Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: "Sungei Bishan"

  1. #1

    Default "Sungei Bishan"

    1. What area is the critique to be sought?
    Composition, B&W processing & exposure control in particular, but all comments are welcome & appreciated!

    2. What one's hope to achieve with the piece of work?
    I hope to be able express the beauty & sense of tranquility that the "refurbished" canal-turned-river/stream in Bishan Park brings to the surrounding housing in the area.

    3. Under what circumstances is the picture taken? (physical conditions/emotions)
    Shortly after sunset during "blue hour". The sunset itself was a washout due to cloudy conditions, but for a short while after the sun dipped below the horizon the sky turned beautifully blue & the clouds turned pink.

    4. What the critique seeker personally thinks of the picture?
    IMHO the composition is decent enough, although the numerous bright street lamps in the middle of the frame is kinda distracting. The exposure could also have been controlled better as some of the building lights were blown out. The long exposure also lead to some IR leakage (I think), leading to a significant magenta cast which I was unable to correct fully in post. Hence the B&W conversion.


  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    2,522

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    B&W photographs are processed as such because they were shot with B&W in mind, not to be confused with a last gasp effort to rescue an image. Please go analyse what makes B&W photographs work and think about your own photograph in B&W.

    How about you post the coloured version for comparison, we can advise how to knock out the magenta cast.

  3. #3

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    You're right of course that B&W processing is a different ball game altogether & I'm a total newbie when it comes to B&W photography. I just know that people usually do B&W to emphasize textures & tonality by removing colours from the image. Not quite sure I can see in B&W yet.

    Anyhow, I agonized long & hard before posting the B&W version. However, it seems that most people I've shown the image to prefer the colour version. So here goes nothing.


  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    2,522

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    IR leakage? What's that?
    Are you using a ND filter? That can explain for the colour shift, especially the poorer brands.
    There is also noticeable camera shake since not even all the buildings are sharp. This is shot from the MacD bridge in Bishan Park right? It's wooden so there's bound to be vibrations from passer bys if not yourself from shifting weight.

    Technicalities aside, it's a rather unpleasant foreground interest, meaning it's all dark and featureless. The "stars" are pretty distracting. And you don't need to use a ND filter to prolong exposure to the sky. A simple 3 exposure HDR can complete the photograph easier, vibrations aside.

    Do a rethink on the beauty (where/what is the beauty?) and tranquillity (what/how does tranquillity mean?) concept. Analyse what you want said and not what is there to say. Cheem? Yes photography is cheem if you want to talk about expressing emotions/feelings. Try to do an ordinary simple landscape first. As you understand the technical side more, naturally your artistic side can grow to take advantage of what you can achieve.

  5. #5

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    Quote Originally Posted by foxtwo View Post
    IR leakage? What's that?
    Are you using a ND filter? That can explain for the colour shift, especially the poorer brands.
    There is also noticeable camera shake since not even all the buildings are sharp. This is shot from the MacD bridge in Bishan Park right? It's wooden so there's bound to be vibrations from passer bys if not yourself from shifting weight.

    Technicalities aside, it's a rather unpleasant foreground interest, meaning it's all dark and featureless. The "stars" are pretty distracting. And you don't need to use a ND filter to prolong exposure to the sky. A simple 3 exposure HDR can complete the photograph easier, vibrations aside.

    Do a rethink on the beauty (where/what is the beauty?) and tranquillity (what/how does tranquillity mean?) concept. Analyse what you want said and not what is there to say. Cheem? Yes photography is cheem if you want to talk about expressing emotions/feelings. Try to do an ordinary simple landscape first. As you understand the technical side more, naturally your artistic side can grow to take advantage of what you can achieve.
    First of all, thanks for your honest feedback. It's greatly appreciated. The magenta cast was not caused by ND filters as none were used (no GNDs too). I read somewhere that sometimes with long exposures IR light hitting the sensor can induce colour casts. Seems to affect some cameras more than others - supposedly Canon cameras are more susceptible than Nikon, but I'm using Pentax!

    Noted about the camera shake. You're right abt the wooden bridge & vibrations! I spent the entire duration of this exposure (3 X 30s) vainly weighing down my tripod with my body weight hoping to dampen the vibrations somewhat. Although its not as sharp as I like, thought it was decent enough for web-viewing. Thanks for pointing it out that it was so obvious!

    As for the concept of the shot, I do agree that the execution leaves much to be desired. To be perfectly honest I do not have a fixed idea of what I'm going to shoot before going on location. I more or less go by feel of what calls out to me at the scene. In this case, I decided that the juxtaposition between the stream with the surrounding greenery, and the blocks of HDB in the background was pretty interesting. Personally I felt that the park was beautifully "refurbished" & I felt a sense of peace being in the middle of it all despite the weekend crowd. Sorry to hear that I've failed to bring across that feeling in the image.

