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Thread: How to convince wife?

  1. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong

    Demanding vs casual.

    Hmm... I'm leaning towards the D7000, but the weight is putting me off. It weighs a ton. Probably gotta do lots of pushups and bicep curls to train.

    And what is demanding and what is casual?

    I'd use the cam to shoot portraits of my wife and friends and family members, and for family gatherings (dinners in restaurants, homes, etc) and holiday trips, which includes scenes.

    Is this demanding or casual?

    Frankly, I dun wanna get a system and then leave it at home most of the time cos of its bulk. And only use it at certain occasions.

    I've seen many many users hanging cams with huge zooms around their necks, and strutting around town or parks with their families. Impeding most of their movements.

    But I love DSLRs, cos of the sharpness and faster focus, etc.

    Casual I would say is ur needs. Mirrorless cameras can certainly take very sharp pictures too, it's dependent on the lens, and strength AA filter. At times I feel the need to unsharpen my pictures?!
    AF the latest Olympus pen boasts faster AF than dslr, and panasonic has always been fast as well. This is more for non tracking AF. Dslr will still win in af tracking speeds. The key is for you to try out to feel what is fast...my 2 cts

  2. #202

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    Quote Originally Posted by wonglp

    Casual I would say is ur needs. Mirrorless cameras can certainly take very sharp pictures too, it's dependent on the lens, and strength AA filter. At times I feel the need to unsharpen my pictures?!
    AF the latest Olympus pen boasts faster AF than dslr, and panasonic has always been fast as well. This is more for non tracking AF. Dslr will still win in af tracking speeds. The key is for you to try out to feel what is fast...my 2 cts
    Oh. AA filter an AF tracking.

    1) AA filter.
    Is it the anti-aliasing filter? Is it in all cams? Can we change it?
    This is the first time I've heard of it.

    2) AF tracking.
    Now that you mention it. Yes I need good AF tracking, especially for my pet dog and my baby, that'd be coming...

  3. #203

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    Demanding vs casual.

    Hmm... I'm leaning towards the D7000, but the weight is putting me off. It weighs a ton. Probably gotta do lots of pushups and bicep curls to train.

    And what is demanding and what is casual?
    for me, its a state of mind. if i FEEL like doing things properly - i.e. bring the full complement of gear necessary, such as body, lens, flash, tripod, etc AND doing PP after the shoot, i will bring a DSLR.

    once i decide on that, i find a way to make it work and i know that i will be making some sacrifices in terms of mobility and aching shoulders at the end of the day. if this is not what i want, then i will not bring so much equipment or i may bring my mirrorless instead of my DSLR.

    for macro shoots, i bring the heavy duty setup. for landscape shoots, i bring the heavy duty setup. for weddings, if i'm asked to be the backup photographer, i bring the heavy duty setup.

    I'd use the cam to shoot portraits of my wife and friends and family members, and for family gatherings (dinners in restaurants, homes, etc) and holiday trips, which includes scenes.

    Is this demanding or casual?
    to me, this is casual. i will bring just the DSLR + 1 lens fixed on only, or the mirrorless.

    Frankly, I dun wanna get a system and then leave it at home most of the time cos of its bulk. And only use it at certain occasions.

    I've seen many many users hanging cams with huge zooms around their necks, and strutting around town or parks with their families. Impeding most of their movements.

    But I love DSLRs, cos of the sharpness and faster focus, etc.
    if u're used to it, it should be fine la. not as if u're lugging a large FF body with a monster 70-200 f2.8 everywhere. get to know your style and invest in equipment that meets your needs.

    it only gets heavy if u bring multiple lenses to change or if u bring a flash. important thing is knowing what u need and know which equipment to carry so u dun make yourself too uncomfortable in the process.

  4. #204

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by detritus View Post
    if u're used to it, it should be fine la. not as if u're lugging a large FF body with a monster 70-200 f2.8 everywhere. get to know your style and invest in equipment that meets your needs.

    it only gets heavy if u bring multiple lenses to change or if u bring a flash. important thing is knowing what u need and know which equipment to carry so u dun make yourself too uncomfortable in the process.
    yup. I think it's getting used to.

    Maybe I'd invest in a cross-shoulder strap, such as the sniper?

