Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: Immunity

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    sing
    Posts
    3,353

    Default Immunity

    The Devyani case is all over the news. Over a thing like not paying her maid enough and stating her maid's pay wrongly in USA visa application. She is arrested, handcuffed, stripped and "cavity searched".

    Arising from that, news media have explained the different classes of immunity.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-25411876

    The US state department said that Ms Khobragade does not have full diplomatic immunity. It said under the UN's Vienna Convention on Consular Relations, she is immune from arrest only for crimes committed in connection with her work.
    According to the TV news, the ambassador personally has full diplomatic immunity. But not the consular staff.

    According to the above, a chargé d'affaires , such as for example Ionescu, who is NOT the ambassador; does not have full diplomatic immunity. Especially if he killed some person with his car. Perhaps carousing in KTV nightclub with Korean married woman and sending her back cannot be consular work. He flew back to Romania.
    Last edited by ricohflex; 19th December 2013 at 10:23 PM.

  2. #2
    Moderator diver-hloc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Somewhere North
    Posts
    5,201

    Default Re: Immunity

    A chargé d'affaires may not have full immunity... but he wasn't offically arrested also. He wasn't arrested because he reported his car stolen and it wasn't him driving the car. But the time Police has enough proof that it was him... Ionescu has already ran back to Romania... And once back home, if Romania 'refuse' to hand him over... there is little we can do.

    Scuba & Father... For Life

  3. #3
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    4,429

    Default Re: Immunity

    Still, "stripped and "cavity searched"" over a possible visa infringement is a bit too much lah. Even if it is an ordinary person, citizen or not, this is not acceptable.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Immunity

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    Still, "stripped and "cavity searched"" over a possible visa infringement is a bit too much lah. Even if it is an ordinary person, citizen or not, this is not acceptable.
    American Civil Liberties lawyers would agree with you (they would have a field day with OUR justice system). I do think that it's pretty extreme too. But if that really was SOP, not 'special treatment' meted out to her, then more power to them.

    There's too much bullshit about diplomats and 'important' people being treated differently. And India is just being India, making a big song-and-dance about everything. Apparently it is now a matter of their 'sovereignty'... hmmm...

    The statement about being put together with 'common criminals' -- AFAIK, no caste system in US. Prejudice, knee-jerk reaction, or just an attempt to gain sympathy and avoid charges?

    Not to mention the claim that she was actually given preferential treatment (http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-...1-1164178.aspx) Perhaps she doesn't realise what a real cavity search is?

    Oh, and would they be making so much noise if it was the servant? Or someone of less consequence, like you or me?

    There's more to come, as India is now claiming some form of conspiracy ... this is going to be interesting.

    A Bollywood movie eventually, no doubt.

  5. #5
    Deregistered
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    1,283

    Default Re: Immunity

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleFai View Post
    Still, "stripped and "cavity searched"" over a possible visa infringement is a bit too much lah. Even if it is an ordinary person, citizen or not, this is not acceptable.
    Most probably due to the color or color blindness? LOL.
    Btw, what is cavity search? Sounds obscene. LOL

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    sing
    Posts
    3,353

    Default Re: Immunity

    Are there no other American employers who underpay their workers in the whole of the USA? Are all such employers subjected to same hand cuff, strip and cavity search ?

    Separate the human resource law on pay matters with unrelated procedures like cavity search.

    In their televised media briefing, the US State Department (which ordered the arrest) has done very poorly.
    In essence, the US State Department spokeswoman pushed the responsibility for stripping and cavity search to the US marshal service.

    This is horrible. An appalling public relations failure.

    When they brief the world press, they represent USA. Not just one small segment of the US government.
    They must speak with one voice on behalf of the whole US government.
    Last edited by ricohflex; 21st December 2013 at 02:27 PM.

  7. #7
    Deregistered
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    1,283

    Default Re: Immunity

    cavity search, my goodness. What could she hv been hiding in her cavities?
    This is too much!
    Wonder how many cavities have they searched. LOL. Or more importantly, which cavity.

  8. #8

    Default

    India again. Why don't they examine themselves before turning the spotlight upon others.