    I also completely agree that the "stars" are very distracting & the foreground elements are too dark - might be a matter of poor timing. I also don't think I've found the best vantage point to shoot the "stream" as well - the MacD bridge was just convenient - hoping that other people might have better suggestions with regards to the composition.

    Cheers!

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    2,522

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    I think the moment a man-made structure (HDB, bridge. Okok the stream is man-made too but disregard that) is included into a tranquillity concept the illusion is broken. I've been this site before in the day time. A long time ago when half the park wasn't re-opened yet. It felt kinda nice that a park has a wide stream but that's all I saw, a wide stream with me standing on a bridge over it. I thought, well if I really wanted to shoot I'd have to get down to the water's edge, because sometimes, you don't want to see everything. Though that's really where your concept comes in and what is it you want to say.

    "a sense of peace being in the middle of it all despite the weekend crowd" isn't that problem right there? We the audience can't see the crowd, so how can we make peace within it. I can get what you want to say, it's actually very simple and straightforward, but the composition has to say it, not just you. It's better to have a human element inside a landscape composition if you want to bring about personal emotions. Otherwise just shoot with minimalist style, if you follow how most members here shoot with piers over still waters then that's an easy-A peace & tranquillity concept right there. People doing tai-chi, relaxing, enjoying the park etc, those are all actions which any human can naturally associate peace with. That has more impact then an empty landscape which anything can be assumed by. A pretty picture anyone can make. A meaningful one, only each of us can make.

  7. #7

    Default Re: "Sungei Bishan"

    I really don't think the magenta sky has anything to do with IR. Most likely just WB.
    Light pollution will give you colored clouds and sky. Then you have blue sky, green foreground, park lighting (notice its green) and warm white fluorescent lighting.
    There might not be a way to please the WB on all portions of the photo in this case.
    It can be "zone corrected" with layers and a soft brush eraser in PP if you want of course.

    Colored version looks better. More things are visible and therefore it evens out the compositional balance.
    B/W version, the foreground can't be made out much so adds nothing to the photo. Neither is it near enough to provide more impact.
    Personally, I think the bit of blown highlights in the buildings in no big deal. Its the lack of foreground that is more important to this photo.

    HDR would have helped bring up the foreground or perhaps a black card (or finger of black card) used to limit exposure of the buildings while the exposure is brought up for the stream.

    Look out for the sharpness. As mentioned above, its likely suffering from movement of the bridge.

    my few cents

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by foxtwo
    I think the moment a man-made structure (HDB, bridge. Okok the stream is man-made too but disregard that) is included into a tranquillity concept the illusion is broken. I've been this site before in the day time. A long time ago when half the park wasn't re-opened yet. It felt kinda nice that a park has a wide stream but that's all I saw, a wide stream with me standing on a bridge over it. I thought, well if I really wanted to shoot I'd have to get down to the water's edge, because sometimes, you don't want to see everything. Though that's really where your concept comes in and what is it you want to say.

    "a sense of peace being in the middle of it all despite the weekend crowd" isn't that problem right there? We the audience can't see the crowd, so how can we make peace within it. I can get what you want to say, it's actually very simple and straightforward, but the composition has to say it, not just you. It's better to have a human element inside a landscape composition if you want to bring about personal emotions. Otherwise just shoot with minimalist style, if you follow how most members here shoot with piers over still waters then that's an easy-A peace & tranquillity concept right there. People doing tai-chi, relaxing, enjoying the park etc, those are all actions which any human can naturally associate peace with. That has more impact then an empty landscape which anything can be assumed by. A pretty picture anyone can make. A meaningful one, only each of us can make.
    Thanks again for taking the effort to critique the photo. I guess I've to stop externalizing my own feelings abt the scene & look more carefully abt what is actually in the image. Cheers!

    Quote Originally Posted by pinholecam
    I really don't think the magenta sky has anything to do with IR. Most likely just WB.
    Light pollution will give you colored clouds and sky. Then you have blue sky, green foreground, park lighting (notice its green) and warm white fluorescent lighting.
    There might not be a way to please the WB on all portions of the photo in this case.
    It can be "zone corrected" with layers and a soft brush eraser in PP if you want of course.

    Colored version looks better. More things are visible and therefore it evens out the compositional balance.
    B/W version, the foreground can't be made out much so adds nothing to the photo. Neither is it near enough to provide more impact.
    Personally, I think the bit of blown highlights in the buildings in no big deal. Its the lack of foreground that is more important to this photo.

    HDR would have helped bring up the foreground or perhaps a black card (or finger of black card) used to limit exposure of the buildings while the exposure is brought up for the stream.

    Look out for the sharpness. As mentioned above, its likely suffering from movement of the bridge.

    my few cents
    Thanks for the technical pointers pinholecam! Manually blending in another longer exposure for the dark FG would certainly have helped - it was really much darker than the buildings at the back. Will take note next time. Cheers!

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •