Live switching.

sundazz · 16th May 2007

Hi DXNMedia,

I have not use that mixer B4, it will be great if i have a chance to experience it.
so far we use MX70, datavideo and sony switcher.. I think MX70 and datavideo is good enough, we used it for some big shows.
But i find sony is abit troublesome as need blackburst to syn the few cams, and need some calibration, tho no doubt that they are smooth.

DXNMedia · 16th May 2007

Well, I've used a range of switchers from the low end Datavideo, Videonics, all the way to the broadcast levels of BTS, Sonys & Grass Valleys.

Can't expect much out of the Edirol V4 other than simple switching, mixing, wipes and PIP/ChromaKeying lar....In fact, I was a bit disappointed after using it for a few small scale shows. I see it as a 2ch switcher with a 4 way selector in each output bus....Duh!

Unlike other boards, this Edirol only have 2 channels of frame sync, ie if I have effects super up, i need to remove super, then preview to the desired cam, then cut to the cam for the take. Extra steps have to be factored into the process unlike the boards like the Datavideo SE-500.

The good point is that the footprint is very small, and the 8bit 4:2:2 video processor gives very solid and crisp image even though my input is composite video..I've scrutinised the other switchers and the output isn't as wonderful even though the specs mentioned that they're using 8bit 4:2:2 processing as well.. You can see evidence of digital processing and aliasing in them.

Review compared to other boards of the same price range:-
Compact size ***** of 5 stars
Quality ***** of 5 stars
Built in Effects ***** of 5 stars
Convenience of Live Switching functions ** of 5 stars

At the end of the day, the most important thing is that it gets the job done.

sundazz · 16th May 2007

hmmm... not so sure abt the quality since i have not use tat b4..
but for events like D&D, award presentation, and other multicam events, personally I think MX70 and Datavideo SE500 or SE800 is also a good choice too.. easy setup, esay operations, anyway for this kind of events we seldom do Chroma keying..

anyway is just my personal preference..
but hmmm.. u maybe rite.. have to try on Edirol before i can commends..

DXNMedia · 17th May 2007

Originally Posted by sundazz

hmmm... not so sure abt the quality since i have not use tat b4..
but for events like D&D, award presentation, and other multicam events, personally I think MX70 and Datavideo SE500 or SE800 is also a good choice too.. easy setup, esay operations, anyway for this kind of events we seldom do Chroma keying..
anyway is just my personal preference..
but hmmm.. u maybe rite.. have to try on Edirol before i can commends..

True lar...but the added function for it is for me to preview realtime on any special effect & chromakey shots during on-location filming. On the spot, I would be able to pin-point any possible lighting issues also.....for the other effects, i usualy get request to do PIPs, probably clients think it's fancy to have two screens in one.

If you try Edirol, i bet you will vormit blood, coz it happened to me as well...felt so frustrated with it, but eventually I got the hang of it.

samvision · 17th May 2007

Originally Posted by sundazz

hmmm... not so sure abt the quality since i have not use tat b4..
but for events like D&D, award presentation, and other multicam events, personally I think MX70 and Datavideo SE500 or SE800 is also a good choice too.. easy setup, esay operations, anyway for this kind of events we seldom do Chroma keying..
anyway is just my personal preference..
but hmmm.. u maybe rite.. have to try on Edirol before i can commends..

How much does a mixer with 3 video input and 1 pc input will cost.
think of getting one for oversea shoot.

sundazz · 17th May 2007

Originally Posted by samvision

How much does a mixer with 3 video input and 1 pc input will cost.
think of getting one for oversea shoot.

it really depends.. an acceptably good set may cos from $2k to $10k or more for a better qualty one.
and u may need a scan converter for pc i/p for some unit.

DXNMedia · 17th May 2007

Sony Anycast have configurable i/o, but that's a tad too expensive, plus there's a lag in the video output.

You're looking at about $1500 onwards for a basic 4ch switcher, and yeah, like what Sundazz mentioned, you typically need scan converter for VGA input into your switcher..

samvision · 18th May 2007

Originally Posted by DXNMedia

Sony Anycast have configurable i/o, but that's a tad too expensive, plus there's a lag in the video output.

You're looking at about $1500 onwards for a basic 4ch switcher, and yeah, like what Sundazz mentioned, you typically need scan converter for VGA input into your switcher..

looking at bugdet set up . Less than 2k will be ideal.

DXNMedia · 20th May 2007

your options will be down to Datavideo SE-500 or the Edirol that I've got...
But on top of that, you still need to buy monitoring system, and a recording deck for long-haul recordings of at least 2-3 hours for those long & draggy events.

sundazz · 21st May 2007

I suggested to get a quards for your mon so u can have 1 mon with 4 split screen display.. and u need another mon for prog out and recording monitoring. not forgetting a scan converter for ur PC and need quite fair bits or cables.. and audio u need a separate mixer feed to your recording deck too.

DXNMedia · 21st May 2007

Originally Posted by sundazz

I suggested to get a quards for your mon so u can have 1 mon with 4 split screen display.. and u need another mon for prog out and recording monitoring. not forgetting a scan converter for ur PC and need quite fair bits or cables.. and audio u need a separate mixer feed to your recording deck too.

Yeah exactly.....and not to forget, a whole bunch of power cords too if it happens that your venue doesn't have power sockets.
The cables are quite a pain to keep after every show!!

