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Thread: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal camera

  1. #41

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by brapodam View Post
    Question is, do you shoot RAW? I'm not trying to defend Nikon or anything, but high ISO performance has many factors. Detail retention, colour reproduction, amount of noise, type of noise are all factors to consider. Some types of noise are easier to correct than others. Just because one image seems to have less noise than the other, doesn't mean the camera that produced that image has the better high ISO performance.

    Ultimately, if you really want to get the best comparison, you should shoot RAW and then do your own noise reduction with PP software to the best of your ability for each image, then compare the images.

    Also, high ISO performance is also only one factor to consider, there are many other factors. Unless you constantly shoot at ISO 6400 and above, high ISO performance should not be the deciding factor when purchasing cameras.
    Yep, I shoot NEF and RAF on the D7K and X100. Agreed with you on the issue with high ISO, but the original context is someone saying that the distinguishing feature of a DSLR is its superior ISO performance, which I was disagreeing to.

    Quote Originally Posted by edutilos- View Post
    Ok, but you should note that these things are subjective.

    Most review sites (I'm sure you can do a search) give the verdict that it's comparable, not a clearcut case of X100 performing better than the D7000 as you have stated earlier. In any case, it's up to you to say what you want to say, just adding on to point out that your opinion does differ from many other reviews. Cheers!
    Oh well.. maybe my eyes just aren't that good.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member sinned79's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by pbear1973 View Post
    but the original context is someone saying that the distinguishing feature of a DSLR is its superior ISO performance, which I was disagreeing to.
    u did not read my message carefully.

    and TS is comparing entry level cameras (point and shoot) i will assume since he mention normal camera.

    X100 obviously is not a entry level camera as it has a bigger sensor (its even bigger then m4/3) as compared to a normal camera which sensor is smaller then even a m4/3 camera.

    And I was also saying, such normal cameras is catching up these days with DSLR but there is still a disparity when you compare high ISO.

    So my sentence still stands, DSLR still has superior ISO as compared to a normal camera (entry level point and shoot if that is what TS means by normal camera).
    Last edited by sinned79; 14th March 2012 at 05:16 PM.

  3. #43

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by sinned79 View Post
    u did not read my message carefully.

    and TS is comparing entry level cameras (point and shoot) i will assume since he mention normal camera.

    X100 obviously is not a entry level camera as it has a bigger sensor (its even bigger then m4/3) as compared to a normal camera which sensor is smaller then even a m4/3 camera.

    And I was also saying, such normal cameras is catching up these days with DSLR but there is still a disparity when you compare high ISO.

    So my sentence still stands, DSLR still has superior ISO as compared to a normal camera (entry level point and shoot if that is what TS means by normal camera).
    I did, and here it is again:

    "the most distinctive is the ISO...

    DSLR ISO is cleaner then compact cameras although nowadays these compact cameras are catching up.

    but if u compare a few years back... the ISO from entry level DSLR Canon 450D wins any compact cameras from that era hands down."

    While TS does mention "normal" in the subject line, your post only mentions "compact", which would include big-sensor compacts. Your post didn't limit the comparison to "normal" compacts.

    Anyway at my very rudimentary skill level I wouldn't want to be arguing with you or anyone else here. I'll just keep quiet and learn from everyone instead.
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  4. #44
    Senior Member sinned79's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by pbear1973 View Post
    I did, and here it is again:

    "the most distinctive is the ISO...

    DSLR ISO is cleaner then compact cameras although nowadays these compact cameras are catching up.

    but if u compare a few years back... the ISO from entry level DSLR Canon 450D wins any compact cameras from that era hands down."

    While TS does mention "normal" in the subject line, your post only mentions "compact", which would include big-sensor compacts. Your post didn't limit the comparison to "normal" compacts.

