disassemble, repack, etc. This will also require more storage space, depending on how quickly they can turn over the returned items. Does that sound simple? Not to me. The result will have to be an increase in their prices (which makes them less attractive to consumers in general) to maintain the same level of profits.

    I'm also not sure if people these days in Singapore will be happy to click on furniture icons to buy things. There seems to be a greater focus on aesthetics and feel within one's home than the previous generations these days, so I feel that there's also a tendency to want to look at the physical piece of furniture (or be able to return it if they aren't happy, FortyTwo style at least), just from a local context.

    Anyways, that's just my view.

    On another note, it's interesting to note that IKEA started off as a mail order catalogue company (see history here).
    Last edited by edutilos-; 9th July 2014 at 11:42 AM.

  5. #25

    Default Re: strange business model



    Found this article on the topic...

  6. #26
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by donut88 View Post
    Besides setting up an e comnerce site with payment options, there is little extra cost incurred. In fact, in long term, it will reduce cost and increase buying traffic to ikea.
    Please have a look at the costs of setting up and maintaining a shopping portal that serves millions of page visits. You don't get this for a few hundred bucks a months. Besides this, ordering online is something legally different from walking into a shop, paying at the cashier and having some third party delivery guy pushing the stuff up the lift to your place. Don't overly simplify, pay attention to the details.
    Quote Originally Posted by donut88 View Post
    In an online system, ikea can offer online purchase for purchase items as a package. They can offer more points for ikea members.
    The physical store only has so much space for max number of walk in. Any more walk in customers, its not benefiting ikea.
    So having an additional online shopping, ikea can have more revenue generated than just walk in customers purchases.
    The delivery contractor are out sourced. No additional cost to ikea. in fact, it's more profit to the contractor due to online shopping purchases.
    Just because something is technically possible that does not mean that it makes business sense. IKEA has occupied a niche in the market with their portfolio, their philosophy, mall style and other elements like self assembly: young families who want to have a home (the first one) and not paying a fortune. It must be simple and flexible in many ways. Exactly this is what IKEA is doing: keeping furniture shopping simple. The global success proves them right.
    If you have different preferences then this is your prerogative. Just don't expect or demand that every shop out there must follow your ideas. Or would you seriously ask a stall owner in a food court about an ordering portal and home delivery?
    EOS

  7. #27
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by donut88 View Post
    How will an online shopping increase cost of business?

    Besides setting up an e comnerce site with payment options, there is little extra cost incurred. In fact, in long term, it will reduce cost and increase buying traffic to ikea.

    In an online system, ikea can offer online purchase for purchase items as a package. They can offer more points for ikea members.

    The physical store only has so much space for max number of walk in. Any more walk in customers, its not benefiting ikea.

    So having an additional online shopping, ikea can have more revenue generated than just walk in customers purchases.

    The delivery contractor are out sourced. No additional cost to ikea. in fact, it's more profit to the contractor due to online shopping purchases.
    Coming from a background of e-commerce I can tell you this: Online sales is not as simple as it seems. it is also not as low cost as it seems. Besides the inherent costs of technology/servers, manpower to develop and maintain online sales sites, there are also a lot of support required in the backend, customer support, issue resolution, and the biggest piece is fulfillment. Never underestimate fulfillment, as online shoppers will expect delivery. Just having the workflow to put orders together and deliver them is nothing less of a daunting task. And due to differences in regional laws, online stores will have to be regional as well, and the same goes for logistics and fulfillment. Especially so when the items sold can range from small items to huge custom order items.

    Even sites like fourty two operate very different from IKEA, where most products are sourced or dropped shipped, and not manufactured in house.
    Last edited by daredevil123; 9th July 2014 at 12:52 PM.

  8. #28
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    IKEA stuffs, small one ok to buy. Else go other furniture mall. I hardly sees people did what TS said. Or should TS makes a few trips instead of one if he knew only 2 person doing it.
    Only Sony device mostly, haha!

  9. #29
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    When I buy furniture, I must look, touch, measure, and fiddle with the real thing first.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by donut88 View Post
    I still don't get the explanation.

    How will an online shopping increase cost of business?

    Besides setting up an e comnerce site with payment options, there is little extra cost incurred. In fact, in long term, it will reduce cost and increase buying traffic to ikea.

    In an online system, ikea can offer online purchase for purchase items as a package. They can offer more points for ikea members.

    The physical store only has so much space for max number of walk in. Any more walk in customers, its not benefiting ikea.

    So having an additional online shopping, ikea can have more revenue generated than just walk in customers purchases.

    The delivery contractor are out sourced. No additional cost to ikea. in fact, it's more profit to the contractor due to online shopping purchases.
    you are right.
    that is exactly what i think so too, bro.

    I would certainly not hesitate to purchase even more! Could be triple of those i made. LOL

  11. #31
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by edutilos- View Post
    For first sight perhaps, but don't forget that consumer expectations are not the same today and from an outsider's perspective I would think that customer service would be the largest source of costs. I can't remember if I mentioned this earlier but viewing things at a physical shop is very different from looking at it online. I would probably agree with you that it is a clear choice for a certain sort of item - small, light things for which postage is simple and there are no worries of delivery damage issues (e.g. makeup or even handphones). For furniture it's not exactly the same cup of tea. You can look at Forty Two since that's an example that has been mentioned - they offer a 7 day money back guarantee if the customer is unsatisfied with what they received. Of course it's optional for a company to practice such but who would venture to purchase with as much confidence if there was no such policy? There's all kinds of new problems that open up (especially for a furniture shop) - you will have people claiming that the item was not as described/photographed, it is not what they want, etc. And this is after they may have assembled it.

