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Thread: Me moving backwards?

  1. #41
    Senior Member Pablo's Avatar
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    I have a Fuji F810 for pocket use. It takes great photo's in auto mode.
    I use it when I can in manual (time for shot permitting)
    It is enjoyable to drive in manual mode sometimes.
    If the results are good taken either way, once printed, who knows which
    If someone cares to ask, I am happy to tell them.... do you think they are going to care any way if it is a good take.
    Time, is an effortless construction :)

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by student
    1 One can take good pictures with totally manual or totally automatic (does not matter whether it is digital or film - digital of course allows "more" shots and instant reviews.

    2 While one may compose pictures in the mind, you still have to transfer that image to the camera viewfinder. Do not kid yourself that because you can see great images, you can necessary make great images. They are completely different things.

    3 There is absolutely wrong with modern marvels.

    4 What is "wrong" is the people who use these marvels. Because it is easy to take reasonable pictures with current cameras, the mind tend to laziness. Contrast with photographers like Michael Reichmann, schooled in the tradition of view cameras and darkroom, now an enthusiatic advocate for the digital medium. His photos are good. He has already mastered the fundamentals. How many who start with modern cameras ever had their foundations solidly established?

    5 Totally manual cameras are not magical equipment. Because they are devoid of computer assistance, they force the photogs to decide on the why and how of exposure. They have no choice.

    Much have been said that you can put your modern cameras like my Canon 1V to fully manual mode. I just wonder how many have the will power to do so.

    6 Comparing photography with things like travelling in cars instead of carts is not appropriat in my opinion. Photography is also about cultivating the heart and mind. But when the camera takes over, how much of the final product is yours? and how much the computer chips? (film or digital)

    7 The so-called liberation offers by modern equipment is in my opinion an illusion. It in fact traps you in its seduction, offeringmore features that you find so hard to resist. And takes over. Think again.

    8 Nobody asks one to coat his own plates or go back to pinhole! The idea is that manual camera, in its very nature FORCES you to decide, rather than the camera deciding for you. People comes from different background. Some like Reichmann, having master the fundamentals, found modern equipments liberating. But I suspect lesser people will be trapped by these modern things and end up in mediocrity.
    Answer to no. 5: Me, ME!!! I've been using manual whenever I can... only when I need something quick without turning an array of dials and knobs then Av... I think I'd be better at learning exposure creatively using a camera that does not allow me to relax... A manual camera is something like a test: you can do it, but there is no answer page ie. Av or the auto modes.... The auto modes are just like classwork, the camera will help you out...

    All in all, I think a manual camera does force one to learn exposure etc etc the hard way but I believe that with the learning comes with the speed of judgement of light and the situation so it does not mean that with a manual camera you'll be slowed down right?

    Cheers,
    Nick
    The equipment can only bring you so far - the rest of the photographic journey is done by you.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo
    I have a Fuji F810 for pocket use. It takes great photo's in auto mode.
    I use it when I can in manual (time for shot permitting)
    It is enjoyable to drive in manual mode sometimes.
    If the results are good taken either way, once printed, who knows which
    If someone cares to ask, I am happy to tell them.... do you think they are going to care any way if it is a good take.
    I think being part of the picture taking process is really part of the joy of seeing your great photo taken and showing it to others... The others may not know or care how you took the picture, but at least you [the photographer] knew that you were playing a big role in the picture taking process right?
    The equipment can only bring you so far - the rest of the photographic journey is done by you.

  4. #44
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    From what I read I felt if you were to get a small format manual camera, you still will be left to wonder are you moving in the right direction. For me if I want speed, spontaneous, candy or the decisive moment then it is digital.

    Which digital SLR are not offering what a manual small format film camera can do. Just operate every thing manually, switch off the stuff that you felt are stopping you to have control. The only different is if you like to manually load your film. Then get a lecia rangefinder, you have plenty of fun, people shoot a entire roll you be still loading film.

    But to have total control where you control every thing even where the lens board and film board should be. To have ulimate in picture viewing quality. And finally pure photo making pleasure just you, the subject and the camera. Then large format is the way to go. No small format could offer these. The limit the small format camera (film, digital, auto or manual) have, will offer you no new direction. Or may it will offer more manual labour.

    Just my opinion and my 0.02

  5. #45

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    IMHO,

    i think it's very stupid to buy a DSLR/SLR and use full manual mode on it... since (forgive me if i'm wrong) most people buy them for the AUTOMATION.

    i'm not shy to say, yeah i use aperture priority and shutter priority and hardly any manual modes. but well, i get my shots, as long as i'm happy with it i'm happy with it. if i really want to do fully manual i might as well get a fully manual camera.

    yeah i do use manual focus on my SLR though, that's when i can focus faster by hand than if i use AF (i.e. on non-USM lenses).. otherwise, nah.

  6. #46
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    Well it is very SMART to spend extra $ on a new manual camera that something the his "AUTOMATIC" camera can do? Which in fact he has one of the best DSLR that do almost anything except brew coffee. Oh I see you only use a camera to do manual stuff like manual focus and manual expose control because it is lable "MANUAL" camera WOW SO SMART!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHa Then all I can say BUY BUY BUY BUY if you follow the joker advise

  7. #47

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    i think you need to understand english a little bit more first.

    read my earlier post.

  8. #48

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    If you can't "see", you think changing cameras will help you?

  9. #49

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    If you can't "see", you think changing cameras will help you?

  10. #50
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    y not just stop buying anymore equipment and make full use of ur current set up?

    i'm sure with ur current equipment,they should last u many yrs...

