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Thread: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

  1. #21
    Senior Member SilverPine's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    The market think the smart phone can do most the job including taking good pictures, like it or not it reflect on the current market trend. The below article from Bloomberg dated 19 September 2013 will explain in details.

    Smartphone Cameras at 41 Megapixels Pressure Canon, Nikon
    Canon 5D II, 20-35 f/2.8L, 28-80 f/2.8L, 70-200 f/4L IS, 100-300 f/5.6L, 100 f/2.8 Macro

  2. #22
    Moderator keithwee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kei1309 View Post
    This is a real story. i was at a cafe last night reviewing my F1 shots on my A99, and happened to be sharing a table with a friend of mine, who brought along her teenage friend. as i was looking through them, suddenly the teen asked to see my F1 and concert shots. so i passed her my camera. after looking through them, she proclaimed that they were nice, and that she could take the same photo with her compact camera. and that's the part that annoyed me. i had spent so much time and money acquiring skills and gear to help me get that shot, and here was a young upstart who thought that her compact could do the job. keeping a zen-like state, i asked her if she was sure. she said "yes, and my mobile phone can do the same, too". ok... this level of ignorance was really getting to me. so i proceeded to explain about the gear i use, the focal lengths, shutter speed, functionality of the camera and use of lighting and positioning, and why her compact camera could not capture the same shots (large aperture to blur the fence, fast shutter speeds etc) as i explained it all, she started to realize how stupid she must have sounded to make such a bold statement without understanding anything. so i passed her the camera again, and asked her to look carefully at the shots, which she spent more time analyzing each shot. The reality is this: Pros and Serious Hobbyists spend loads of time and money on getting access to skill sets and equipment to take better/amazing photos. but there are a group of people who think that photography is easy and that they can do the same, thereby cheapening the art and thinking that there's no need for certain equipment to be able to capture the decisive moment. and the problem becomes exacerbated with Facebook, Instagram and the like, where people think they're fantastic photographers based on the likes they receive, rather than producing photos that can be truly counted as works of art. so what i'm asking for is a serious discussion on your thoughts and views on this issue (and that's why i didn't put this in Kopitiam)
    Honestly u can't blame the teen. It's called ignorance and I'm glad the teen agreed with u.

    Media and companies have been selling the idea to them that camera phones can do whatever that professional rig can do ; skill or without skill. Remember how Apole sold their IPhone 5S camera (the camera does most of the work for u, so u can focus on enjoying taking that photo) F2 leh , wow !

    I've encountered 2 extremes. I'm a primarily MFT user and have been;

    (1) ridiculed by FF or DSLR users that mine is a toy cause it was simply smaller (pple who believe owning a FF camera will make them instant professionals)

    (2) ridiculed by users who feel why spend so much when they nice fancy $300 P n S can hit 20x zoom and I'm using a fixed prime lens.

    I can't blame them , u don't blame one for being stupid or ignorant ; u pity them. to me photography is an art in itself and it entails time , effort and investment in the tools .

    And my response is always : then show to me that you can do whatever I have done.

    That's the best response I've learnt from experience. (:
    Last edited by keithwee; 29th September 2013 at 11:52 PM.

  3. #23
    Member snowver's Avatar
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    I think the reason why some ppl make such claims is because the accessiblity of camera gear. Photography used to be an very exclusive thing done mostly by professionals, but now almost everybody can acess and enjoy photography leisurely. The fact that more and more ppl can take nice pictures using the new technologies available in most phones and pns gives ppl the false impression that photography is easy. However, once u go into the technical aspect of photography most ppl actually have no idea at all.(who check the focal length of ur camera phone?)

    There is also another problem with ppl's obsession over gears. Like buying lens or accessories for different purpose. This give ppl another false impression that getting a certain gear ensure u can make a certain picture, ignoring all the technical aspects of photo making. That is also the reason why ppl ask for advice on cosplay lens or protrait lens etc.

    My 2 cents : )

  4. #24

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    At least that friend willing to listen & learn.
    Have some friend who dun believe what I told them when try advice them. I know I not that gd yet, but just some basic advice like rules of 3rd, dun use digital zoom (instead use legs to move), not advisable to take photos during noon with strong mid sun etc.
    In end still believe that all photos with subjects in center (may b ok in some situation), digital zoom using camera phone etc are good photos. And they can take gd & better photos that u with their camera phone anytime.
    From phone, the images everything look clear, zoom in the main subject is blur.
    After awhile will just ignore them. If they think they are gd, they are.

    Then they are some who see photos that they like, the comment is often "good camera".
    Last edited by huatman; 30th September 2013 at 06:50 AM.

