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Thread: Exploitation....

  1. #1
    Senior Member scud's Avatar
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    Default Exploitation....

    Exploitation!!

    hear me out.....
    my company event is around the corner and we were arrowed to be photographers during the 2 days event.
    arrowed was sent out thru email and cc to some directors.

    why i say it is exploitation?
    1. strictly speaking, it is not in our job scope to take photographs
    2. this will be 1st time, and i'm pretty sure there will be next time.... so this will not stop unless we resign from day job!
    3. company wide event, cannot be no budget rite?

    we were thinking of approaching the organiser and ask for more details such as some monetory to cover for our equipment depreciation.
    we also don mind if they would buy us, say a Lexar CF in return for the arrowed service, but this will open door to future exploitation as well.

    well, to those thinking "ahhh.. u might just do it for portfolio". answer is NO.
    we have been taking corporate events for quite sometime and this event is nothing special compare to others.

    it this point, we do not want to do it.
    wanna hear from those who were in this situation before.
    thanks.

  2. #2
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    hmmm i can only think of this ... if you do not wish to offend the people in the company, take mc or whatever, just don't go (with a valid reason) i believe you do not wish to go to the event anymore. but i believe there are people who provide free service for their own company (out of goodwill, good relations, bootlick, whatever)

    cheers

    (if you don't give a damn about the directors, reply the email and cc to all directors with your price tag lor)

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    Hahaha... Its always liddat lah.

    Though I love taking photos, if come to a stage I kena 'force', I'd rather not take and earn a blackmark for myself rather den stand there and kena 'eat' like kee siao. And u bet there will be a 2nd or 3rd time.

    No harm, u can try to approach the committee and sound out ur thoughts. But expect a 60% instant negative reply for extra pay or something like, "Aiyah, u own a good camera liao. Help out lah, you are the best, we can only depend on u, we know ur skill, will be good for u oso, etc, etc". Ultimately, the worse kinda reply is, "U are part of this company, u are expected to do so. If u dun wan to take, fine. Den u are not an employee of this company."

    Of cos, a tactic is to do the job for free, take photos so bad (all underexposed) and they wun call on u for anymore jobs liaoz.

  4. #4
    Senior Member scud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsbn
    Of cos, a tactic is to do the job for free, take photos so bad (all underexposed) and they wun call on u for anymore jobs liaoz.
    yeah, that is what i tot of... using a dept cam, fuji s5000.
    but my reputation is at stake...

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    Exploitation!!

    why i say it is exploitation?
    1. strictly speaking, it is not in our job scope to take photographs
    2. this will be 1st time, and i'm pretty sure there will be next time.... so this will not stop unless we resign from day job!
    3. company wide event, cannot be no budget rite?

    well, to those thinking "ahhh.. u might just do it for portfolio". answer is NO.
    we have been taking corporate events for quite sometime and this event is nothing special compare to others.
    I kena before, all I did was tell them my equipment needs to be serviced on regular basis so basic payment is necessary to cover the costs, after hearing the costs I didn't have to shoot anymore.

    They will have to agree on your costs for servicing because it's personal equipment and with life expentancy, so they have to reimburse you on the costs, but once they hear it, it's another thing

    They had money for prizes everything else. Yet can't pay me a measly $400 for 3 hours. Joke right? Hehe. Oh well.. alls well ends well. Btw, that time I was using CoolPix 5700 only. Hehe.

    All else simple, just MIA on the event date, MC, urgent-leave (mistress in china giving birth, etc) are valid reasons what

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    yeah, that is what i tot of... using a dept cam, fuji s5000.
    but my reputation is at stake...
    Do what everybody does. Blame the camera.

  7. #7

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    Happened to me once. I politely but firmly said "no thanks", and passed them the contact details of some pro photogs. In the end they didn't hire the pros just to save a few hundred bucks, but there was some woman with a cheap P&S digital "covering" the event. Needless to say, the photos were like cr@p.

  8. #8
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    I found myself in a very similar position this week. The offer of "you'll get free dinner" is quite insulting as you know very well that you will be taking photos and will not have time to eat it anyway. My retort was to tell them that I would do it this time (on some conditions) but next year they'd better build in $500 budget for photographer.

    To compromise this year, I will set-up mini studio and take formal portraits as people enter (it's a Bollywood theme and people will want to have a good picture to remember the event and the effort they went to in dressing up) and during the evening as well as typical D&D event shots. That way I can make money on the portraits and sell the CD of the rest of the evening for a nominal sum. Should make enough money that way to make it worth my while.