    Sometimes it's hard to really plan what lens to bring, or what shots to take. Even the weather may also spoil the "plans".
    I've heard of users that recommend getting a "general" lens that cover the full range of focal lengths... such as the 18-200. But this would sacrifice the quality and sharpness of the pics.

  5. #205

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    yup. I think it's getting used to.

    Maybe I'd invest in a cross-shoulder strap, such as the sniper?

    Sometimes it's hard to really plan what lens to bring, or what shots to take. Even the weather may also spoil the "plans".
    I've heard of users that recommend getting a "general" lens that cover the full range of focal lengths... such as the 18-200. But this would sacrifice the quality and sharpness of the pics.
    i would suggest dun over-do it at first la... just get the body+kit first, then gradually determine what u need and buy accordingly. its an expensive hobby. even if u have lots of spare cash, should think through and spend wisely so u dun end up with lots of unwanted gear

    i really dunno abt superzooms like 18-200. i never found them very useful. the long end, i hardly use. when i want to use it, the max aperture is too small to be really useful, esp in low light conditions.

    as u learn more abt your equipment, u might discover the most common focal range that u use and u'll be able to buy lenses that best suits your needs.

  6. #206

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    Quote Originally Posted by detritus

    i would suggest dun over-do it at first la... just get the body+kit first, then gradually determine what u need and buy accordingly. its an expensive hobby. even if u have lots of spare cash, should think through and spend wisely so u dun end up with lots of unwanted gear

    i really dunno abt superzooms like 18-200. i never found them very useful. the long end, i hardly use. when i want to use it, the max aperture is too small to be really useful, esp in low light conditions.

    as u learn more abt your equipment, u might discover the most common focal range that u use and u'll be able to buy lenses that best suits your needs.
    Yup. Totally makes sense.

    And yes I agree that the apertures too small in such superzooms.

  7. #207
    Member chillicutter's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    Demanding vs casual.

    Hmm... I'm leaning towards the D7000, but the weight is putting me off. It weighs a ton. Probably gotta do lots of pushups and bicep curls to train.

    And what is demanding and what is casual?

    I'd use the cam to shoot portraits of my wife and friends and family members, and for family gatherings (dinners in restaurants, homes, etc) and holiday trips, which includes scenes.

    Is this demanding or casual?

    Frankly, I dun wanna get a system and then leave it at home most of the time cos of its bulk. And only use it at certain occasions.

    I've seen many many users hanging cams with huge zooms around their necks, and strutting around town or parks with their families. Impeding most of their movements.

    But I love DSLRs, cos of the sharpness and faster focus, etc.

    Don worry... after a few outings you will be used to it. I am using D7000 with 17-55 f.2.8 as a everyday lens and I never complained about it's heavy.

    However, I must admit that it's really tedious for me for the first few times of outings but I am ok now.

  8. #208

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    17-55.
    Nice lens. I don't think I could afford this lens, man.

  9. #209

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    17-55.
    Nice lens. I don't think I could afford this lens, man.
    dun have to be first party nikon. can consider the tamron 17-50 f2.8 or the sigma 18-50 f2.8. they are good enough for "casual" shoots. they're not small but the constant f2.8 makes them very useful.

    alternative is to consider primes. but that really depends on your style lah... some pple find it very restricting to not have zoom. i personally find them very useful for some situations.

  10. #210

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    Quote Originally Posted by detritus

    dun have to be first party nikon. can consider the tamron 17-50 f2.8 or the sigma 18-50 f2.8. they are good enough for "casual" shoots. they're not small but the constant f2.8 makes them very useful.

    alternative is to consider primes. but that really depends on your style lah... some pple find it very restricting to not have zoom. i personally find them very useful for some situations.
    Thanks for suggestion.

    Ya. Primes.
    Think I'd get the 50mm and maybe 85, if I can afford it.

    Just been reading a thread on skintones. Very interesting and ... Cheem.
    Realised that it'd be a very long time before I achieve that level. Wow.

    Then again, I'm only using the cam for causal shots.

  11. #211

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    Thanks for suggestion.

    Ya. Primes.
    Think I'd get the 50mm and maybe 85, if I can afford it.

    Just been reading a thread on skintones. Very interesting and ... Cheem.
    Realised that it'd be a very long time before I achieve that level. Wow.