    Anyway at my very rudimentary skill level I wouldn't want to be arguing with you or anyone else here. I'll just keep quiet and learn from everyone instead.
    read again dude. highlighted in BOLD.

    and guess which year Canon 450D was released? I bet compacts back in those years is no comparable to entry level DSLR at high ISOs.

    and the recent years, compacts is chasing up but there is still disparity as majority of these compacts still lose out to DSLR.

    at your rudimentary level, u also need to learn how to read carefully.
    Last edited by sinned79; 14th March 2012 at 05:33 PM.

  5. #45
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Guys, let's not worry about semnatics, especially since like certain other branches of technology (e.g. computers, where portable, ultraportable, ultrabook, etc, and many other obscure terms are also present), the definition of a "compact camera" is not clearly defined. It gets a bit silly when 2 people end up just debating about definition of words and what is right, or downplaying themselves to prove some point which is not apparent to me at least. Just state your point, clarify, move on.

    Let's just look at Wikipedia:

    Point-and-shoot camera - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A point-and-shoot camera, also called a compact camera, is a still camera designed primarily for simple operation
    Don't think you can call X100 a compact camera given this definition (ironically, this is also debatable).

    Yet Fujifilm calls it a compact: Home | The FinePix X100 Professional Photographer's compact digital camera from Fujifilm
    DPReview too: Fujifilm unveils FinePix X100 large-sensor compact: Digital Photography Review
    So does Thom: Fujifilm X100 Camera Review

    So how? Just by plain reading of the term "compact", it's debatable whether the X100 is indeed "compact". If you're talking about a large camera bag, sureeee it's compact. If you're talking about a jeans pocket I'm afraid not, unless you're a rapper or something. Everything's relative, isn't it?

    Life's too short (which is relative as well). Let's just clarify what we all meant factually without trying to outdo each other or something. Cheers!
    Last edited by edutilos-; 14th March 2012 at 05:36 PM.

  6. #46

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by sinned79 View Post
    read again dude. highlighted in BOLD.

    and guess which year Canon 450D was released? I bet compacts back in those years is no comparable to entry level DSLR at high ISOs.

    and the recent years, compacts is chasing up but there is still disparity as majority of these compacts still lose out to DSLR.

    at your rudimentary level, u also need to learn how to read carefully.
    My last reply on this issue:

    "although these compact cameras are catching up" implies they're still lagging behind, which is what I'm disagreeing to. IMO the X100 has already caught up, though many might not agree with me. The "few years back" portion is largely irrelevant because your first statement is "the most distinctive IS ISO", the "IS" showing what is factually correct at the present.

    That you are referring to "basic compacts" appears to be an afterthought because the word "basic" doesn't appear in your original post.

    Anyway I agree with Edutilos. Let's not quibble over semantics, and definitely not get worked up. This is a photography forum.
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  7. #47
    Senior Member sinned79's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by pbear1973 View Post
    My last reply on this issue:

    "although these compact cameras are catching up" implies they're still lagging behind, which is what I'm disagreeing to. IMO the X100 has already caught up, though many might not agree with me. The "few years back" portion is largely irrelevant because your first statement is "the most distinctive IS ISO", the "IS" showing what is factually correct at the present.

    That you are referring to "basic compacts" appears to be an afterthought because the word "basic" doesn't appear in your original post.

    Anyway I agree with Edutilos. Let's not quibble over semantics, and definitely not get worked up. This is a photography forum.
    X100 is compact but definitely not a compact camera in my sense. I never consider such cameras as compacts especially one that uses a APS-C sensor.

    These are compacts:
    Compact cameras - Canon Singapore - Personal

    It's back to school for you.


    Source - http://dondavisphotography.blogspot....ze-charts.html

    Larger sensors always wins. This is the FACT.

    Your definition of compact and mine differs. So I am right so are you. You can disagree with me, I can also laff at your poor reading skills.

    That's life.
    Last edited by sinned79; 14th March 2012 at 06:04 PM.

  8. #48

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by sinned79 View Post
    X100 is compact but definitely not a compact camera in my sense. I never consider such cameras as compacts especially one that uses a APS-C sensor.

    These are compacts:
    Compact cameras - Canon Singapore - Personal

    Your definition of compact and mine differs. So I am right so are you. You can disagree with me, I can also laff at your poor reading skills.

    That's life.
    Now now, there's no need to get personal. Besides, one can argue that my reading skills are poor, or that your posting was unclear in some aspects. Let's move on.

    Ok now this is really my FINAL posting on the matter. Reminds me of those lovers who keep saying "bye bye" but never hang up.

    Addendum: Now that you've edited your post to tell me that it's "back to school" for me, seems like it's going to be the case for the folks at Fuji and DPReview. And strangely enough, the people at Canon, who call the G1X (with a sensor a little bit larger than the m43) a "digital compact camera"

    http://usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/p...powershot_g1_x
    Last edited by pbear1973; 14th March 2012 at 06:13 PM.
    Stuff I'm reasonably proud of: http://www.flickr.com/photos/ctky1973/

  9. #49

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Take a chill pill, imho, I dont think this is worth quarrelling for, esp in front of a newbie in the forum.

    Sinn-bro, by saying going back to school for him is as if saying he is unlearned.

    All photographers have a bit of pride in their knowledge/skills as well.

  10. #50
    Senior Member shierwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    Any where to reccommend? where they have cheap prices and are willing to let u test the product out?
    I have boon shopping for my audio equiptments at Adalphi and see some camera shops there?
    issit reccommended to purchace my DSLR there?
    See Post #1 for suggested shops to look at the cameras that you are keen. They allow testing.......

    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/price...re-2011-a.html

    Or buy 2nd hand set from B&S to try you hand on DSLR photography. Can always sell away if the DSLR is not your cup of tea.

    Link below are articles for you to read and understand the subject of photogrpahy...

    Articles and Guides

  11. #51

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by shierwin View Post
    See Post #1 for suggested shops to look at the cameras that you are keen. They allow testing.......

    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/price...re-2011-a.html

    Or buy 2nd hand set from B&S to try you hand on DSLR photography. Can always sell away if the DSLR is not your cup of tea.

    Link below are articles for you to read and understand the subject of photogrpahy...

    Articles and Guides
    I've gotten some great purchases from BnS, but usual rules of "buyer beware" apply. One current thread on this topic:

    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/consu...er-linmei.html

    I don't know if Linmei is really dishonest or it's just a misunderstanding, but the thread does have useful tips about BnS.
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  12. #52
    Senior Member sinned79's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pbear1973



    Addendum: Now that you've edited your post to tell me that it's "back to school" for me, seems like it's going to be the case for the folks at Fuji and DPReview. And strangely enough, the people at Canon, who call the G1X (with a sensor a little bit larger than the m43) a "digital compact camera"

    http://usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/p...powershot_g1_x
    Move on dude.

    I am here talking how sensor size.

    While here u are talking about size of camera.

    When ts ask why u should buy a DSLR over normal camera. Obviously he is refering to a normal point and shoot. And before you butt in to disagree, when i say compact i nvr refer to size of camera but rather a DSLR technical specification in particular sensor size producing better ISO capabilities over a point and shoot (normal camera as TS calls it).

    X100 have a APS-C sensor which is equivalent to a Canon crop camera. I wasnt even comparing this way in the first place! Now get the drift?


    We will never come to an understanding when we are of different wave lengths.

    By telling u to go back to school. Is to ask u to read about the sensor of the sensor and its impact on ISO to understand my original post.

    Large sensor produces better ISO capabilities vs smaller sensor produces less ISO capabilities.

    Right? Wrong? u decide.

    Shooting at ISO 1600 using a DSLR comparing a ISO 1600 using point and shoot. Which is cleaner and better? i had really to use point in shoot in case u are reading too much into it as a compact (size) camera.