    Maybe you could think of way of making money from this indirectly rather than being paid up front?

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    yeah, that is what i tot of... using a dept cam, fuji s5000.
    but my reputation is at stake...
    When I run out of excuses blaming myself, I blame the camera... like what espn say.

    And den trick 'em into getting a 1DsMkII, a 17-40L, plus a Metz CT4 for such things next time

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    sell the CD?

    why not put 480x360 sized pictures in the CD and let them view. If they like the picture, they can order the prints + digital copy from you. In that way, you can charge more than the cost price of the prints.

    Of course, to avoid being labeled as being stingy. give all sorts of reasons like 'my cd-writer got something wrong' 'the file too big la, my internet very slow'

    and if they still insist that u send them the original copy, try sending them the RAW file.

    Always be diplomatic.

    cheers

  11. #11
    Senior Member scud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsbn
    When I run out of excuses blaming myself, I blame the camera... like what espn say.

    And den trick 'em into getting a 1DsMkII, a 17-40L, plus a Metz CT4 for such things next time
    my principle, if want to, better do a better job, else dont do.

  12. #12

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    from your post it sounds like you have already decided not to do it, or are you willing to do it for a small fee? why don't you check with the commitee about the budget first, although in all likelihood they will say no budget. then tell them your camera has been acting up lately and you will need to send it in for servicing sometime soon. in the meantime if they want you to shoot then you will need to go rent a camera and therefore you need to know their budget

  13. #13

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    How does the company know you have a good camera?

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    why i say it is exploitation?
    1. strictly speaking, it is not in our job scope to take photographs
    2. this will be 1st time, and i'm pretty sure there will be next time.... so this will not stop unless we resign from day job!
    3. company wide event, cannot be no budget rite?
    actually job scope can easily be changed also depending on your employment agreement or contract, your time may belong to the company 24x7 and the rights of any product you develop whilst under the employ of the company could potentially belong to the company. what they can't do though is force you to use your own equipment for company purposes.
    Last edited by madmacs; 17th March 2005 at 01:48 PM.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    yeah, that is what i tot of... using a dept cam, fuji s5000.
    but my reputation is at stake...
    yup...not advisable to do that. you could end up losing a potential customer. you should always take pride in your work.

  16. #16
    Senior Member scud's Avatar
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    reno, i can count the no of ppl using dslr in my company.
    it is a small world, go CP, MS, AP, TCW chances of running into colleagues is high.

    alvin, in the eyes of bosses, u are expected to be multitasking.
    and yes, i wont bring my cam as i need to declare to security.
    worst, after declare, u cant bring in. must leave it at the security room. and u will not know how they handle your bag.

    lets see if we can work out something.

  17. #17
    Senior Member scud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmacs
    yup...not advisable to do that. you could end up losing a potential customer. you should always take pride in your work.
    if do a good job, might get few more potential customers...

  18. #18
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    arrgh! my battery and CF card die must buy new one, but don't have money. Can co buy? My lens also need to be cleaned. I don't have an external flash. cannot take.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by scud
    reno, i can count the no of ppl using dslr in my company.
    it is a small world, go CP, MS, AP, TCW chances of running into colleagues is high.

    alvin, in the eyes of bosses, u are expected to be multitasking.
    and yes, i wont bring my cam as i need to declare to security.
    worst, after declare, u cant bring in. must leave it at the security room. and u will not know how they handle your bag.

    lets see if we can work out something.
    well i agree you can't really say 'no' to them outright. so you have to find a way to
    1. tell them how you would love to do the job, but can't because your cam needs to see the doctor
    2. wrangle a small payment from them to cover equipment depreciation or rental.

    as for bringing the camera to work, in most company's the manager/director can send a note to security authorizing you to bring your camera in to cover company function. with that you should not need to leave the camera at security room. and if the event is offsite, perhaps you can request for time off to go home to collect the camera. the management should be able to accomodate that request.

  20. #20
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    1. Tell them nicely it will definitely reflect badly on your reputation if the pictures come out badly, as the S5000 is not a camera that can produce what you normally do.
    2. If they ask you for your camera, say you loan it to a friend for other events overseas, as the company do not allow cameras in, so no time shoot lend friend
    3. If they throw you a DSLR, take MC/leave/whatever.


    Last time when I cover my unit's event in NS, I was F left right centre by my senior specialist for eating. I was like WTH. Lucky my 1 star general bother to thank me and give me a pad for taking photos, although I dunno him, really a nice 1 star general

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