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Thread: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

  1. #1

    Default Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Hi guys, I couldnt make up my mind to upgrade to a mirrorless or an entry level DSLR, hope I can get some advises from this thread. = )

    I wouldn't call myself a photographer but I do abit of freelance photography sometime.

    Previously used Canon P&S n powershot SX20IS, was quite happy with it but the con of not being able to print bigger than A2 size of photograph (for assignment) made me think of getting an upgrade. (Anyway, sold it to an old classmate)

    What I use the camera for?
    - Portrait, studio product shoots
    - Oversea travel scenery landscape shoots
    - Macro shoots (personal hobby)
    - Occasionally wedding, event shoots

    Then then, I m quite small build, so a big heavy DSLR is quite a killer for me if I am carrying it the whole day travelling around.

    Was actually interested in Canon G1X but found out it does not support macro =(.


    (I was quite a pro Canon user so nt v sure about other brands but open minded to them except Sony =x ) Eh, so do you guyz have any recommendation of cameras? Thx Thx.

  2. #2
    Member fmeeran's Avatar
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    You should look at the micro fourthirds like the Panasonic g series and see if it fits your requirements.
    Dxxxx | 35/1.8 | 50/1.8 | Tokina 28-70 | Panny G1 | 14-45 | 25/1.7
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    Hi guys, I couldnt make up my mind to upgrade to a mirrorless or an entry level DSLR, hope I can get some advises from this thread. = )

    I wouldn't call myself a photographer but I do abit of freelance photography sometime.

    Previously used Canon P&S n powershot SX20IS, was quite happy with it but the con of not being able to print bigger than A2 size of photograph (for assignment) made me think of getting an upgrade. (Anyway, sold it to an old classmate)

    What I use the camera for?
    - Portrait, studio product shoots
    - Oversea travel scenery landscape shoots
    - Macro shoots (personal hobby)
    - Occasionally wedding, event shoots

    Then then, I m quite small build, so a big heavy DSLR is quite a killer for me if I am carrying it the whole day travelling around.

    Was actually interested in Canon G1X but found out it does not support macro =(.


    (I was quite a pro Canon user so nt v sure about other brands but open minded to them except Sony =x ) Eh, so do you guyz have any recommendation of cameras? Thx Thx.
    Sony NEX mirrorless system is the best selling mirrorless system and Sony entry level DSLR is the most economical price system

    If you don't want Sony, then you only have the following
    1) Smaller sensor mirrorless from Nikon V-1, J-1 or D3100 DSLR
    2) Fuji film Xpro1
    3) Olympus Pen
    4) Panasonic GF3
    5) Pentax K-01

    Canon do not have mirrorless interchangeable-lens system
    Last edited by sony90290; 19th March 2012 at 01:37 PM. Reason: add other mirrorless

  4. #4

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    sony mirrorless surely packs a punch. u can consider canon 600D and nikon d5100. try them out first before makin a decision
    D7000 + 50mm

  5. #5
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    Hi guys, I couldnt make up my mind to upgrade to a mirrorless or an entry level DSLR, hope I can get some advises from this thread. = )

    I wouldn't call myself a photographer but I do abit of freelance photography sometime.

    Previously used Canon P&S n powershot SX20IS, was quite happy with it but the con of not being able to print bigger than A2 size of photograph (for assignment) made me think of getting an upgrade. (Anyway, sold it to an old classmate)

    What I use the camera for?
    - Portrait, studio product shoots
    - Oversea travel scenery landscape shoots
    - Macro shoots (personal hobby)
    - Occasionally wedding, event shoots

    Then then, I m quite small build, so a big heavy DSLR is quite a killer for me if I am carrying it the whole day travelling around.

    Was actually interested in Canon G1X but found out it does not support macro =(.


    (I was quite a pro Canon user so nt v sure about other brands but open minded to them except Sony =x ) Eh, so do you guyz have any recommendation of cameras? Thx Thx.
    Well... DSLR and mirrorless cameras both have the capability to shoot what you have listed. So it boils down to ergonomic and controls of the camera itself... when that came in view, no one here can give you an accurate assessment because only you yourself would be clear of your own shooting style. So I would recommend you to go down to the shops and try these camera out yourself.