    And it's childish by any standard to actually pull off all that retaliation

  9. #9

    Default

    There are many things that can be hidden in those cavity. Drugs and small blades is what they are looking for, many have been found in there.
    Canon 30D, G11, 50 f1.8II, 10-22 f3.5-4.5, 24-70 f2.8L, 70-200 f2.8L IS, EX580II

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    sing
    Posts
    3,353

    Default Re: Immunity

    If US marshals want to arrest all American employers who under pay their maids, there may be many.
    If US marshals want to arrest all the various nations' consular staff employers who under pay their maids, there may be many.

    So far this is India's pathetic response:
    • Stop special car parking privileges to US diplomat in Indian airports
    • Stop special privileges to US diplomats to buy liquor (perhaps at especially low prices) in India
    • Remove concrete road barriers near US embassy in India
    Last edited by ricohflex; 22nd December 2013 at 12:16 AM.

  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by d2xpeter View Post
    cavity search, my goodness. What could she hv been hiding in her cavities? This is too much! Wonder how many cavities have they searched. LOL. Or more importantly, which cavity.
    She's got bad teeth la.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Immunity

    Quote Originally Posted by airfins View Post
    There are many things that can be hidden in those cavity. Drugs and small blades is what they are looking for, many have been found in there.
    Mahjong set, chicken drumstick, etc...
    -------------------------------
    Endure. In enduring grow strong.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Immunity

    Since so many people are harping on it, there may not have been an actual cavity search:
    http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-...1-1164178.aspx

    I don't suppose Ms Devyani has too much experience with them. I expect the US Marshals do.

    The US Marshals may be lying. On the other hand, Ms Devyani may be blowing up the issue in the hope that they will drop the charges rather than face the backlash.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Immunity

    she should have been accorded the same treatment of someone apprehended on charges of commercial fraud
    宁愿遇见丢失幼崽的母熊,也不愿碰上做蠢事的愚人

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    sing
    Posts
    3,353

    Default Re: Immunity

    Either Devyani or US Marshals Service is lying.

    If the US Marshals Service did not do it, then why did they not immediately say so? Why did they wait many days to clarify and let the US State Department & Secretary of State John Kerry face the media in the mean time?

    Anyway, got this jewel of a comment by a US government official:
    http://www.financialexpress.com/news...earch-/1209526

    Devyani has claimed she was subjected to a strip search as well as a cavity search. Credic said, “There is a difference between the two. She may not know the difference. But whatever happened was all as per rules.”
    He meant Devyani would not know the difference if someone stuck a finger into her cavities; or manually opened her cavities in order to "visually inspect" the cavities?
    Last edited by ricohflex; 22nd December 2013 at 06:40 PM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Immunity

    Quote Originally Posted by Shizuma View Post
    she should have been accorded the same treatment of someone apprehended on charges of commercial fraud
    Which are? Not being antagonistic -- I don't know what their SOP is. They claim it was business-as-usual.


    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex View Post
    Either Devyani or US Marshals Service is lying.
    Anyway, got this jewel of a comment by a US government official:
    http://www.financialexpress.com/news...earch-/1209526
    He meant Devyani would not know the difference if someone stuck a finger into her cavities; or manually opened her cavities in order to "visually inspect" the cavities?
    Similar to what I said earlier -- she may not know the difference. NOT that she wouldn't know if someone stuck a finger where the sun don't shine, but that she might think that external visual inspection constitutes a cavity search.
    Or she may be exaggerating to gain sympathy.

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    sing
    Posts
    3,353

    Default Re: Immunity

    Mitt Romney's Maids' Salary Raises Questions

    According to the tax returns, it seems he paid low wages for his housekeepers. His net worth is several hundred million. This guy ran for US presidency in 2012.

    So if the US marshals want to uphold the law and arrest those who pay their employees below minimum wage, how come they did not look closer to home?
    Last edited by ricohflex; 25th December 2013 at 09:39 AM.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Immunity

    I doubt the chiefs of Enron ever had a cavity search
    宁愿遇见丢失幼崽的母熊,也不愿碰上做蠢事的愚人

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •