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Thread: Military Discussion : Should AMX 13-SM1 be replace ?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwchoy
    actually it is in reverse, we should be the guys pissing in our pants since our neighbours have the PT91 while we have some Tempest (Centurion). *they do have 105mm guns, may this is the "modified israeli Abrams"?*
    not sure if wat i know is classiified (we gotta be careful about leaking secret info here in our enthusiastic discussion ), but i think we've more than covered all bases for defence, ya?

    you seem to know more than most of us here :P
    David Teo
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  2. #22
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    I'm sure in theory this should be classified information and therefore not on public discussion on the world wide web?

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jed
    I'm sure in theory this should be classified information and therefore not on public discussion on the world wide web?
    ermm.... on the contary, this is open information and can be found on the internet. the only secret is the true capability of the weapons systems, the order of battle, etc etc, which we MUST keep secret

    it's been widely known that SAF is been seeking for a light tank to replace the old SM-1s. i'm rather unsure about SAF having the Tempest (Centurion).

    it's also known that M'sia has PT-91 MBTs (from Poland).

    personally, MBTs are unsuitable for our terrain. Light tanks and IFVs plus urban-trained infantry units are best for our terrain.
    Last edited by mervlam; 28th January 2005 at 03:02 AM.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jed
    I'm sure in theory this should be classified information and therefore not on public discussion on the world wide web?
    this isn't anything i haven't read before in sgforum's Military Nuts. relax

  5. #25
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    Okie dokie. Don't come looking for me when Uncle Lee knocks on your door

    Seriously though, I haven't actually read the thread, just the title. Surely a discussion of whether a certain product should be replaced will include it's performance both on paper and off. So it was a bit dodgy, I just thought I'd warn everyone on a personal capacity. ie. nothing to do with CS and I'm not being a wet blanket. You go right ahead and do what you want.

  6. #26
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    point noted Jed.

    We're just Boys with Toys.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mervlam
    it's been widely known that SAF is been seeking for a light tank to replace the old SM-1s. i'm rather unsure about SAF having the Tempest (Centurion).

    it's also known that M'sia has PT-91 MBTs (from Poland).

    personally, MBTs are unsuitable for our terrain. Light tanks and IFVs plus urban-trained infantry units are best for our terrain.
    the Tempest is the SAF name for the Centurion. It is printed right there in that little red book with the F16 on the cover

    yah yah it used to be damn hush hush. you know that during my active days, just to transport the CEV and the AVLB out of Area D requires that it be covered by tarpulin, and only in the dead of the night.

    Then one fine day I saw those two big chappies parading down the Padang during NDP

    Anyone who has ever tried maneouvering a CEV around in Area D would agree we need something smaller but hack! those guy's engines really give you the "vibes" when they rev

  8. #28
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    Hi

    for those interested, there was a book published a few years ago on the militrary capability of the SAF. i can't remember the title of the book so i googled "singapore army strength" and after a little digging, came up with this very interesting article on the book...

    http://www.littlespeck.com/content/s...ity-030114.htm

    so yeah, the info is all on the net. Discussing military hardware should be ok. actually, we are just desktop generals
    David Teo
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dawn
    not sure if wat i know is classiified (we gotta be careful about leaking secret info here in our enthusiastic discussion ), but i think we've more than covered all bases for defence, ya?

    you seem to know more than most of us here :P
    nah, I'm just more talkative than the rest

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dawn
    this very interesting article on the book...

    http://www.littlespeck.com/content/s...ity-030114.htm

    [Following scenario is quoted from Pg 58, A Scenario of War with Malaysia.]

    IT'S 4am.

    The early morning calm is suddenly shattered by the deafening screams of low-flying jets.

    Seconds later, Kuantan air base is rocked by multiple explosions, followed by "secondaries" as Malaysia's air assets in aircraft shelters and revetments are obliterated.

    Klaxons blaring, pilots are scrambled to whichever aircraft that are still air-worthy, but it's useless. The runways had been cratered.

    In the ensuing confusion, reports start streaming in. It seems that this is not an isolated case.

    Butterworth checks in and reports that its entire complement of F/A-18D Hornets are now smoking, twisted hulks out on the tarmac.

    And the entire Third Division which has overall command over Johor and Malacca had also been annihilated.

    The National Power Grid had not been spared, plunging the entire country in darkness, adding to the chaos and confusion.

    Reports also indicated that the Ministry of Defence building in Jalan Padang Tembak, Kuala Lumpur, had been hit by at least six GBU-31 1,000-pound JDAMs (Joint Direct Attack Munitions).

    Even the KLCC had been struck with such ferocity that only the Maxis Tower was left standing.

    On Bukit Nanas, only a blackened stump is left of what used to be the Kuala Lumpur Tower.

    Down in Johor and Malacca, the situation is much worse. A torrent of armoured vehicles, including tanks, are hogging all the roads linking Johor Baru to Muar and Kota Tinggi, disgorging armed soldiers who took over all the towns.

    Senai airport, captured in a pre-dawn attack was being used by the helicopters and planes taking part in the on-going offensive.

    On the North-South Expressway, main battle tanks and armoured fighting vehicles together with towed artillery with fighter jets and attack helicopters providing close support were going north, destination unknown.

