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Thread: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

  1. #41
    Moderator ed9119's Avatar
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    today news reports that a Maybank customer also got $1600 stolen in November too .....
    shaddap and just shoot .... up close
    Walkeast

  2. #42
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

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  3. #43

    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Never trust the bank to protect your money.

    Protect your ATM card now by doing the following :
    1) Change your PIN code now and also once every 3 months. Inconvenient and troublesome ? Well ... better safe than sorry.
    2) Disable withdrawal option of ATM card in foreign country.
    3) Reduce the maximum withdrawal limit of your ATM card to a comfortable and yet practical level . Perhaps $100 or $200.
    4) May be a little safer to use those ATM located within the bank branches itself.
    5) Cover the PIN code numeric key pad with your hand while keying it in.

    Some questions for DBS to answer :
    1) Is the 2 ATM the only compromised ones or are there more ?
    2) As almost 700 bank accounts were affected. Were all of them from the 2 affected ATMs ?
    3) Were the CCTV on the 2 ATMs switched on and working ? If not , why not ?
    4) Does the bank physically check all the local ATMs in Singapore for skimming devices everyday ?
    5) Could it be a inside job especially with more foreigners being hired in recent years ?

    The above are just my personal view points and suggestions only.


  4. #44
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    Never trust the bank to protect your money.
    Nice one, Rocky.
    Not only that, they sold high notes and minibonds to some unfortunate account holders.

    Jokes aside, I do agree that we have some personal responsibility to prevent being scammed by ATM skimmers.

    If indeed it is later concluded by the Police and the Court that there was no internal bank involvement, then DBS/POSB is being VERY generous in immediately reimbursing the lost money. Now the amount is up to a total of $1 Million.
    Last edited by ricohflex; 14th January 2012 at 09:26 AM.

  5. #45
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    2) Disable withdrawal option of ATM card in foreign country.
    3) Reduce the maximum withdrawal limit of your ATM card to a comfortable and yet practical level . Perhaps $100 or $200.
    Maybe it works for uncles with small salary and small amounts to withdraw. Changing the limits is not done immediately which will impact you the moment you need to do larger transactions. Not all shops have Nets terminals.
    DBS offers SMS alerts for transactions, use this instead to get alerted about large transactions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    2) As almost 700 bank accounts were affected. Were all of them from the 2 affected ATMs ?
    Accounts are not allocated to ATM. Accounts are allocated to branches (still a bit weird given the capabilities of current IT and the size of Singapore).
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    4) Does the bank physically check all the local ATMs in Singapore for skimming devices everyday ?
    Unlikely. Best guess could be that there will be routine checks when the cash containers are changed / refilled.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    5) Could it be a inside job especially with more foreigners being hired in recent years ?
    Xenophobia? The bank has to do security checks on all staff, regardless where they come from. The incidents in Europe have shown that it doesn't require any inside jobs. All equipment, software and material is available, legally and free.
    EOS

  6. #46
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky78 View Post
    Never trust the bank to protect your money.
    Contractually, once you deposit your money, it is no longer yours. The bank owns you a debt in return.
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  7. #47
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by 9V-Orion Images View Post
    Contractually, once you deposit your money, it is no longer yours. The bank owns you a debt in return.
    If the bank owes you a debt then the money is still yours Otherwise there wouldn't be any reason for owing the money. There was an interesting article in ST print version some days ago.
    EOS

  8. #48

    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    There was an article on New York Times that depicted some of the most unscrupulous practices Goldman Sachs, a major US bank, is known for. They sold their customers products that drew their base from subprime loans, and then they bet that they would lose, and lose the customers did.

    See, the moral of the story is that the truth is the small investor has very little rights. If you invest, do note that like gambling, the floor works against you.

  9. #49

    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Look that the following 2 webpage and all of us will be worry .


    All the Banks came out with the new Credit Cards/ATM cards with a built in Chip (RFID)
    and they said that its more secure than the old Swip type
    look at the following webpage and u will know its not safe and its even worst than the old technology

    http://www.pacsafe.com/product_support/RFID/RFIDweb.gif

    And so this company PacSafe came out with a new products that shield your Credit cards and Passport.
    so that your datas will not be read by anyone with a RFiD scanner

    Pacsafe Anti-Theft Bags & Travel Security Products | products | <span style='text-transform:uppercase'>RFID</span>-tec 150

  10. #50
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Pacsafe .. Come on... that's a full load of nonsense and FUD .. and a commercial exploit on top. The chip on the ATM cards is not an RFID chip and the protect your passport from reading you can wrap it into Aluminum foil. Beside this, it needs a bit more than a normal reader to read the data on the chip in passport.
    EOS

  11. #51
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    The Sunday Times, Jitter technology on DBS ATMs at Bugis Street disabled.
    By Magdalen Ng & Robin Chan @ 2012-01-15 T 06:00 +8

    BankInfoSecurity.com, ATM Skimming: How Effective Is Jitter?
    By Tracy Kitten @ 2010-06-21

    I could see why the jitter safeguard was disabled as it take forever for the ATM card to be ejected completely, more often than not I'll simply just jerk the ATM card out rather than waiting for it. DBS/POSB probably received a few complaints regarding this.
    Last edited by 9V-Orion Images; 16th January 2012 at 01:23 PM.
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  12. #52
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Just watched the CNA TV programme Talking Point on bank fraud where they also did a poll.
    But I think they all missed something.