    What's IKEA's return policy now? 90 days and only if the package is unassembled. Having a physical store ensures that customers cannot say that they didn't know what the item would be like assembled. I can see why an online shop really doesn't fit in with their philosophy of selling unassembled furniture and producing packages that are easy to self-assemble. They would probably have to rope in a lot more manpower to entertain an increased volume of customer complaints, either absorb the costs of returns via delivery contractor OR incur the wrath of unhappy customers who will proceed to declare that they will never buy from IKEA again, and if they give in to customers' demands of being unhappy with the half-assembled item, either choose to discard the half-baked outcome or disassemble, repack, etc. This will also require more storage space, depending on how quickly they can turn over the returned items. Does that sound simple? Not to me. The result will have to be an increase in their prices (which makes them less attractive to consumers in general) to maintain the same level of profits.

    I'm also not sure if people these days in Singapore will be happy to click on furniture icons to buy things. There seems to be a greater focus on aesthetics and feel within one's home than the previous generations these days, so I feel that there's also a tendency to want to look at the physical piece of furniture (or be able to return it if they aren't happy, FortyTwo style at least), just from a local context.

    Anyways, that's just my view.

    On another note, it's interesting to note that IKEA started off as a mail order catalogue company (see history here).

    i am certainly a very unhappy customer now!

    You still dont get the point.
    You still can visit their store, view the setup there for those items you have in mind. If you like it, you would hv the flexibility of ordering it online for big quantity and bulky things and get it delivered to you WITHOUT you going to the store and laboriously moving things yourself.

  12. #32
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by BBTM View Post
    IKEA stuffs, small one ok to buy. Else go other furniture mall. I hardly sees people did what TS said. Or should TS makes a few trips instead of one if he knew only 2 person doing it.
    Previously, i had a house furnishing designed by IKEA and it was such an enjoyable experience. We just go to the store design section, told them our concept, they did the design, we reviewed, and then they did everything, and even provide a renovation contractor who did the assembly/installation, plumbing and electrical.
    This service FOC if the furniture purchase amount >5000, which is easily reached. Just that day i hv already spent about 1300 on those items that i lugged at the store.

    I should seriously consider this option for my the other house. But wonder if they still hv this service.

  13. #33
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    When I buy furniture, I must look, touch, measure, and fiddle with the real thing first.
    That's exactly what they also do in Orchard Towers.


  14. #34
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    Previously, i had a house furnishing designed by IKEA and it was such an enjoyable experience. We just go to the store design section, told them our concept, they did the design, we reviewed, and then they did everything, and even provide a renovation contractor who did the assembly/installation, plumbing and electrical.
    This service FOC if the furniture purchase amount >5000, which is easily reached. Just that day i hv already spent about 1300 on those items that i lugged at the store.

    I should seriously consider this option for my the other house. But wonder if they still hv this service.
    Post your requirements here in Kopitiam and let us design it for you.

  15. #35

    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    Recently went to IKEA tampines to purchase quite a big number of items to refurnish my house.

    As the list was long and most of the items are of substantial size, i first made a call to enquire whether we could order online and then hv them deliver to us.

    The answer : no order online and we hv to go personally to the store to do the purchase and then bring to their delivery contractor counter after checkout to arrange for delivery.

    We [wife and myself] ended up pushing 4 trolleys full of things. One of them has got 2 single size mattresses on it and another 2 of them to ferry 10 SKARPON chair. The last trolley was also packed full of heavy flat and long packages.

    Totally exhausted by the time we checkout and reached the delivery counter, after enduring the super long queue at the checkout counter.

    Long queue at the delivery arrangement counter. Finally all done and all body muscle aching upon reaching home.

    why create so much hassle for their customer??? why can't they allow us to order online and deliver to us??? i am sure that would hv increased their sale tremendously. It is really a turn-off after this experience to purchase large quantity of items from them in future!
    You are suppose to try out their bed before you left

    You cannot do this at the online store

    I eats, shoots & leaves

  16. #36
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    i am certainly a very unhappy customer now!

    You still dont get the point.
    You still can visit their store, view the setup there for those items you have in mind. If you like it, you would hv the flexibility of ordering it online for big quantity and bulky things and get it delivered to you WITHOUT you going to the store and laboriously moving things yourself.
    And how is IKEA going to handle the refund policy? By giving visiting customers a code to identify themselves as having visited the store and viewed a certain item? Obviously didn't bother reading my post.

    And of course there are many other points that I could make here, but since you don't bother reading, I won't bother typing.
    Last edited by edutilos-; 9th July 2014 at 10:26 PM.

  17. #37
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    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by Yutaka Go View Post
    You are suppose to try out their bed before you left

    You cannot do this at the online store

    LOL. Ya, that is one thing i like about IKEA.

    But i also want the flexibility of ordering online leh.

  18. #38
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    Default Re: strange business model

    those two really sleeping there? LOL

  19. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    those two really sleeping there? LOL
    Now you know why display set are cheap

    ikea-welcomes-spontaneous-nappers-in-china
    Last edited by Yutaka Go; 10th July 2014 at 08:13 PM.
    I eats, shoots & leaves

  20. #40

    Default Re: strange business model

    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    But i also want the flexibility of ordering online leh.
    Until the local franchisee adopts that, I think the next best thing you can do is to make a shopping list and use a concierge service

    E.g. http://www.wheregottime.com/

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