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Thread: Time to upgrade skill

  1. #1

    Default Time to upgrade skill

    Hi guys,

    I strongly believe in getting your basic skills right and polish before advancing into another level of Digital photography. Such as, understanding how and why is "this picture" being taken/achieve.

    After spending sometime using the following setup, I've come to understand the limitation and what my camera can achieve and cant.
    Currently using canon 550D + batt grip + tamron 17-50mm f2.8 VC, 50mm f1.8.

    After learning about landscape and now I am moving into both indoor/outdoor portrait, I have come to the point where it's time to take up external flash technique, due to the limitation of pop-up flash.

    As such, I like to request for forummers advise on where and how did you pick up your knowledge. I have been reading online but will like to check if there are any other issues which I might or probably have miss out on. Please feel free to advise.

    Initially, I am considering between Canon 580EX II and Canon 430EX II.
    There is intention to upgrade to FF between another 1 to 2 years time.

    I have this concept of getting a 580EX II because that it will be possible to step down on the power output if require and impossible to step-up on the output power of 430EX II.

    But the other consideration is, the size of 580EX II on a cropped body and will the function be fully utilise?

    Hope someone will be able to share your experience or advise on my situation.
    Thank you.
    Canon

  2. #2
    Senior Member UncleFai's Avatar
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    Default

    National Library. Can borrow lots of good books on photography - for free.

  3. #3
    Deregistered allenleonhart's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post
    Hi guys,

    I strongly believe in getting your basic skills right and polish before advancing into another level of Digital photography. Such as, understanding how and why is "this picture" being taken/achieve.

    After spending sometime using the following setup, I've come to understand the limitation and what my camera can achieve and cant.
    Currently using canon 550D + batt grip + tamron 17-50mm f2.8 VC, 50mm f1.8.

    After learning about landscape and now I am moving into both indoor/outdoor portrait, I have come to the point where it's time to take up external flash technique, due to the limitation of pop-up flash.

    As such, I like to request for forummers advise on where and how did you pick up your knowledge. I have been reading online but will like to check if there are any other issues which I might or probably have miss out on. Please feel free to advise.

    Initially, I am considering between Canon 580EX II and Canon 430EX II.
    There is intention to upgrade to FF between another 1 to 2 years time.

    I have this concept of getting a 580EX II because that it will be possible to step down on the power output if require and impossible to step-up on the output power of 430EX II.

    But the other consideration is, the size of 580EX II on a cropped body and will the function be fully utilise?

    Hope someone will be able to share your experience or advise on my situation.
    Thank you.
    get the 580 mk1. for one, it doesnt have the problem of the flash burning with HSS overused due to differences in design. 2ndly, its cheaper, around the same price as 430mk2 on the 2nd hand market. it comes with an inbuilt bounce and diffuser... cant remember if the 430 exII has... its been almost a year since i traded it for the 580mk1.

    to be honest? the only flash technique u might be learning is bounce flash. most of the flash exposure is set by the ETTL, so.... chances are u wont be playing much.

    if u wanna learn more about flash, check out strobist.com. they use manual flashes though most of the time.
    Last edited by allenleonhart; 24th November 2011 at 11:19 AM.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    I think you need to loosen up a little. "Landscape", "Indoor/Outdoor Portraits" etc are not LEVELs in photography, they're different areas of specialisation (if you want to specialise), or different areas of interest. You do not have to master one before moving to another.
    You might want to focus on one area for a while, but this should be more for you to find out if you have feel and liking for that type of photography than to come away with some sort of 'certification of proficiency'.

    Where to learn? How have you been learning till now? Books, as UncleFai said. Outings (where you can learn from/share with others). The Internet has huge amounts of information (need to filter out the noise and misinformation though) -- forums like this one, blogposts, and increasingly Youtube (it's probably easier to learn from video than from text and diagrams, no?)

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post
    Hi guys,
    I strongly believe in getting your basic skills right and polish before advancing into another level of Digital photography. Such as, understanding how and why is "this picture" being taken/achieve.

    After learning about landscape and now I am moving into both indoor/outdoor portrait, I have come to the point where it's time to take up external flash technique, due to the limitation of pop-up flash.