Audio i usually tap from the FOH guy if available.

sundazz · 23rd May 2007

hi samvision,
An example of some Back stage Setup for live switching multi video source event that we have done last year...

http://sundazz.multiply.com/photos/album/1

sundazz · 24th May 2007

hi DXNmedia,

is there anyway that u can let me know your rate for providing live switching for multi cam live projection events.. say 2 cams with vision operator? i guess u dont just rent out your video mixer? it goes with operator rite? so i can know what to quote to client when doing any budgeting if to engage your services.

u can PM me if is more convinent..

thx.

DXNMedia · 24th May 2007

Originally Posted by sundazz

hi DXNmedia,

is there anyway that u can let me know your rate for providing live switching for multi cam live projection events.. say 2 cams with vision operator? i guess u dont just rent out your video mixer? it goes with operator rite? so i can know what to quote to client when doing any budgeting if to engage your services.

u can PM me if is more convinent..

thx.

2 operated cams?
1 operated cam + 1 static?
2 static cam?

Prices varies. If static cams, it'll be rather cheap...

I'll setup my cams at the fix locations, and I'll be doing the switching myself.
Will PM you more details.

16th May 2007	#1
sundazz Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: NW-Sg Posts: 648	Live switching. Hi DXNMedia, I have not use that mixer B4, it will be great if i have a chance to experience it. so far we use MX70, datavideo and sony switcher.. I think MX70 and datavideo is good enough, we used it for some big shows. But i find sony is abit troublesome as need blackburst to syn the few cams, and need some calibration, tho no doubt that they are smooth.

16th May 2007	#2
DXNMedia Moderator Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Singapore Posts: 721	Re: Live switching. Well, I've used a range of switchers from the low end Datavideo, Videonics, all the way to the broadcast levels of BTS, Sonys & Grass Valleys. Can't expect much out of the Edirol V4 other than simple switching, mixing, wipes and PIP/ChromaKeying lar....In fact, I was a bit disappointed after using it for a few small scale shows. I see it as a 2ch switcher with a 4 way selector in each output bus....Duh! Unlike other boards, this Edirol only have 2 channels of frame sync, ie if I have effects super up, i need to remove super, then preview to the desired cam, then cut to the cam for the take. Extra steps have to be factored into the process unlike the boards like the Datavideo SE-500. The good point is that the footprint is very small, and the 8bit 4:2:2 video processor gives very solid and crisp image even though my input is composite video..I've scrutinised the other switchers and the output isn't as wonderful even though the specs mentioned that they're using 8bit 4:2:2 processing as well.. You can see evidence of digital processing and aliasing in them. Review compared to other boards of the same price range:- Compact size *** of 5 stars Quality * of 5 stars Built in Effects * of 5 stars Convenience of Live Switching functions of 5 stars At the end of the day, the most important thing is that it gets the job done. __________________ DXNMedia.net Post Production \| Video Acquisition \| Tape Transfers \| Microwave RF Camera Services

16th May 2007	#3
sundazz Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: NW-Sg Posts: 648	Re: Live switching. hmmm... not so sure abt the quality since i have not use tat b4.. but for events like D&D, award presentation, and other multicam events, personally I think MX70 and Datavideo SE500 or SE800 is also a good choice too.. easy setup, esay operations, anyway for this kind of events we seldom do Chroma keying.. anyway is just my personal preference.. but hmmm.. u maybe rite.. have to try on Edirol before i can commends..

17th May 2007	#7
DXNMedia Moderator Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Singapore Posts: 721	Re: Live switching. Sony Anycast have configurable i/o, but that's a tad too expensive, plus there's a lag in the video output. You're looking at about $1500 onwards for a basic 4ch switcher, and yeah, like what Sundazz mentioned, you typically need scan converter for VGA input into your switcher.. __________________ DXNMedia.net Post Production \| Video Acquisition \| Tape Transfers \| Microwave RF Camera Services

20th May 2007	#9
DXNMedia Moderator Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Singapore Posts: 721	Re: Live switching. your options will be down to Datavideo SE-500 or the Edirol that I've got... But on top of that, you still need to buy monitoring system, and a recording deck for long-haul recordings of at least 2-3 hours for those long & draggy events. __________________ DXNMedia.net Post Production \| Video Acquisition \| Tape Transfers \| Microwave RF Camera Services

21st May 2007	#10
sundazz Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: NW-Sg Posts: 648	Re: Live switching. I suggested to get a quards for your mon so u can have 1 mon with 4 split screen display.. and u need another mon for prog out and recording monitoring. not forgetting a scan converter for ur PC and need quite fair bits or cables.. and audio u need a separate mixer feed to your recording deck too. Last edited by sundazz; 21st May 2007 at 10:50 AM.

23rd May 2007	#12
sundazz Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: NW-Sg Posts: 648	Re: Live switching. hi samvision, An example of some Back stage Setup for live switching multi video source event that we have done last year... http://sundazz.multiply.com/photos/album/1 Last edited by sundazz; 24th May 2007 at 12:05 AM.

24th May 2007	#13
sundazz Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: NW-Sg Posts: 648	Re: Live switching. hi DXNmedia, is there anyway that u can let me know your rate for providing live switching for multi cam live projection events.. say 2 cams with vision operator? i guess u dont just rent out your video mixer? it goes with operator rite? so i can know what to quote to client when doing any budgeting if to engage your services. u can PM me if is more convinent.. thx.