  5. #25
    Moderator nightwolf75's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    ain't the first time... i once had someone from the wedding entourage (was helping my friend shoot their wedding) that her hp camera has more megapixels than mine. so why should i block her view. oh well... c'est la vie
    If Life worked on auto mode then manual mode for photography would have never existed. ― Deeksha Mittal

  6. #26
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by kei1309 View Post
    but there are a group of people who think that photography is easy and that they can do the same, thereby cheapening the art and thinking that there's no need for certain equipment to be able to capture the decisive moment.
    Art is not cheapened by people who do not practise it, but rather, the people who use the name of Art to do silly things. Some examples include perv photographers that try to coax models into being bedded, photographers who use strings to manipulate nature to create animal pictures that are not natural.

    I won't be too worried or concerned about the person you describe. I might just say one sentence or two, and if they don't accept it, move on. Life is too short to worry about pleasing everyone or convincing them that what you are doing is not easy, really. And why do we shoot? Solely to get accolades or adoration from others? I don't think so (or least I hope not).
    Last edited by edutilos-; 30th September 2013 at 10:34 AM.

  7. #27
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Hmm... not sure why the work up, bro and sis.

    Well... to use cheap equipment to achieve what an equipment many times the price was not unheard of, of course there are limitation (eg. You cannot shoot a bird that is so small and you are so far away (and normally need a 600mm lens) with a camera + lens of maximum focal length of 70mm, unless that bird is just part of the composition - framing if you will, for the overall shot and not as the main subject where you wanted to see feather, bright eyes, etc). As for speed of a vehicle, night concert and stuff like that, yeah, you need the equipment and not all equipment could achieve the same effect as a fullframe camera. But that was not to say, a newbie with no knowledge on photography but with some money and bought a fullframe could achieve the same kind of details as... some of you bros out here (and sis) with a APS-C sensor or M4/3 sensor camera.

    So maybe some guys who dare made the statement as, "I could have done better or taken the same photo (with the same effect) with a smaller sensor camera." Might actually meant what he/she said. I always believe in giving the benefit of doubt to whoever said that, maybe it is true, or maybe he/she only had air in his/her head.

    Either way, we won't end up losing a piece of meat over what other said. No need to get work up, be cool... who knows... maybe we can learn something from that person who said that.
    Last edited by rhino123; 30th September 2013 at 11:03 AM.
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  8. #28
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverPine View Post
    The market think the smart phone can do most the job including taking good pictures, like it or not it reflect on the current market trend. The below article from Bloomberg dated 19 September 2013 will explain in details.

    Smartphone Cameras at 41 Megapixels Pressure Canon, Nikon
    Nokia 1020! My next phone... not sure if it is really as good as it advertise, but I kind of like the design. I am going to get it with the grip... finally a 41MP camera... ;D
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  9. #29
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    so what are people do with photos with 41MP?


    post in facebook?
    Shoot to Live, Live to Shoot
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  10. #30
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    so what are people do with photos with 41MP?


    post in facebook?
    Nope. Show off to people. I have a 41MP camera. Your APS-C or even your FF is only 36MP. Hahahahaha. I can take better photo with my Nokia than your FF cam
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  11. #31

    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    I have a friend who don't know much about Photography and wanted to join Canon Photomarathon with his Samsung Galaxy S3 which to me is an insult to those who are serious in it and are willing to spend time and money in Photography. He thinks that skill is more important than gear which I agree but the thing is I don't think he is that skilled to use a camera phone against DSLR. Most importantly he's not the kind who spend time learning how to take good photos and it's plain arrogance and insulting to others when he insist that there is nothing wrong to use camera phone to compete with others in an official competition.

  12. #32
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by krw83 View Post
    I have a friend who don't know much about Photography and wanted to join Canon Photomarathon with his Samsung Galaxy S3 which to me is an insult to those who are serious in it and are willing to spend time and money in Photography. He thinks that skill is more important than gear which I agree but the thing is I don't think he is that skilled to use a camera phone against DSLR. Most importantly he's not the kind who spend time learning how to take good photos and it's plain arrogance and insulting to others when he insist that there is nothing wrong to use camera phone to compete with others in an official competition.
    Don't see a problem with that actually. I mean, if he is good, he will move on to the semi or something like that (sorry, I didn't enter the photomarathon before so not sure how it works). And if he is no good, he get thrown out early in the match. The point is, there didn't seemed to be a rule to prevent people from doing it. Someone might use the iphone 1st generation camera phone to participate in the marathon too. It all depends on how good he/she was.