    The Legislation angle.

    Why is Singapore so successful in combating drug trafficking?
    Because we have DEATH PENALTY for drug trafficking above a certain weight.

    In the old days, robbers used to wield parangs and guns to rob banks.
    But often they only could rob whatever amount of money was at the bank branch.
    And robbers who discharge firearms during robbery faced DEATH PENALTY.

    Considering the much bigger amounts stolen in such recent ATM bank frauds, it is time for the Legislation to be reviewed.
    For example - the persons convicted of such ATM fraud crimes will have to face the DEATH PENALTY if the amount cheated exceeds Sing $50,000.
    For amounts stolen between Sing $10,000 to below Sing$50,000, impose 24 strokes of the cane and 50 years jail.

    Why is the current law dealing with ATM bank fraud not effective?
    Because at the back of the fraudsters' minds, they know they will get a slap on the wrist and very short jail sentence and they will be out again in a few years.
    Given the HUGE amonts of money stolen in bank ATM frauds, they have great motivation to try and little disincentive if they fail (very light sentence if caught).
    That is why Singapore has become a favourite target for Sri Lankans, Malaysians and other foreigners to come and try their luck at ATM fraud.

    Why is Singapore's law on drug trafficking so effective?
    Because drug traffickers know they face the DEATH PENALTY.
    Like the Viet drug trafficker from Australia who acted all cute and innocent, hoping to get a presidential pardon from his death sentence.
    Last edited by ricohflex; 17th January 2012 at 10:24 PM.

  13. #53

    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex View Post
    Just watched the CNA TV programme Talking Point on bank fraud where they also did a poll.
    But I think they all missed something.

    The Legislation angle.

    Why is Singapore so successful in combating drug trafficking?
    Because we have DEATH PENALTY for drug trafficking above a certain weight.

    In the old days, robbers used to wield parangs and guns to rob banks.
    But often they only could rob whatever amount of money was at the bank branch.
    And robbers who discharge firearms during robbery faced DEATH PENALTY.

    Considering the much bigger amounts stolen in such recent ATM bank frauds, it is time for the Legislation to be reviewed.
    For example - the persons convicted of such ATM fraud crimes will have to face the DEATH PENALTY if the amount cheated exceeds Sing $50,000.
    For amounts stolen between Sing $10,000 to below Sing$50,000, impose 24 strokes of the cane and 50 years jail.

    Why is the current law dealing with ATM bank fraud not effective?
    Because at the back of the fraudsters' minds, they know they will get a slap on the wrist and very short jail sentence and they will be out again in a few years.
    Given the HUGE amonts of money stolen in bank ATM frauds, they have great motivation to try and little disincentive if they fail (very light sentence if caught).
    That is why Singapore has become a favourite target for Sri Lankans, Malaysians and other foreigners to come and try their luck at ATM fraud.

    Why is Singapore's law on drug trafficking so effective?
    Because drug traffickers know they face the DEATH PENALTY.
    Like the Viet drug trafficker from Australia who acted all cute and innocent, hoping to get a presidential pardon from his death sentence.
    the death penalty is not something you should talk about so casually.

  14. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex
    Just watched the CNA TV programme Talking Point on bank fraud where they also did a poll.
    But I think they all missed something.

    The Legislation angle.

    Why is Singapore so successful in combating drug trafficking?
    Because we have DEATH PENALTY for drug trafficking above a certain weight.

    In the old days, robbers used to wield parangs and guns to rob banks.
    But often they only could rob whatever amount of money was at the bank branch.
    And robbers who discharge firearms during robbery faced DEATH PENALTY.

    Considering the much bigger amounts stolen in such recent ATM bank frauds, it is time for the Legislation to be reviewed.
    For example - the persons convicted of such ATM fraud crimes will have to face the DEATH PENALTY if the amount cheated exceeds Sing $50,000.
    For amounts stolen between Sing $10,000 to below Sing$50,000, impose 24 strokes of the cane and 50 years jail.

    Why is the current law dealing with ATM bank fraud not effective?
    Because at the back of the fraudsters' minds, they know they will get a slap on the wrist and very short jail sentence and they will be out again in a few years.
    Given the HUGE amonts of money stolen in bank ATM frauds, they have great motivation to try and little disincentive if they fail (very light sentence if caught).
    That is why Singapore has become a favourite target for Sri Lankans, Malaysians and other foreigners to come and try their luck at ATM fraud.

    Why is Singapore's law on drug trafficking so effective?
    Because drug traffickers know they face the DEATH PENALTY.
    Like the Viet drug trafficker from Australia who acted all cute and innocent, hoping to get a presidential pardon from his death sentence.
    Not that we can't, but we shouldn't be using death penalty as an approach to stop crime. I believe when drugs are placed on extreme measures, one possible reason is the danger of drugs and how it can spread so much into a society and break it. The effects can potentially go into numerous generations, and also across all ages.