    If weigh is a problem, then most probably a mirrorless is a great alternative (I just came back from China Shantou on a tour and shoot all my shots with a E-PL1 and my Samsung Note. I like the light weigh although I sometime missed my 7D). You can check out the latest Olympus OM-D mirrorless camera, which is freaking incredible... or the Pentax K-01 which you can mount those incredible pentax lenses.

    For entry level Canon camera, I would think the Canon 600D is pretty alright, if you step up a bit, get the 60D (although quite a bit heavier and bigger).
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  6. #6

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Either MILC or DSLR will do.

    Both types of cameras will do well enough for the photography you intend to do.

    MILC options :

    m4/3 - Olympus EP series and OM-D; Panasonic GH2; G3; GX1
    Strengths : small size/weight; nice range of small/fast/good lenses from UWA (ultra wide angle) to short telephoto (ie. 90mm equivalent)
    Cons : slightly poorer high ISO performance (about 1 stop compared to the best APS-C); slightly nosier o/p (real slight) at all ISO levels (no big deal unless you push your files in post process (PP)) ; Less dynamic range; Less DOF control compared to APS-C

    APS-C sensor MILC
    --------------------
    Pentax K-01
    Pros : Largest range of small APS-C lenses. Small/fast/good quality lenses. Backward comparability to all legacy k-mount lenses. On camera shake reduction
    Cons : Largest MILC camera body (though pretty right sized with APS-C lenses)


    Sony NEX
    Pros : Smallest flange distance to use other brand lenses with an adapter (manual focus only)
    Cons : Large sized lenses for a small camera body; mostly slow lenses and zooms; only a few fast primes at the moment (16/2.8; 25/1.8; 501/.8)


    Samsung NX
    Pros : Good sized; Good prime lenses (small; fast; good performance) from WA to short telephoto
    Cons : Not as good high ISO performance compared to the above 2. Very large file sizes in RAW (40MB); Relatively unknown level of user group support here
    Last edited by pinholecam; 19th March 2012 at 02:19 PM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    Was actually interested in Canon G1X but found out it does not support macro =(.
    You can always get a Raynox and put it on a G1X.

  8. #8
    Member jasonteoch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnsQ

    You can always get a Raynox and put it on a G1X.
    Raynox is suitable for 50mm and above lenses right?

  9. #9

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by jasonteoch View Post
    Raynox is suitable for 50mm and above lenses right?

    Hmm, i don't actually have one, but i think yes:
    For Digital/DVD/Video cameras. The lens includes a snap-on universal mount suitable for 52mm to 67mm filter size. DCR-250 Super Macro lens obtains the maximum macro magnification power when set at the most telephoto position of zoom lens.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by jasonteoch View Post
    Raynox is suitable for 50mm and above lenses right?
    Just buy a step ring lor. Less than 10 bucks
    D7100,SB910,17-50/2.8OS,105/2.8VR,85/1.8D,2xE-M1,O60/2.8,12-40/2.8,35-100/2.8,14-42,LX100

  11. #11
    Senior Member Agrivar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    Hi guys, I couldnt make up my mind to upgrade to a mirrorless or an entry level DSLR, hope I can get some advises from this thread. = )

    I wouldn't call myself a photographer but I do abit of freelance photography sometime.

    Previously used Canon P&S n powershot SX20IS, was quite happy with it but the con of not being able to print bigger than A2 size of photograph (for assignment) made me think of getting an upgrade. (Anyway, sold it to an old classmate)

    What I use the camera for?
    - Portrait, studio product shoots
    - Oversea travel scenery landscape shoots
    - Macro shoots (personal hobby)
    - Occasionally wedding, event shoots

    Then then, I m quite small build, so a big heavy DSLR is quite a killer for me if I am carrying it the whole day travelling around.

    Was actually interested in Canon G1X but found out it does not support macro =(.