  5. #5

  6. #6
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post
    Initially, I am considering between Canon 580EX II and Canon 430EX II.
    There is intention to upgrade to FF between another 1 to 2 years time.
    Irrelevant. The format factor of the camera has nothing to do with the flash. Both flashes (430 and 580, mark I, II or whatever comes) can be used on all EOS digital systems (and EOS film as well).

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post
    I have this concept of getting a 580EX II because that it will be possible to step down on the power output if require and impossible to step-up on the output power of 430EX II.
    Both flashes can be stepped down in flash power. Whether you need the additional power of the 580 depends on your situation (ambient light, required light from flash for target exposure).

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post
    But the other consideration is, the size of 580EX II on a cropped body and will the function be fully utilise?
    This is not a question of the body but rather your skills.
    For portraits many people do not use the hotshoe flash (only), but rather a combination of hotshoe, reflectors, offshoe or (especially indoors) studio strobes. Usually all these devices are set up manually to determine the amount of light required. The ETTL features of Canon flashes are not required here. That's the reason why cheaper manual flashes (Nissin and others, check Mass Sales) are going well here.
    EOS

  7. #7

    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    read from the internet, its full of useful information.

    and yes, get the 580ex series for its higher output.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    Before buying a flash, you can also try working with reflectors first. They can be a lot more effective in outdoor environments.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    magazines, CLUBSNAP FORUM !! online video tutorials and websites.

    If you are unsure then just get 3rd party flashes such as Yongnuo 565? Got ETTL and other advanced functions at 1/3 the cost of 580II.

  10. #10
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    Have you read the EOS flash Bible?

    Flash Photography with Canon EOS Cameras - Part II.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    There is a youtube review, the code is "watch?v=aQ6fc5XhJD8aQ6fc5XhJD8" (I'm not able to post links yet), which talks about choosing between 580EXII and 430EXII.
    An important point I take away from it is that the 430EXII is significantly lighter, and so would be more portable. Better have a 430EXII which you use more often, than a 580EXII which you leave at home. White card and diffuser, you can improvise, so you don't actually need those features to be in built into the flash.

    Just my 2 cents, I'm also really new to this.
    Last edited by Wizongod; 26th November 2011 at 03:55 PM. Reason: added a little extra info

  12. #12
    Senior Member edutilos-'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    Quote Originally Posted by BrownInu View Post

    I strongly believe in getting your basic skills right and polish before advancing into another level of Digital photography. Such as, understanding how and why is "this picture" being taken/achieve.
    I think I got most of what I understand about photography from looking at good pictures that I liked, that spoke to me.

    I just looked, and I tried to understand. Sometimes, I never understood a photograph even though I liked it, I've looked back at those and I still don't understand.

    We all take away what we want from a photograph... Maybe you could try looking at good pictures and try to understand too. Cheers.

  13. #13

    Default

    I own a 270, 430, 580.
    U can buy 270ex2 first.
    It is as good as the big brother yet compact and light means u will bring out...
    Just get a diffuser for it.
    I use it more often than the other 2...

    Once u can "control" a single flash, get the 580 when u are ready to play with multiple flash setup. Your 270ex2 can be your slave as well as a backup for "lazy day".

    430 is good because of the IR assistant
    So focusing is faster in dim light.
    Or you always shot tele (>55mm)
    Or u have big lens (24-70) with hood on.

    580?
    If u own 1d series, so that IR supports all focus points. Faster recycle than 430.
    Act as master. Else there is more weight ..
    But built quality is really good.
    | 5Diii | 24 ii | 40 | 24-70 ii | 24-105 | 70-200 F4 IS | 270 ii | 600EX-RT |

  14. #14
    Member Kenneth67C's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to upgrade skill

    I'd agree with ahboy that the 270II is a very capable and light flash for portraits and nearby subjects.
    This should fulfil most of your needs.

    If you need more flexibility in bounce, then the 580 or the 430 is a better bet.
    Between the 580 and 430, I'd recommend to go with the highest, because if you want to venture into softboxes and other light modifiers, a powerful flash is preferred.

    As someone mentioned, reflectors are one of your cheapest and best solutions to balancing light and shadow, so set aside some money for that too.
    An artist who realizes there is a supreme force and works gladly as an apprentice under heaven.

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