    Quote: 砍头的生意有人做,赔钱的生意没人 。as long as it is profitable, someone will risk it. Same goes for all crimes, death penalty may work, but it will also have impact to the society. Using it casually will inevitability cause people to question, do the country need to resort to death to solve problem.

    Given that we have capital sentence, it already raise eye browns in some countries, using it across more crimes will raise more concern.
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  15. #55
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex View Post
    Just watched the CNA TV programme Talking Point on bank fraud where they also did a poll.
    But I think they all missed something.

    The Legislation angle.

    Why is Singapore so successful in combating drug trafficking?
    Because we have DEATH PENALTY for drug trafficking above a certain weight.

    In the old days, robbers used to wield parangs and guns to rob banks.
    But often they only could rob whatever amount of money was at the bank branch.
    And robbers who discharge firearms during robbery faced DEATH PENALTY.

    Considering the much bigger amounts stolen in such recent ATM bank frauds, it is time for the Legislation to be reviewed.
    For example - the persons convicted of such ATM fraud crimes will have to face the DEATH PENALTY if the amount cheated exceeds Sing $50,000.
    For amounts stolen between Sing $10,000 to below Sing$50,000, impose 24 strokes of the cane and 50 years jail.

    Why is the current law dealing with ATM bank fraud not effective?
    Because at the back of the fraudsters' minds, they know they will get a slap on the wrist and very short jail sentence and they will be out again in a few years.
    Given the HUGE amonts of money stolen in bank ATM frauds, they have great motivation to try and little disincentive if they fail (very light sentence if caught).
    That is why Singapore has become a favourite target for Sri Lankans, Malaysians and other foreigners to come and try their luck at ATM fraud.

    Why is Singapore's law on drug trafficking so effective?
    Because drug traffickers know they face the DEATH PENALTY.
    Like the Viet drug trafficker from Australia who acted all cute and innocent, hoping to get a presidential pardon from his death sentence.
    Death penalty, unlike prison term, cannot be reversed. Once applied, there is no way back. Do you want to see the parents telling them that their son was killed by the government accidentally and the real culprit will be hanged tomorrow? Human are not free of any failure and misjudgement - and that's the reason why many countries have removed the death penalty from the civil code. There is no "Oh, paiseh.." when it comes to such judgements. Singapore has yet to show the maturity of the legal system in following these examples.
    Your logic is already flawed. The success in catching offenders is not related at all to the expected or designated form of punishment. Unless you see death penalty still as a form of public entertainment as in medieval age... but the coverage in ST is quite limited.
    Instead of focusing to quickly remove offenders from the Earth's surface we have to focus on the reason and underlying causes for crimes. Nobody is born a criminal, there are no Crime Genes (although LKY still believes in such things, proven wrong by current research).
    Your call for death penalty reminds me of those regions in Afghanistan and other areas stricken by poverty and low education level: they only know Draconian punishments like chopping of hands, ears, nose .. or the entire head.
    EOS

  16. #56

    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    Quote Originally Posted by ricohflex View Post
    Just watched the CNA TV programme Talking Point on bank fraud where they also did a poll.
    But I think they all missed something.

    The Legislation angle.

    Why is Singapore so successful in combating drug trafficking?
    Because we have DEATH PENALTY for drug trafficking above a certain weight.

    In the old days, robbers used to wield parangs and guns to rob banks.
    But often they only could rob whatever amount of money was at the bank branch.
    And robbers who discharge firearms during robbery faced DEATH PENALTY.

    Considering the much bigger amounts stolen in such recent ATM bank frauds, it is time for the Legislation to be reviewed.
    For example - the persons convicted of such ATM fraud crimes will have to face the DEATH PENALTY if the amount cheated exceeds Sing $50,000.
    For amounts stolen between Sing $10,000 to below Sing$50,000, impose 24 strokes of the cane and 50 years jail.

    Why is the current law dealing with ATM bank fraud not effective?
    Because at the back of the fraudsters' minds, they know they will get a slap on the wrist and very short jail sentence and they will be out again in a few years.
    Given the HUGE amonts of money stolen in bank ATM frauds, they have great motivation to try and little disincentive if they fail (very light sentence if caught).
    That is why Singapore has become a favourite target for Sri Lankans, Malaysians and other foreigners to come and try their luck at ATM fraud.

    Why is Singapore's law on drug trafficking so effective?
    Because drug traffickers know they face the DEATH PENALTY.
    Like the Viet drug trafficker from Australia who acted all cute and innocent, hoping to get a presidential pardon from his death sentence.
    Hello, Mr. Taliban.

  17. #57
    Member 9V-Orion Images's Avatar
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    Default Re: DBS/POSB Security Compromised

    New addition to counter skimmers attempting to record personal PIN. Polarised cover over the keypad.

    Simple yet effective. Surprised it took so long for this to be implemented.



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