    (I was quite a pro Canon user so nt v sure about other brands but open minded to them except Sony =x ) Eh, so do you guyz have any recommendation of cameras? Thx Thx.
    The new Olympus E-M5 might be just the right fit
    Its part of the Oly m4/3 Mirrorless range. Can share lenses with Oly & Panasonic
    This has a new sensor that has better DR than some of the previous Pen series. So good for landscape
    m4/3 has the widest lens collection of any Mirrorless system. The Oly M.zuiko45mm/f1.8 is one of the best. Its a portrait lens. Even Acclaimed by DXO labs to be on par or better than some APS-C lenses.
    The E-M5 comes with a new kit lens that can shoot Macro. Just check this out : Robin Wong: Olympus M.Zuiko 12-50mm F3.5-6.3 Review: Macro Shooting at Butterfly Park, KL
    And for your last point, the E-M5 can shoot 9fps, and has as good High ISO capability for indoor wedding. Best Flash system in m4/3.

    And lastly, its smaller and lighter than most DSLRs..
    Panny G85+GH3|EPL5|14|20|45|14-42|12-35|14-140|35-100|Metz 50 AF-1

  12. #12

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    And forgot to mention one thing ... EM5 is so expensive!
    D7100,SB910,17-50/2.8OS,105/2.8VR,85/1.8D,2xE-M1,O60/2.8,12-40/2.8,35-100/2.8,14-42,LX100

  13. #13

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Short listed for the time being : canon 600D, Oly OMD , panasonic Gx1 (but disappointed with the built-in flash) & nikon

    I went to rent Canon 600d to try out for an assignment with flash mount on it, and the client was like saying tt '' your arms like nt gonna tahan the weight for long'' -.-'' and yea shot for like an hr..and ... x_x

    i am very attracted to the features,appearance and (esp ) e light weight of OMD too. $1788 for kit 1 really shot me down +_+ (m a poor student) and the saddest part is that my fren is like against me buyin omd saying that it is only a M4/3 and for such price, + not professional looking enough for commerical work etc... (arrows shot down feeling)

    do u guys think izit really v unpro to carry e OMD for commerial works, is a Must to look pro to carry a dslr ?

  14. #14
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    i am very attracted to the features,appearance and (esp ) e light weight of OMD too. $1788 for kit 1 really shot me down +_+ (m a poor student) and the saddest part is that my fren is like against me buyin omd saying that it is only a M4/3 and for such price, + not professional looking enough for commerical work etc... (arrows shot down feeling)

    do u guys think izit really v unpro to carry e OMD for commerial works, is a Must to look pro to carry a dslr ?
    Why to u care what your friends said? Plus why do you care if a camera is not professional looking enough for commercial work? If your friends said that then (pardon me saying this) your friend know ****. Even if they are professionals, I would definitely doubt their capability in this field, and if they are not professional, I would not take their words seriously.

    You should read this article and show it to your friends.

    How to overcome fears using Micro 4/3rds cameras in a professional environment | Giulio Sciorio Blog

    Finally do not let the so-call professional looking thingy get to you. As long as you can produce the image that your client like, they don't care what camera you use.
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  15. #15
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    ignore. Repeated thread.
    Last edited by rhino123; 27th May 2012 at 07:14 PM.
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  16. #16

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    ...
    the saddest part is that my fren is like against me buyin omd saying that it is only a M4/3 and for such price, + not professional looking enough for commerical work etc... (arrows shot down feeling)

    do u guys think izit really v unpro to carry e OMD for commerial works, is a Must to look pro to carry a dslr ?
    What Rhino said just above my post is quite true. But that being said, there will be limitations you'll have to deal with for the micro 4/3, depending on your assignments. There's a reason why so many professionals use FF, and why there are people using medium format as well.

    For the price, I have to agree with your friend though, it's very expensive. But it seems that the main problem you have is not being able to "tahan" heavy cameras, and that will be a serious limitation if you ever intend to "upgrade". It seems like at this moment, you don't really have a choice but to go for the Olympus which you feel suits you best.

    I believe you should think over this decision carefully. Do you have absolutely no intention of upgrading in the future? Say, to get more serious in this hobby, to do more freelancing, or to even go professional? If you don't, then it will be alright. But if you do, then you should consider going mainstream with Nikon or Canon, not even Sony. The reason is because of the accessories. With Canon and Nikon, flashes and lenses, especially 3rd party (considering you're tight on budget) are much easier to find. You'll find your upgrade route much smoother, and you'll find it very easy to get what you need to get (especially 2nd hand in the B&S section). That's a very important plus point for going mainstream.

    To overcome the trouble of not being able to hold a heavy camera for long, I guess, you need to exercise more?