  11. #51

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    It is not the equipment! Manual or Auto-everything! (Please note: Either film or digital. My Canon 1V is an all singing all dancing piece of wonder equipment)

    It is the MINDSET!!!!!

    Unless one is disciplined, an "autoeverything" camera have the tendency (Note: real world behaviour) to make one lazy. The "dedicated" manual camera (taken to its logical conclusion - the view camera) FORCES you to make many decisions. YES!!! You can do that with a good autoeverything camera. But in the real world, do you. Just read this thread and you will find that those who have such electronic marvels do not (or at least not often) use them in total manual mode. I don't! I use my Canon 1V mostly in aperture priority mode and I love its impressive focussing ability. But my view camera forces me to decide on every aspect of the image making. I am absolutely sure many with autoeverything cameras can and do make better images than I can. The end point IS important. But the process of thinking throught the entire image making process, of working through the craft of making that image do, I feel, teach me about how to see better, and how to put those fantastic images seen in my eyes, and captured and stored in the brain, into a printed image which reflects a little of who I am and how I feel.

  12. #52

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    i'm curious, how different is a photo taken with a mf camera from a photo taken with a af camera?

    ~MooEy~

  13. #53

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    hey come on, ya pple are taking it all too serious.
    unless ya're going to do it for a living.
    it's all for the fun of it.
    ya want to move on, ya know what's wrong already? so 'just DO it'

    have fun manz.

    (ahaha, this thread is driving me nuts just reading the responds.)

  14. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by MooEy
    i'm curious, how different is a photo taken with a mf camera from a photo taken with a af camera?

    ~MooEy~
    I am not sure of the intent of this question. But here goes.

    The issue is NOT whether a picture taken with a manual camera is different from a auto camera (not just autofocus - BTW I switch off the autofocus mechanism in my camera. I find it easier to have selective focus by focussing manually. If I want to track a running toddler, I will use the autofocus).

    The issue is that the lack of automation FORCES me to deliberate the image making process, and in the process, I believe, I improve.

    AS AN EXAMPLE, if I set my camera to aperture priority mode say at f5.6, the TENDENCY is that for THAT shoot, the pictures will be taken at F5.6. However, if the light changes, the shutter speed may drop to say 1/30, and result in unsharp image. Of course the experienced photographer may realise this and change the aperture to f2.8. This illustrate my point that to an experienced photographer, any camera can be used to take great pictures. But a novice, especially one whose photography experience is carved on the lastest electronic gadjets, may not realise this.

    However when you use a manual camera, and have to turn the dials, you will realise immediately that you are shooting at 1/30. Well, if one use his mind, the danger of unsharp images is clear. So he changes the aperture to allow for a better chance of a clear image.

  15. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by tucker
    hey come on, ya pple are taking it all too serious.
    unless ya're going to do it for a living.
    it's all for the fun of it.
    ya want to move on, ya know what's wrong already? so 'just DO it'

    have fun manz.

    (ahaha, this thread is driving me nuts just reading the responds.)
    I do photography all for the fun of it. I also do photography to improve myself. I do photography to try to make meaningful images. But I want to maximise my "investment" with my time. So I think carefully on how and why I do things in a certain way.

    Others may differ. It is OK.

  16. #56

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    ok, i get the point, seems like i have not been paying attention to alot of stuff recently. getting lazy already.

    ~MooEy~

  17. #57
    Senior Member denniskee's Avatar
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    I was setting up to take night shot of CBD on the bridge 1yr back (EOS 50). A tourist using a full manual camera told me I have a good camera and ask me whats my setting, I told him a I shooting F8, but will have to check to see the shuttle speed my camera tells me. He smile and told me again I have a good camera and walk off. I felt so very embarrass. Its like those scify movie by robots had taken over the world.

    Thats when I realise I dont have the fundimentle of photography.

    Its a sound to advice a person who wants to climb mountain (or tough environment), taking photos @ the summit, to bring a full manual camera. But years down the road, it looks like piece of advice will no longer be sound.Most people will not be able to handle manual camera, because they cant view the shots taken, should their digital camera breaks down.

    Same as years down the road, most driver cant drive cars with manual gears, since now one can go for driving test with auto-transmittion car (of cause thier licence will be limited to auto-transmittion car). May I have the show of hands, who will be bother to go for another round of test to get the licence for manual geared car.
    photography makes one sees things from all angles.

  18. #58
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    May be I got on the wrong foot. I mean to say is I see there no need to buy another manual small format camera. Just to get the feel of been control of your creative process where you just customize the automatic one to behave like a manual one when you feel like it. The next progression will be going to a large format photography where it is a total different field.

  19. #59
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickmak
    ....I have this urge deep inside to move back to using a manual camera like the Nikon FM3a with manual focus lenses from my fully automated Canon 1DMKII with them superfast USM 'L' lenses blah blah...
    Is there anything to prevent you from using your DSLR like a manual camera?

    I use my Canon 10D only on manaul focus and manual exposure with bracketing and decide which experture I would you on each shot to give me the DOF I desire. As I only do tabletop still life all my digital shots are taken with a cable release and on tripods.

    Don't let a camera dictate how you should shoot.

  20. #60

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    Nick, we have someone who tracked a Common KF (just a small 15cm avian) in-flight at 500mm + 1.4TC on 1.5x crop body, manual focus. Doesn't matter what camera you are using be it dSLR, SLR, MF, rangefinder etc, it's the skill and pics you produce in the end that matters.

    In this case, i don't think the AF of the D2H or your MkII with a fast lens would be sufficiently fast to be able to track it without lady luck having a big investment in it.

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