    Reports of troops landing from helicopters were coming in from all over Johor, from Mersing to Muar.

    By noon, Johoreans find themselves under Singapore military rule.

    If you think the scenario described above are wild imaginings of The Malay Mail writers, think again.

    The scenario, in less graphic form, was written by a British scholar, Tim Huxley, in his book Defending the Lion City: The Armed Forces of Singapore.
    what do they mean Page 58? this is not from the book and not written by Tim Huxley. Quite mischievious the way it is written. Come on, no one is going to attack KLCC and Bukit Nanas. what powerful imagination, and they make it seem like it is written by the author of the book

    The scenario, in less graphic form, was written by a British scholar, Tim Huxley, in his book Defending the Lion City: The Armed Forces of Singapore.
    not very responsible journalism I would say

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by King Tiger
    US M1 Abrams : Too heavy
    UK Challenger : Laggi more heavy
    is it? didn't know the Challenger is heavier than the M1.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dawn
    unfortunately they don't make sims like this anymore

    those were the days when one can pilot a F117a nighthawk into Tripoli, Libya undetected on a recon misssion, or fly an F15e strike eagle into the heart of baghdad to take out enemy military installations, engage in a dogfight in a F16c fighting falcon over the skies of North Korea, or lead a platform of m1a2 mbts across the Arabian desert........
    my favourite flight sim is the Jane's USAF. Anyone got it to work on Windows XP? Please please tell me how! Mine runs but some of the windows doesn't appear. I'm using nVidia 5700 card with the standard nVidia unified driver.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by giddygoat
    actually hor, i think singapore is so urban an environment that a force of bradley armoured vehicles armed with TOW antitanks would probably be more effective. you have the 25mm against soft targets and antitank missles against armour. can carry infantry as well. easier to camo without the bloody great gun barrel and smaller so can navigate narrower streets.
    we have the bionix, which is a smaller counterpart of the Bradley. I'm just happy none of the SAF generals seem to think along the lines of the "great" General Sinseki, who advocates wheels over tracks. Clearly he is one of those who hasn't tried driving around the Sungei Gedong driving tracks during the rainy season.

  14. #34
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    I should know all these armour stuffs but heng heng, my armour mono intake unit dun want me. They kicked me out!

    Once armour, always armour but lucky me. Pressure Foward!

    I think the UK Challenger is lighter than the M1. It uses (dunno what name) new technology light weight but strong armour. I heard that the future armour will be made of plastic. But like i've said, i dun know much!

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwchoy
    I don't think it is a very good idea to fire a TOW from INSIDE a HDB flat! from the roof maybe
    armbrust and spike can be fired anywhere. even in rooms.
    sigh.

  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by afbug
    I should know all these armour stuffs but heng heng, my armour mono intake unit dun want me. They kicked me out!

    Once armour, always armour but lucky me. Pressure Foward!

    I think the UK Challenger is lighter than the M1. It uses (dunno what name) new technology light weight but strong armour. I heard that the future armour will be made of plastic. But like i've said, i dun know much!
    I think the armour you are talking about is chobham armour.

  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by afbug
    I should know all these armour stuffs but heng heng, my armour mono intake unit dun want me. They kicked me out!

    Once armour, always armour but lucky me. Pressure Foward!

    I think the UK Challenger is lighter than the M1. It uses (dunno what name) new technology light weight but strong armour. I heard that the future armour will be made of plastic. But like i've said, i dun know much!
    i thought sg recently acquired new armour hardware recently?...not the bionix...bionix has been around since i ord in 96...was there taking photos of it when they demonstrated the proto-type in s.gedung, about its capability for being fast (yah it is) and something like 4wd and able to rotate 180 around in 30s or so. :P

    They should train men to fire m-16s riding mountain bikes for fibua....juz like the mongols archermen on horseback....we would be a force to be trifled with. Hehehehe.
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  18. #38
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    I thin it should be replaced by the BMX all-terrain!

  19. #39

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    the 155mm Self Propelled Howitzer??

    Quote Originally Posted by sbs99
    i thought sg recently acquired new armour hardware recently?...not the bionix...bionix has been around since i ord in 96...was there taking photos of it when they demonstrated the proto-type in s.gedung, about its capability for being fast (yah it is) and something like 4wd and able to rotate 180 around in 30s or so. :P

    They should train men to fire m-16s riding mountain bikes for fibua....juz like the mongols archermen on horseback....we would be a force to be trifled with. Hehehehe.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbs99
    i thought sg recently acquired new armour hardware recently?...not the bionix...bionix has been around since i ord in 96...was there taking photos of it when they demonstrated the proto-type in s.gedung, about its capability for being fast (yah it is) and something like 4wd and able to rotate 180 around in 30s or so. :P

    They should train men to fire m-16s riding mountain bikes for fibua....juz like the mongols archermen on horseback....we would be a force to be trifled with. Hehehehe.
    4WD? nothing in Armour has 4WD since everything has more than 4 wheels

    only the MBTs have the ability to really ROTATE on the spot as one track can go forward while the other goes "gostan". Don't think Bionix can do that, it can do what the M113 and AMX can do, a pivot turn. But I don't know, I'm pretty sure I could manage to pivot turn an M113 in less than 30s.

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