    Then again, I'm only using the cam for causal shots.
    i have very mixed feelings abt 50mm. on FF, its perfect as a "standard" lens. but on a cropped body, i find it a bit long. i find it too tight for indoor spaces. i still like it because the most common fast primes are 50mm but its just not the same. using a 50mm on a cropped body vs a FF body is a bit different.

    imo, on an APS-C body like the D7000, a 30mm or 35mm might be more comfortable as a casual lens

  12. #212
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    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by detritus View Post
    i have very mixed feelings abt 50mm. on FF, its perfect as a "standard" lens. but on a cropped body, i find it a bit long. i find it too tight for indoor spaces. i still like it because the most common fast primes are 50mm but its just not the same. using a 50mm on a cropped body vs a FF body is a bit different.

    imo, on an APS-C body like the D7000, a 30mm or 35mm might be more comfortable as a casual lens
    Yup! I agree. Before I bought 17-55mm, the 35mm f1.8 is my everyday lens and the sharpness is superb for the price at $330. 17-55 images are softer.

    Would recommend you the 35mm as I found that 50mm is a little tight in some situations.

  13. #213

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    Quote Originally Posted by detritus

    i have very mixed feelings abt 50mm. on FF, its perfect as a "standard" lens. but on a cropped body, i find it a bit long. i find it too tight for indoor spaces. i still like it because the most common fast primes are 50mm but its just not the same. using a 50mm on a cropped body vs a FF body is a bit different.

    imo, on an APS-C body like the D7000, a 30mm or 35mm might be more comfortable as a casual lens

    Quote Originally Posted by chillicutter

    Yup! I agree. Before I bought 17-55mm, the 35mm f1.8 is my everyday lens and the sharpness is superb for the price at $330. 17-55 images are softer.

    Would recommend you the 35mm as I found that 50mm is a little tight in some situations.
    Yes. I agree that the 50mm can be rather tight in APS-C cams, considering the 1.5x crop factor for N and 1.6 for C.

    The 35 is more "normal" in a sense, and is wider.

    I've used my friend's D300 with 24mm f1.4, I think. Superb. But too expensive. Ha!!

  14. #214
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    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Oh. AA filter an AF tracking.

    1) AA filter.
    Is it the anti-aliasing filter? Is it in all cams? Can we change it?
    This is the first time I've heard of it.

    - Yes, AA=anti-aliasing which is to reduce moire.
    See more about about moire here and AA filter here
    Most cameras have it, except Leica digital M and Ricoh GXR and Sigma cameras with foveon sensor i think. But if the lens is sharp, really, unless one has pixel peeping and different cameras to compare, it's possibly a non issue esp for newcomers.

    2) AF tracking.
    Now that you mention it. Yes I need good AF tracking, especially for my pet dog and my baby, that'd be coming...


    - Congrats in advance! Hope the camera will bring much memories to your family, now isn't that the BEST reason to convince your wife?
    DSLR can be better, however, running kids are struggle at times even for dslr. Anticipation is possibly important. I anticipate and manual focus my running kids, hit and miss at times...
    Looks like you are set on D7000, good camera to have as long as you are used to it.
    Have fun!
    Last edited by wonglp; 7th December 2011 at 03:33 PM.

  15. #215

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by wonglp View Post

    - Yes, AA=anti-aliasing which is to reduce moire.
    See more about about moire here and AA filter here
    Most cameras have it, except Leica digital M and Ricoh GXR and Sigma cameras with foveon sensor i think. But if the lens is sharp, really, unless one has pixel peeping and different cameras to compare, it's possibly a non issue esp for newcomers.
    Pixel Peeping? Nope, at least not just yet.
    I'm only just started, and there's too many things to focus on. (no pun intended).
    If I wanna pixel peep, I'd most likely do it when I buy very expensive equipment/system. Not worth my time to do it on an APS-C.

    Quote Originally Posted by wonglp View Post

    2) AF tracking.
    Now that you mention it. Yes I need good AF tracking, especially for my pet dog and my baby, that'd be coming...


    - Congrats in advance! Hope the camera will bring much memories to your family, now isn't that the BEST reason to convince your wife?
    DSLR can be better, however, running kids are struggle at times even for dslr. Anticipation is possibly important. I anticipate and manual focus my running kids, hit and miss at times...
    Looks like you are set on D7000, good camera to have as long as you are used to it.
    Have fun!
    Thanks!