    One possible reason why fuji classifies x100 as compact can be due to its size. But in reality, its technical specification is equivalent to a canon crop DSLR camera. And thats far superior when u compare with a normal point and shoot, i dun care a hoot about x100 vs D7K cos that wasn't TS asking in the first place. And you dun pay 1000s to buy a normal camera like x100! You pay significant lesser for a point and shoot COMPACT camera.
    Last edited by sinned79; 14th March 2012 at 08:47 PM.

  13. #53

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.

  14. #54

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Any way one more question. Since im thinking of going overseas, and the DSLR is really bulky. i was thinking if its worth the dragging and carrying around.

  15. #55

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.
    Not a bad camera, nice and light, with not so many confusing buttons and dials. I believe it comes with the 18-55 kit lens? You might want to see if that's enough for you. Otherwise you can also just buy an 18-105 from the BnS section, should be a few there.

    I don't really like the viewfinder though, a but too small and dark for me. But if you're going to be shooting mostly in liveview mode (i.e. with LCD) you're all set. In any case VF is a personal preference.

    The other thing is that the D3100 can only autofocus with AF-S lenses, the ones with the internal motor. AF lenses work fine too but you need to manual-focus.
    Something you want to remember when you start buying lenses.
    Stuff I'm reasonably proud of: http://www.flickr.com/photos/ctky1973/

  16. #56

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.
    short answer is if you like it just buy it and go out and shoot! and enjoy shooting!

    the long answer is that as you have seen in this thread (not to mention the unlimited threads online) that all these equipment discussions never end haha... every camera has it's pros and cons, and we have not touched on every lens/flash/filter/tripod etc etc etc has it's pros and cons... and aaargh which shops in funan has it's pros and cons
    it's a chicken a egg question... you only discover what you want after trying it out, then you can make a slightly more informed decision, then try out more things to see if that's what you want. And trying out DSLR can get quite expensive quickly

    on a quick note I suggest when you are deciding your budget factor in buying a dry cabinet (starts from around $100), extra battery (non-orginal ones start from around $20) and tripod (range wildly from less than 100 to thousands). Maybe after thinking about these you may think twice =p

    and just saw your post about bulkiness... that's really important, cos the best camera is the camera that you're carrying

    Finally, I think since you have so many questions (and started another thread hehe) you should seriously consider doing it one step at a time. Get a compact with manual controls (I suggest something like Canon S100 or equivalent since you already have the budget), learn about the manual controls then move on from there =)

  17. #57
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.
    i went to japan with a d3100 you can see the pictures here
    btw you will have to know your camera well to make full use of it.
    and also composition

    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/revie...ield-test.html

  18. #58
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    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.
    not sure, not a fan of d3100.

    i would still recommend the d90.
    Stirring up emotions with pics - cyliew

  19. #59

    Default Re: Can any one gove me a brief explanation as to how a DSLR excells over a normal ca

    Quote Originally Posted by georgiee View Post
    HI guys, its me again.
    Yes ive gone down to funan yesterday during my free time and took a look at some camaras, The shop owner roccommended me the Nikon D3100 which i thought was pretty sleek with its LCD screen, and the auto focus, gets its focus pretty quickly as well.
    Most importants is that its quite cheap.
    So how do you guys think of this camera.
    I would not buy it... It's an older model, and no built-in AF motor. If I'm on a budget I'd rather get Pentax/Sony, more value for money and the same sensor as the Nikon cameras.
    Alpha

  20. #60
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rashkae

    I would not buy it... It's an older model, and no built-in AF motor. If I'm on a budget I'd rather get Pentax/Sony, more value for money and the same sensor as the Nikon cameras.
    Sorry, a little OT.

    Welcome back Rashkae

    As a step above PnS, D3100 is great. Price point is good but the AF motor that Rashkae pointed out is valid. You have to weight your needs and what the camera can provide. How far are you into photography?

    How much more control beyond PASM do you need? How much more convenient you wish to have? What other features u are looking for beyond just taking a picture? Vari-angle LCD? All these are what better DSLR can provide over entry levels like D3100.
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