View Poll Results: Do you agree with the smrt, comfort delgro fare hikes?

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  • Agree

    5 5.81%
  • Disagree

    81 94.19%
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Thread: price hike again by smrt, delgro comfort?

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkw
    Exactly, the relative country GDPs are provided below, which show very little difference in dollar terms as far as Singapore, France and US are concerned (mind you, adjusted already). So if you do the proper conversions on the train fares, you will see SMRT underprices Paris and Washington by a long mile and is even slightly cheaper than HK MTR, despite higher country GDP for Singapore.

    Here, I'll do it for you, comparing lowest fare or single trip;

    Washington --> US$1.35

    Paris --> US$1.79

    HK --> US$0.51

    S'pore --> US$0.49

    If you don't agree with my methodology, please offer up one of your own to demonstrate why the comparison (on price only) is not valid. Bear in mind again, the GDP for US, France and Singapore are nearly equal, with HK some distance behind. Bear in mind also, that the residents of France and the US pay far higher VAT and income taxes than Singaporeans....given the overall economic structure and stage of country development, you have a hard time convincing me that MRT fares in Singapore are over-priced.

    You have yet to convince us that the methology is valid. Numbers are just numbers and does not reflect the real situation. Definition of GDP can be found here and in general it consists of Private Consumption, Investments, Government Expenditure and Net Exports in short. Country A can have high investments, government expenditure, net exports but super low wages and overemployed employees while Country B have much higher wages and same GDP as Country A. With the same transport cost, Country B's workers can of course be able to afford it more easily and perceived it as cheaper as when compared to Country A.


    Please, if like that you calculate affordability, then those who have PHD, Masters in Financial and Economic studies, no need to work liao. But of course, numbers are deceiving end of the day. No need to compare to other countries, the price are OK now as indeed SMRT produce SGD127million profits in the latest financial year release.

  2. #82
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    Comparing to other countries only make it WRONG to do so. We do not have HongKong's rights to protest on the street. We have no rights to superfast Internet access to HongKong. We do not have super cheap housing in compared to USA based on GDP, tax or whatever.

    Look out for the poor and lower income. Some might have household income of only $1500+/- or even less (2 person working). Go travel to work just to earn enough, you pay about $2-4 a day, 24 days a month and that is about $200 for 2 person a month. Pay for expenses like meals, children's expenses, books, and the high cost in public housing in relative to these low income group? Talk about reality in Singapore. Does government still build 3 room flat for poor people like me that cannot afford 4 room or bigger flat?

    Looks like I have to sell my backside (oops not Dark Side ) at Geylang one day to finance my meals.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by theITguy
    Country A can have high investments, government expenditure, net exports but super low wages and overemployed employees while Country B have much higher wages and same GDP as Country A. With the same transport cost, Country B's workers can of course be able to afford it more easily and perceived it as cheaper as when compared to Country A.
    .
    GDP is strongly correlated with income. If you can demonstrate that there is great disparity in disposable income (not just take home pay, mind you. Have to factor in taxes and other costs of living) between Singaporeans and the rest of the countries, with the poorer Singaporeans having significantly less, you win, ok? I'll take back everything I've said.
    At this point, the only data that exists on this thread shows that train fares in Singapore are inexpensive compared to other similarly developed countries. If there is some other data that proves the contrary, lets hear it.

    Cheers,

  4. #84
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    Ok.... I thought so something to add... some oil to the fire...

    How often do you get to pay extra when the updating system did not work properly??? And they add more stages...

    I heard it is often that you get this problem.... I encounter 2 time....

    Some did not realise.... while some did not bother to go and collect back the differences since it is kind of troublesome....


    So now... who is cheating who????
    Art is perception; Perception is art.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkw
    At this point, the only data that exists on this thread shows that train fares in Singapore are inexpensive compared to other similarly developed countries. If there is some other data that proves the contrary, lets hear it.

    Cheers,
    Train fare could be inexpensive....

    But is it right for them to CUT the direct bus ROUTE TO FORCE people to take the TRAIN, and incurring 3 times the fares????

    Also.... the alternative.... what alternative do we have???

    Euro country.... they can get a diesel car and drive, and no 10 yrs life span right???

    Also.... train ride cost.... how about comparing the "cost of ride per km" instead of price vs price comparison???

    Any Euro cuontry is bigger than this little DOT by a lot right????

    Also.... HK MTR is very efficient, and you do not need to wait a long long while for a train to come... compared to SG...... (personal experience)
    Art is perception; Perception is art.

  6. #86
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    raise the fares

    i wonder who benefits, every tried the local buses recently when the weather is real hot , it seems like they also save the air con too, i went from a hot area (bus stop ) to a sweating moving oven.

    if the increase is to increase pay then whose pay gets the highest pay jump??? any takers ???????

  7. #87
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    why bring out the figures to compare??? what GDP, PIE, CTE ... la

    living in sg is like that, LL. say also no use, petition also no use - Just 'loon' lor.

    actually i think there is a chance whereby the PTC might not approve the price hike. why? then the garmen will tell the citizen that they are being heard. we are so happy with the 'victory' that we forgot about the casino thingy.

  8. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by song
    Based on per capita income, you are correct to say our fares are low.
    However, per capita income does not translate into real income per person. For example, a rich man earns 1million a yr and there are 10k people unemployed. However, per capita income is still a rough good figure because it is averaged out.

    Particularly during the recent times, we have a lot of unemployment and pay cut for the general public. However, we have our riches still doing well and improving. So at the end of the day, the per capita income is not much changed but the public pain in making a living is much higher.
    how about this?

  9. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by song
    If the increase this time round manages to get approval, i recommend we should read to be a smart "prosumer"

    I have read a book on being a Prosumer. Get yourself assets in the companies that provide services and goods to you. In this sense, you need to buy as much SBS/Delgro or SMRT shares, as much as your saving allowed. Any gain by these companies, it will translate some amount of gain for you. So it is like a cycle. The more you spend, the more rebate you will get in the form of paid divdend.
    Just use this to maximise out of the uncontrolled rising prices.
    maybe they need to pay higher salary to the top officials in SMRT and SBS to prevent them from corruption like what they did to the Ministers and MPs. Later like China Aviation Oil then public transport firms go down, no bus/mrt to take ....

  10. #90

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    so much discussion about the GDP, per capital income.

    perhaps we could look at the Return on Total Assets of Delgro and SMRT, how many % as compared to benchmark against other public transport companies in other countries.

    PTC said that ROTA is the deciding factor.

  11. #91
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    I work in the oil/gas industry. Oil prices had stabilised and had not rised drastically recently. So I wonder y the need to raise the charges.

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahbeng
    price hike again by smrt, delgro comfort? Just wondering why are there still some idiot singaporean who agreed with the stupid hikes (as seen on interviews during news).
    They belongs to the rich or PUAL LAN PA category. . Lousy Singaporean

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by xray
    SMRT should never raise their fares with their poor service. Have they increased frequency of the trains? No! Then why are their costs rising?

    As for buses, they have not improved anything since the last fare "adjustments".
    Some AIR CON buses are like an oven.

  14. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by mlwang
    so much discussion about the GDP, per capital income.

    perhaps we could look at the Return on Total Assets of Delgro and SMRT, how many % as compared to benchmark against other public transport companies in other countries.

    PTC said that ROTA is the deciding factor.

    Care to share how to calculate ROTA? and what is PTC? will it be a gd time to get Delgro /SMRT shares?

  15. #95

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    Like i said. since we can't boycott, use coins.

  16. #96
    Senior Member icarus's Avatar
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    Guys... you know what to do during the next GE liao...
    Lets whack them senseless (provided no walkovers )

    Majulah Singapore!!!!!!
    Yngwie J. Malmsteen - "...I've never considered myself a fast guitar player..."

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawnlim
    They belongs to the rich or PUAL LAN PA category. . Lousy Singaporean
    Hehehe... hey... imagine if you hold a bit... all the "L" lenses (Nikon one I dunno) you can buy.......

    Not so easy to WITH STAND the DARK SIDE..........

    But I rather go without the "L"sssss...............
    Art is perception; Perception is art.

  18. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by di0nysus
    Care to share how to calculate ROTA? and what is PTC? will it be a gd time to get Delgro /SMRT shares?
    ROTA also known as Return on Total Assets, is calculated as below:

    ROTA = Net Profit/ Average Assets eg (year 2004 + year 2003)/2

    PTC is Public Transport Council, the watchdog for fare increment.

    SMRT has the ROTA in the financial statement, is about 5%.

    Public transport companies share is a steady share, would fluatuate too much. If you are thinking of making $$ over short term, it is not good share to buy

  19. #99
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    Thumbs down

    Those bloody suckers should not increase the fares at all! Their service is so damn lousy and accident happened so many times in MRT stations and the security camera is not working at all! Still got the cheek to rise the fare??

  20. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by shawnlim
    They belongs to the rich or PUAL LAN PA category. . Lousy Singaporean
    well said

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