    Been reading a lot, as usual. And I've read that overall, C is cheaper than N. both in terms of owning and servicing. Is it true?
    But I've tried C many times before (350D, 400D, 600D) and I didn't like how the pics turned out on the LCD. The owner of these cams said that the pics look much nicer on the computer than in the LCD. But then, why the discrepancy? And I don't like how it feels in my hand....

    HA!!

    Anyways, these are just my personal opinions. Pricing wise... it's cheaper... but...

  16. #216

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong View Post
    Pixel Peeping? Nope, at least not just yet.
    I'm only just started, and there's too many things to focus on. (no pun intended).
    If I wanna pixel peep, I'd most likely do it when I buy very expensive equipment/system. Not worth my time to do it on an APS-C.
    actually, pixel peeping is not worth anyone's time, on any equipment, because it simply detracts from the true spirit of photography. you're missing the woods for the trees.

    of course, it might be different if u're a tech reviewer with a popular and profitable website that's more interested in shooting charts than real-life photography...

    but u might be surprised by the image quality of newer APS-C models (the D7000 for instance)...

    Been reading a lot, as usual. And I've read that overall, C is cheaper than N. both in terms of owning and servicing. Is it true?
    But I've tried C many times before (350D, 400D, 600D) and I didn't like how the pics turned out on the LCD. The owner of these cams said that the pics look much nicer on the computer than in the LCD. But then, why the discrepancy? And I don't like how it feels in my hand....
    poorer quality LCD in lower end models? LCD brightness set too low? anyway, its pointless to judge a pic by how it displays on the camera LCD... as long as u shoot in RAW and learn basic PP, u can make the output from most modern DSLRs look very, very good...

    each brand have their unique product offerings that caters to different user preferences they all have their pros and cons.

  17. #217

    Default Re: How to convince wife?

    Quote Originally Posted by detritus View Post
    actually, pixel peeping is not worth anyone's time, on any equipment, because it simply detracts from the true spirit of photography. you're missing the woods for the trees.

    of course, it might be different if u're a tech reviewer with a popular and profitable website that's more interested in shooting charts than real-life photography...

    but u might be surprised by the image quality of newer APS-C models (the D7000 for instance)...
    Ya. Pixel peeping is really not worth anyone's time. Agreed.


    Quote Originally Posted by detritus View Post
    poorer quality LCD in lower end models? LCD brightness set too low? anyway, its pointless to judge a pic by how it displays on the camera LCD... as long as u shoot in RAW and learn basic PP, u can make the output from most modern DSLRs look very, very good...

    each brand have their unique product offerings that caters to different user preferences they all have their pros and cons.
    Agreed too.
    In fact, I think there's countless threads/forums out there, with each camp flaming each brand. I've seen many hopping from one brand to the next hopping to find/build that illusive perfect system...

    But frankly, I think the LCD quality is really poor in the lower-end C models. But the same range for the N models have very good LCDs. Colours and pic quality on the LCDs are way way better.

    Shooting RAW and learning basic PP... hmm.... I'm not too sure about this. don't really like to process my pics after shooting... I'd shoot and then view them on my com. If I like some pics, maybe I'd pp and then send to process/print.

    I'm not doing this for a living, just so you know.

    But then again, maybe I'd explore and develop some workflow for myself. And probably explore the batch processing features of PS, or something. ... ?

  18. #218

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denniswong

    Shooting RAW and learning basic PP... hmm.... I'm not too sure about this. don't really like to process my pics after shooting... I'd shoot and then view them on my com. If I like some pics, maybe I'd pp and then send to process/print.

    I'm not doing this for a living, just so you know.

    But then again, maybe I'd explore and develop some workflow for myself. And probably explore the batch processing features of PS, or something. ... ?
    Shooting jpeg direct and configuring the jpeg settings from your camera is already a form of pp

    Doing it on a computer with the bundled software or with photoshop just gives you more control over the output.

    I'm not doing it for a living either. But being able to process photos of my baby's photos properly is also highly satisfying to me.

  19. #219

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    Dear all,

    I think we've come to the end of this thread. I'd give another 12 hrs before closing.

    I'd like to take this opportunity to thank you for all your wonderful (and sometimes querky) suggestions and ideas.
    I've learnt a lot from all of you over the last few weeks. Not only how to convince my wife, but what camera to get and some knowledge and advice in DSLRs.

    I'd continue to see you in other threads. And I may also post new threads on some topics which we've discussed in the last few posts.

    Thanks!

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