    Personally, I like looking professional even though I'm not, it's just an ego thing. I'd carry my 70-200 F4 L IS and always add on the lens hood to make it look longer, and also attach my battery grip to make my camera look bigger. But that's just for fun. As always, it's the photographer that counts.
    Last edited by Wizongod; 29th May 2012 at 10:49 AM.

  17. #17
    Moderator rhino123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wizongod View Post
    For the price, I have to agree with your friend though, it's very expensive. But it seems that the main problem you have is not being able to "tahan" heavy cameras, and that will be a serious limitation if you ever intend to "upgrade". It seems like at this moment, you don't really have a choice but to go for the Olympus which you feel suits you best.
    Bro... OM-D is not expensive... not even 2k, and you have weather sealing, great new sensor, come with 5 axis inbody Stabilizer, small and light, easy to operate, especially manual. At least to me, that is not overprice.

    Anyway, talking about cost is very personal, some would find 10k cheap, others thinks sub-thousand acceptable anything over that it is too expensive.

    As to OM-D being used in professional environment, read the article I have provided. Plus I do see people using m4/3 to do freelancing jobs. Of course alot of professionals would fall back to using FF or even APS-C camera - plus many uses medium format or large format, it is not that m4/3 could not be use... sure there are some limitations... and yes, depending on what type of job TS is taking up, he should be equipped with the correct tools... and that is something that none of us know except TS himself.

    Not sure if I am correct on this... but 4/3 sensor and micro4/3 sensor are very similar... in size. Although both uses different mount... what I mean to say, was I saw professionals using Olympus 4/3 sensor DSLR. So why can't a professional use a micro4/3 camera? Why should he/she fall back to Canon, Nikon, Sony, Pentax? Because their camera had larger sensor or what? If that is the case... shouldn't we also consider Sigma and Samsung?
    Last edited by rhino123; 29th May 2012 at 11:10 AM.
    I am not a photographer, just someone who happened to have a couple of cameras.
    My lousy shots

  18. #18
    Member lotus80's Avatar
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    Haven't read the big thread yet, but I'll suggest to also try Nikon D7000.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by lotus80 View Post
    Haven't read the big thread yet, but I'll suggest to also try Nikon D7000.
    "Entry level" and D7000 don't go hand in hand...
    Alpha

  20. #20

    Default Re: Mirrorless or entry level DSLR?

    Quote Originally Posted by elvire View Post
    Short listed for the time being : canon 600D, Oly OMD , panasonic Gx1 (but disappointed with the built-in flash) & nikon

    I went to rent Canon 600d to try out for an assignment with flash mount on it, and the client was like saying tt '' your arms like nt gonna tahan the weight for long'' -.-'' and yea shot for like an hr..and ... x_x

    i am very attracted to the features,appearance and (esp ) e light weight of OMD too. $1788 for kit 1 really shot me down +_+ (m a poor student) and the saddest part is that my fren is like against me buyin omd saying that it is only a M4/3 and for such price, + not professional looking enough for commerical work etc... (arrows shot down feeling)

    do u guys think izit really v unpro to carry e OMD for commerial works, is a Must to look pro to carry a dslr ?
    I'm a newbie - and I require "face-detect"

    Go for M4/3
    = because the Panasonic 20mm is the lens that makes it tick (It enables the rare "Bokeh" effect in a compact!)
    = The 20mm is sharper than a Canon L lens (24mm - 70mm) that I recently shot with. However, bokeh wise, it is no match for L lens.

    Go for K-01 = Have not tried, apparently has Face detect , pancake with bokeh. Great ISO performance

    I have a Canon 550D with 50mm lens = default mode no face detect, high % out of off focus photos even at f2.8. But my wifes loves the bokeh, so when in focus, is very nice.

    Samsung NX200 = Have not tried, apparently has Face detect , pancake with bokeh. Good ISO performance.

    Sony = Great camera and functions, I'm looking forward to it's prime lens to have bokeh (maybe coming out soon?).


    Decalaration:
    Ex Owner of: Panasonic GF1, Canon G10, S90
    Currently: GF2, GF3, S95, Canon 550D

    I'm not a great photographer, please don't take my feedback seriously... they are just my opinion which I fail to keep to myself.

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