    Afterall... after I got my Nokia 1020, I might use that to enter the competition too (if I got the time) and see how far I will go. I might get thrown out pretty early, or maybe not.
    Last edited by rhino123; 30th September 2013 at 10:14 AM.
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  13. #33
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by krw83 View Post
    I have a friend who don't know much about Photography and wanted to join Canon Photomarathon with his Samsung Galaxy S3 which to me is an insult to those who are serious in it and are willing to spend time and money in Photography. He thinks that skill is more important than gear which I agree but the thing is I don't think he is that skilled to use a camera phone against DSLR. Most importantly he's not the kind who spend time learning how to take good photos and it's plain arrogance and insulting to others when he insist that there is nothing wrong to use camera phone to compete with others in an official competition.
    Nothing wrong with that. In fact, if he wants to, then bring it on.. If he can win, all the more glory to him! Why would you worry or get worked up over such a small thing?

  14. #34

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    Usually I can't be bothered with ignorant people nor will I get upset over it. But then,I think compact and hp camera maybe be able to take F1 cars in action rather than still shots though I had never tried before. But then the image quality and sharpness should not be comparable.

  15. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rashkae View Post
    I encounter those too. My usual reply is "prove it first."
    That's cool and straight forward reply.

  16. #36

    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    IMO, the gear & skill gets the higher quality shots, but you don't always have it with you. Sometimes, for the "moment" shots, all you have is a split second and all you rely on is your trusty camera phone or compact camera on AF mode. no time to adjust all the ISO focal length, focus, shutter speed, etc, just AF, point and shoot. once you lose the moment, no matter how good your gear or skill is, you'll never get it back.

    I've seen people with compact cameras and camera phones take fantastic shots, they have a natural eye for photography, just wrong gear. I've also seen people with DSLR and using it like noobs, like a compact camera, so it goes both ways i guess.

    this is the same with nearly all "hobbies", more so for photography cos its a relatively inexpensive hobby, with higher quality cameras at more affordable price than before. you'll find that there are more of these people, and there's nothing to be angry or troubled about. the proof is in the pudding. There are tons of people out there who think they can drive as well as Hamilton, Kimi, Alonso, Schumacher, etc once they're behind the wheel. Regardless of whether its an Altis or a Ferrari. Its just human.

    Just leave them be and let them wallow in their pride and poor photos. At least they don't kill people with their poor photographs/photography unlike shitty drivers. Nobody dies from a poorly taken shot. At most it hurts your eyes, churns your stomach and makes you writh in agony. At the end of the day, however poorly the photo was taken DOES NOT affect anybody else directly, and neither does it "cheapen"the art, cos a person who appreciates good photos will never like crap photos, and there will always be better photos out there. The only problem is sifting through the many photos to find the jewel in the mud. (heck, even good photographers have to do that, not every shot is a diamond).

  17. #37

    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    and one of these days.. technology will bridge the gap between skill and gear even nearer.... so much so that you probably won't even need much skill anymore.. somebody will develop technology that doesn't need photons to land on a sensor, that can catch everything and its a matter of software to bring it out..


    http://petapixel.com/2013/09/29/newl...crappy-lenses/

    https://www.lytro.com/

  18. #38
    Moderator keithwee's Avatar
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    To feel about this issue means one possesses pride about one's efforts and skills in photography. No matter which way one thinks , this is definitely a good thread pointed out

  19. #39
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by icebear78 View Post
    and one of these days.. technology will bridge the gap between skill and gear even nearer.... so much so that you probably won't even need much skill anymore.. somebody will develop technology that doesn't need photons to land on a sensor, that can catch everything and its a matter of software to bring it out..


    http://petapixel.com/2013/09/29/newl...crappy-lenses/

    https://www.lytro.com/

    photo with high image quality not equivalent to good photography.
    Shoot to Live, Live to Shoot
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  20. #40

    Default Re: "I have a camera so I can take pictures like a Professional"

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    photo with high image quality not equivalent to good photography.

    i probably understand where you're coming from. e.g. framing the right shot/angle will probably never be replaced, BUT some of the "tricks" like focusing/defocusing which is manipulating the focus position & aperture, can already be done post photo taken.. this is 1 example i meant whereby technology just replaced one of the many skills of a photographer. We'll probably have sensors which can compensate more light without needed to sacrifice exposure time, which will replace the shutter speed and ISO. All you need now is a Lytro like camera which is super sensitive which allows a near infinitely controlled amount of light to enter, and tada. ISO, aperture, shutter speed is a thing of the past.

    Like it or not, technology WILL replace alot of skills. eventually. This is not something negative, it just means the photographer has to focus on getting the right shots, right angle, at the right time, no need to keep fingerings the settings and leave it all up to technology for the rest. Some may argue otherwise, but just watch the news in the coming decade or so. Think of it like RAW except you can adjust more than just the lighting.

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